Battle between widow and girlfried - help
Discussion
A lady friend of mine has a problem, with the girlfriend of her recently deceased husband. The husband was found dead in his bed last week. When my friend arrived with one of her sons, they found the girlfriend loading everything up into a van. The deceased was probably skint, so this is not a vengeful wife trying to extract the last penny. The issue here, is her three sons would like a few of their father’s personal effects, to remember him by. The girlfriend has left no forwarding address, which really closes off any civil action. The widow has very little money, so cannot afford to employ a tracking agent and the Police say it is a civil matter. I have advised her, to contact the probate office and inform them, that all his effects were removed and therefore, she can’t list his assets for probate purposes and see if they feel, a criminal offence has been committed. Can any of you PH experts suggest, any other legal methods she could use to recover her husbands belongings.
The will would be registered at a solicitors - do you know who that could be?
To be honest, she's in a bad position. Of course if the sons were to find equipment that they had lent their father had also gone missing e.g. power tools, laptop etc, then technically its theft so .......
you get the drift?
To be honest, she's in a bad position. Of course if the sons were to find equipment that they had lent their father had also gone missing e.g. power tools, laptop etc, then technically its theft so .......
you get the drift?
Your friend is going to have to do some digging otherwise there aren't any answers...
Was there a will? Without knowing this your friend can't do anything as she doesn't know that the items have been left to her (under the laws of intestacy) or to the GF under a new will.
Not having a forwarding address isn't a huge problem, there are plenty of ways of tracing people and a decent enquiry agent will do that for not much money at all (I'd imagine less than £200).
Personally I'd find the GF through an enquiry agent and then ask her to produce a will and see what she says.
If the Police have been involved (and presumably the coroner?) they will probably need to trace her anyway for any inquest?
ETA just re-read your first post - no real point her contacting the probabe office without having first established if there is/isn't a will.
Can the sons not stump up for an enquiry agent - I think it will be cheaper than you probably assume it to be.
BTW - try Facebook!
Was there a will? Without knowing this your friend can't do anything as she doesn't know that the items have been left to her (under the laws of intestacy) or to the GF under a new will.
Not having a forwarding address isn't a huge problem, there are plenty of ways of tracing people and a decent enquiry agent will do that for not much money at all (I'd imagine less than £200).
Personally I'd find the GF through an enquiry agent and then ask her to produce a will and see what she says.
If the Police have been involved (and presumably the coroner?) they will probably need to trace her anyway for any inquest?
ETA just re-read your first post - no real point her contacting the probabe office without having first established if there is/isn't a will.
Can the sons not stump up for an enquiry agent - I think it will be cheaper than you probably assume it to be.
BTW - try Facebook!
Edited by Piglet on Thursday 26th February 17:33
Piglet said:
Your friend is going to have to do some digging otherwise there aren't any answers...
Was there a will? Without knowing this your friend can't do anything as she doesn't know that the items have been left to her (under the laws of intestacy) or to the GF under a new will.
Spot on.Was there a will? Without knowing this your friend can't do anything as she doesn't know that the items have been left to her (under the laws of intestacy) or to the GF under a new will.
Assuming it can be established that the girlfriend isn't entitled pursuant to a will, the widow needs to press the police. In my experience, they're generally pretty lazy when it comes to anything that smacks of being a civil dispute - if they can fob you off and tell you that it's a civil matter, it's one less thing for them to worry about.
The widow needs to press the matter and say far from being a civil matter it's a straightforward case of theft. But without clarifying the existence of a will, the police are unlikely to change their position.
The sons ages are between 12 and 19, so I doubt there's anything they would have lent him. He was an infrequent visitor to his wife's home, until about a month before his death. It's strange and rather nice that he started to become friends with the boys before the end. This makes it particularly sad that they have no little mementos to remember him by. Of course I have no idea what he told his GF about his wife. But this isn’t about her, it’s the boys who are in bits and that makes me very angry. They are the innocent parties in this.
The widow is suffering from MS intermediate stage and is unable to work. Two of the boys are at school and the 20 year old has recently become unemployed. So although £200 sounds like not much money to most of us, it is more than they can afford.
