It’s finally happened.

[Jim H]

Something I’ve been dreading for years, 22 to be exact.
I’d just gone out for an absolutely glorious run in my Elise. My day couldn’t have been much better.

A few miles from home I noticed the idle was a bit lumpy. Got it my garage and popped the engine cover. Always do.

All coolant gone out of the expansion tank.

The engine was reading 100 degrees on the dash. So it didn’t get very hot.

Mayonnaise on the the oil dip stick.

It’s deffo HGF, every K series Elise owners, worst nightmare. Any advice on what to do next would be extremely welcome

[johnymac]

This isn't every K series Elise owners nightmare - not by long way.
Inlet manifold gasket failure however, allowing water directly into the cylinders, hydro locking one or more of them, thereby shattering liners, bending conrods and trashing the cylinder head, all instantly and without warning - that my friend is every K series Elise owners nightmare. No £750 fixes here, more like £10k.





Ask me how I know.

[HocusPocus]

Sorry to hear of the head gasket.

I lunched my engine 15 years ago with an aggressive Piper cam and 8000rpm limit. Surprise, the cylinder liners failed. New replacement VVC engine was £1750+VAT, but after all the race engine mods to 220bhp, the tab came to £9500. So hope yours is salvageable.

[Jim H]

Somehow.

It’s reassuring to wake up, and read the last two posts and consider - maybe not as bad as it could have been!

[CanAm]

Jim H said:

Somehow.

It’s reassuring to wake up, and read the last two posts and consider - maybe not as bad as it could have been!

I had this with my Caterham. Fixed by a mechanic who knows his K-series, after a bodged up job by a local garage. It then ran faultlessly for 10 years until I sold it last year.
Make sure its done properly by a specialist and you'll have no problems.

[John D.]

I'd seek advice on SELOC.

[Jim H]

It’s drank about a litre of coolant. Deffo gone into the oil galleries. Hence the mayonnaise on the dip stick. I dunno what to do? I guess the first thing is to drain the oil out it?

I’ve rebuilt engines before. But this one worries me a bit, especially being a K.

[Jim H]

johnymac said:

This isn't every K series Elise owners nightmare - not by long way.
Inlet manifold gasket failure however, allowing water directly into the cylinders, hydro locking one or more of them, thereby shattering liners, bending conrods and trashing the cylinder head, all instantly and without warning - that my friend is every K series Elise owners nightmare. No £750 fixes here, more like £10k.

I must admit, I do enjoy the community spirit of PistonHeads. And thanks for replies.

I’ve awoken with a hangover of significant proportions.
It was an absolute nightmare yesterday. Just the best day ever, and enjoying it. The ultimate high went to a very deep low - rapidly.



Ask me how I know.

[Tickle]

I had it a while ago, was mild-mayo, no excessive engine temp, or notable water loss. Luckily I could drive it to Phoenix Motorsport.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

My advice would be get it trailered to a independent specialist, get a belt (C) service and water pump done whilst it's all off.

Hope it's fixed soon.

[Jim H]

Tickle said:

I had it a while ago, was mild-mayo, no excessive engine temp, or notable water loss. Luckily I could drive it to Phoenix Motorsport.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

My advice would be get it trailered to a independent specialist, get a belt (C) service and water pump done whilst it's all off.

Hope it's fixed soon.

This is exactly what I’m thinking!

Oliver at Phoenix knows his stuff. And right now - I think it would be a wise decision.

[BertBert]

k-head gasket failure on its own isn't the end of the world and there's a lot of expertise out there as it's happened a couple of times over the years.

It'll cost a bit, but if it's just a case of sorting the head with a skim etc, it's not the end of the world.

[MTBMartin]

It's a pretty simple and DIY friendly engine to work on so if you've rebuilt engines before and have the time to do it yourself then that would be a much cheaper and more satifying way to go. If it got very hot, it's possible the head has warped so check the flatness when it's off. Also check the liner heights. I'd suggest using the later multi layer steel gasket. They seem to be more robust - I've never had a problem with them (so far) on modified engines. I also use the lower temp 82degC thermostat with an extra small hole (~3mm). Slightly slower warmup but it prevents any possibility of temperature cycling which is cited as one of several contributory factors to HGF on the K series.

