One upmanship - root of evil society ?
Discussion
Could this be the reason for our country being in the downward spiral that it seems to be in? Just seems to me that we have become a nation of 'I'm better than you' characters. 
You see it in the workplace when a boss is demanding rediculous things to be done, because he can.
You see it on the road where Mr Knobhead HAS to be infront of you on the motorway, cos he's more important than you and doesn't want to get there after you have.
You see it when the same Mr Knobhead doesn't have to indicate to others because he's in a bigger, more expensive car than they are.
What has caused this character to be more apparent now than he ever was?
You see it in the workplace when a boss is demanding rediculous things to be done, because he can.
You see it on the road where Mr Knobhead HAS to be infront of you on the motorway, cos he's more important than you and doesn't want to get there after you have.
You see it when the same Mr Knobhead doesn't have to indicate to others because he's in a bigger, more expensive car than they are.
What has caused this character to be more apparent now than he ever was?
lazyitus said:
What has caused this character to be more apparent now than he ever was?
perhaps it has always been here but now we are living closer and closer to each other as britain gets ever more densely populated, so we notice it more in others, other factors are bound to be following as this topic is explored :-) but just my two penneth.
birdbrain said:
I think it's got something to do with the fact that over the last 20 years people have actively been encouraged to be selfish and look out for number one and it's got to the point where it's been taken to extremes.
Interesting.
I both agree and vehermently disagree with this statement.
It cannot be argued that since '79 people have become more aware of their own liquidity. However, at no point has any government or the captilist model itself suggested that one should choose self over society.
What I believe has occurred is that there has been a shift somewhere along the line that has allowed the majority of people to believe that they have ability to earn above their league so to speak.
The harsh fact is that we arent all equal and not everyone can prosper greatly. This inequality has by and large been ignored and certaintly within the last 7 years has been dismissed and a replacement myth of equality has been foisted in its place.
This in turn leads the people who are not economically liquid to replace aspiration with envy and we have the situation we are in today.
People no longer think if I work hard I will be rewarded. They think I deserve the reward regardless of work level and that is IMHO a deeply worrying trend.
Plotloss said:
The harsh fact is that we arent all equal and not everyone can prosper greatly. This inequality has by and large been ignored and certaintly within the last 7 years has been dismissed and a replacement myth of equality has been foisted in its place.
This in turn leads the people who are not economically liquid to replace aspiration with envy and we have the situation we are in today.
People no longer think if I work hard I will be rewarded. They think I deserve the reward regardless of work level and that is IMHO a deeply worrying trend.
I would say that people are under the impression that modern western society is a Meritocracy, but the fact of the matter is that sometimes effort is not enough. Sure hard work can help get you up a few steps on the social/economic ladder, but in reality your background and cultural capital becomes more of a hinderance the farther you move. Granted, there are exceptions, but in general a lot of people never will be able to step into that BMW. Sure they're still being rewarded, but perhaps the apple really doesn't fall far from the tree?
I think there is some truth in that.
It's not just material things now. Its competing over the downsizing, being the most environmentally friendly, giving uo the most for lent, going on the strictest diet etc etc etc
I find the traditional form of my car is bigger than yours and my house is massive etc - easier to deal with.
I actually find it much harder to deal with the type of people I read about in the magazines and press...@louise and david moved to this beautiful plot in somerset. They spent hours and hours converting the run down farmhouse.It is done wonderfully to keep the character and the distressed look.
Louise now runs a sucessful fashion/craft business and david is a self-sufficient chef. Louise is a health guru and does yoga a million times a week ....'
GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
It's not just material things now. Its competing over the downsizing, being the most environmentally friendly, giving uo the most for lent, going on the strictest diet etc etc etc
I find the traditional form of my car is bigger than yours and my house is massive etc - easier to deal with.
I actually find it much harder to deal with the type of people I read about in the magazines and press...@louise and david moved to this beautiful plot in somerset. They spent hours and hours converting the run down farmhouse.It is done wonderfully to keep the character and the distressed look.
Louise now runs a sucessful fashion/craft business and david is a self-sufficient chef. Louise is a health guru and does yoga a million times a week ....'
GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
I'm not so sure you know.
Everyone has heard stories of the builder who couldnt write going onto become exceptionally rich.
I even know a chap who earned a fortune in the 70's purely because he had the brawn to carry two hods up a ladder at a time insted of one.
There is money in everything and finding it is not dependant on your social background or even education.
There will be winners and losers in any society. What I feel has gone wrong in ours is that everyone expects to be a winner.
Everyone has heard stories of the builder who couldnt write going onto become exceptionally rich.
I even know a chap who earned a fortune in the 70's purely because he had the brawn to carry two hods up a ladder at a time insted of one.
There is money in everything and finding it is not dependant on your social background or even education.
There will be winners and losers in any society. What I feel has gone wrong in ours is that everyone expects to be a winner.
Good post Matt.
I heard an example of from someone who runs an IT business. He has trouble filling some vacancies since many of the school leavers who apply to him don't want the job unless they can start on £20K plus a company car. This is for unproven teenagers straight from school, and not college.
As a result of this 'I deserve this and must have it now' culture, personal debt has never been higher.
Politicians tell us the economy is in good order but unless I'm missing something, it's being held up by mortgages and personal loans.
I heard an example of from someone who runs an IT business. He has trouble filling some vacancies since many of the school leavers who apply to him don't want the job unless they can start on £20K plus a company car. This is for unproven teenagers straight from school, and not college.
As a result of this 'I deserve this and must have it now' culture, personal debt has never been higher.
Politicians tell us the economy is in good order but unless I'm missing something, it's being held up by mortgages and personal loans.
Plotloss said:
I'm not so sure you know.
Everyone has heard stories of the builder who couldnt write going onto become exceptionally rich.
I even know a chap who earned a fortune in the 70's purely because he had the brawn to carry two hods up a ladder at a time insted of one.
There is money in everything and finding it is not dependant on your social background or even education.
There will be winners and losers in any society. What I feel has gone wrong in ours is that everyone expects to be a winner.
I would argue that you are correct in that people think they automatically deserve to be rewarded, but I don't think that everyone can be successful.
Sure you can live a comfortable life, but you aren't going to have the $800,000.00 home and private education for your kids. We hear the stories about the builders and so on, but what does the average one make? Exceptions to every rule.
People like those stories because it makes them feel like they too can become exceptionally well off, but sometimes the examples in those stories are the result of factors out of their control. Not all of them by any means, but enough.
Anyways, I have to leave now or I'll be late for class. Back in a few hours.
sirtophamhat said:
I would argue that you are correct in that people think they automatically deserve to be rewarded, but I don't think that everyone can be successful.
Sure you can live a comfortable life, but you aren't going to have the $800,000.00 home and private education for your kids. We hear the stories about the builders and so on, but what does the average one make? Exceptions to every rule.
People like those stories because it makes them feel like they too can become exceptionally well off, but sometimes the examples in those stories are the result of factors out of their control. Not all of them by any means, but enough.
Anyways, I have to leave now or I'll be late for class. Back in a few hours.
But should one expect to attain that level of wealth?
One can live perfectly comfortably without a worry in the world at varying levels of income depending on geographic location. This is why I find the culture of envy and this supposed 'rift' between rich and poor [sic] so very difficult to understand.
If you are happy be happy you are happy dont make yourself unhappy because someone else has more. Perhaps thats what makes them happy?
I just dont understand fundamentally.
>> Edited by Plotloss on Tuesday 8th February 15:28
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