The widow is suffering from MS intermediate stage and is unable to work. Two of the boys are at school and the 20 year old has recently become unemployed. So although £200 sounds like not much money to most of us, it is more than they can afford.
Edited by ianash on Thursday 26th February 19:15
Has she been to the probate office to see what they advise? If he has died without a will, then the children have more claim to his estate than the girlfriend.
What's happening with regard to the funeral?
I'd be inclined to call all the local solicitors and briefly explain the circumstances and see if he was a client.
What's happening with regard to the funeral?
I'd be inclined to call all the local solicitors and briefly explain the circumstances and see if he was a client.
If you don't think they will do anything (like press the Police or try to track the GF) I'd try to divert them away from thinking about his "stuff". In all honesty having "stuff" doesn't really help a child deal with the loss of a parent. They have their memories and presumably mother has photographs and the household belongings that the boys have grown up with?
It's up to them really, searching for someone isn't complex, I imagine the elder son can find his way around the internet but if they don't want to then it's best to just let it all go.
Does Mother have any assets that were jointly owned as that might cause some problems?
It's up to them really, searching for someone isn't complex, I imagine the elder son can find his way around the internet but if they don't want to then it's best to just let it all go.
Does Mother have any assets that were jointly owned as that might cause some problems?
ianash said:
The mother has been estranged from the deceased for about 8 years. I doubt there is any joint property. I don't wish to speak ill of the dead, but he never paid maintenance.
I'm not talking about maintenance. It appears that they didn't divorce and mainly in this scenario people don't deal with separating their finances and/or property. It probably doesn't matter but she ought to be aware of any potential problems if there is a will How old was he, is there likely to be any death in service benefit hanging around? Pensions?
Piglet said:
ianash said:
The mother has been estranged from the deceased for about 8 years. I doubt there is any joint property. I don't wish to speak ill of the dead, but he never paid maintenance.
I'm not talking about maintenance. It appears that they didn't divorce and mainly in this scenario people don't deal with separating their finances and/or property. It probably doesn't matter but she ought to be aware of any potential problems if there is a will How old was he, is there likely to be any death in service benefit hanging around? Pensions?
ianash said:
Piglet said:
ianash said:
The mother has been estranged from the deceased for about 8 years. I doubt there is any joint property. I don't wish to speak ill of the dead, but he never paid maintenance.
I'm not talking about maintenance. It appears that they didn't divorce and mainly in this scenario people don't deal with separating their finances and/or property. It probably doesn't matter but she ought to be aware of any potential problems if there is a will How old was he, is there likely to be any death in service benefit hanging around? Pensions?
Either just give it up and encourage them to walk away from it or do the legwork properly without a fistful of assumptions.
Piglet said:
ianash said:
Piglet said:
ianash said:
The mother has been estranged from the deceased for about 8 years. I doubt there is any joint property. I don't wish to speak ill of the dead, but he never paid maintenance.
I'm not talking about maintenance. It appears that they didn't divorce and mainly in this scenario people don't deal with separating their finances and/or property. It probably doesn't matter but she ought to be aware of any potential problems if there is a will How old was he, is there likely to be any death in service benefit hanging around? Pensions?
Either just give it up and encourage them to walk away from it or do the legwork properly without a fistful of assumptions.
ianash said:
Piglet said:
ianash said:
Piglet said:
ianash said:
The mother has been estranged from the deceased for about 8 years. I doubt there is any joint property. I don't wish to speak ill of the dead, but he never paid maintenance.
I'm not talking about maintenance. It appears that they didn't divorce and mainly in this scenario people don't deal with separating their finances and/or property. It probably doesn't matter but she ought to be aware of any potential problems if there is a will How old was he, is there likely to be any death in service benefit hanging around? Pensions?
Either just give it up and encourage them to walk away from it or do the legwork properly without a fistful of assumptions.
I'm giving you good advice whereas you clearly want some kind of magic wand. Unfortunately there isn't one.
My concern is actually with the kids which is why I suggested some posts ago that you think about how they remember their dad.
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