[Jim H]

Bert many thanks indeed.

I really do appreciate the community spirit around here, it’s so valued.

Ok I’ve spoken to Olly at Phoenix and he’s absolutely booked up till the end of June.

I’ve rebuilt my Mk1 Scirocco engine in 1995, it’s still going strong. Same Corrado.

I don’t think this is out of my skill range. I’m going to pull the head of it and go from there.

Jeez it was sickening yesterday. I always knew it could happen, but for 22 years I’d got away with it. I went from cloud nine to the absolute depths in an instant.

These things are a set back, and just that. It’s fixable.

I’m still managing to raise a smile. Some of the earlier posts about catastrophic K failure made me realise.

It’s just a dip in the road. Thanks guys.

[SamG40]

I can't believe its go this far and no one has mentioned upgrades yet! I had HGF a few years ago (scarily it was in 2018) and took the opportunity to send the head to Roger at Sabre heads for his KR1, I've put 633 Piper cams in too and it loves to rev now whilst still behaving nicely. I've just had inlet manifold gasket go and mine thinking it was HGF again and relieved it wasn't. The only negative thing about Rogers heads is that its fairly hard to pin him down on timescale but he wasn't too bad with mine but I did chase him a bit.

I believe re the MLS gasket mentioned above that they are recommended when the liners heights have been checked and they are all bob on tolerance otherwise the MLS can have trouble sealing properly.

[Jim H]

Bert many thanks indeed.

I really do appreciate the community spirit around here, it’s so valued.

Ok I’ve spoken to Olly at Phoenix and he’s absolutely booked up till the end of June.

I’ve rebuilt my Mk1 Scirocco engine in 1995, it’s still going strong. Same Corrado.

I don’t think this is out of my skill range. I’m going to pull the head of it and go from there.

Jeez it was sickening yesterday. I always knew it could happen, but for 22 years I’d got away with it. I went from cloud nine to the absolute depths in an instant.

These things are a set back, and just that. It’s fixable.

I’m still managing to raise a smile. Some of the earlier posts about catastrophic K failure made me realise.

It’s just a dip in the road. Thanks guys.

[sicasey]

I'm considering getting Olly to replace the HG on my S2 111S even without any symptoms of failure.

[Frimley111R]

Blew my Toyota engine up on a hoon, max revs and it ran short of oil. Instant engine death and a £6k bill. And then did it again on track with a £7k bill, so I can absolutely feel your pain. Engine was a supercharged one (after market). Last time I'll modify an engine!

[Belle427]

Another well respected builder that is around here somewhere, i would guess its a fiddly job on the Elise but not too much of a challenge as long as you use all the correct up to date parts.
http://www.dvapower.co.uk/

[Jim H]

Apologies for late reply. I’ve been on holiday the last two weeks, it’s taken my mind off it a little. As you can probably understand, I absolutely love my Elise, when you’ve owned a car 22 years ago - that says it all. I’ve been thinking about it whilst I’ve been away, although not too much. But time and distance do help in these situations.

I requested a parts list from Elise Parts before I came away. All in it came to about £600. Having watched a few YouTube videos, and be fairly capable myself I’m going to have a bash at it. I’m lucky in the respect that one of my best friends is a seriously good mechanic and has taught me a lot over the last 35 years. It’s not my daily so it can get done as and when, with time and patience.

What I am thinking though, is the job would be made a lot easier if I take the rear clam off. Anyone disagree? It doesn’t look that much of a big job, and would give me a lot of access. Then it’s a case of removing the head, and seeing what’s happened. I’ve learned a lot about the significant importance of Liner Height.

If you have any thoughts guys - let me know.

Cheers Jim.

[Jim H]

Afternoon folks.

I mean? How hard can it be? If Matt Armstrong can do this sort of thing on exotica (no disrespect to Matt). It’s not a complicated car - after all!

The strip down begins…





I’ll probably turn this into a thread, it might be a laugh! Unless I find out it’s worse than I thought…