Discussion
Just been to collect my race fuel from Sunoco near Membury just off the M4
What a pleasant company to deal with.
Will see how it compares with VP C16
Having contacted VP to be told no C16 in stock - WTF.
The price has also gone from £80 for 19 litres to £173
So opted for Sunoco at £109 for 25 litres.
The SG is just about the same
My set up is running slighty rich so we will see come midday tomorrow.
What a pleasant company to deal with.
Will see how it compares with VP C16
Having contacted VP to be told no C16 in stock - WTF.
The price has also gone from £80 for 19 litres to £173
So opted for Sunoco at £109 for 25 litres.
The SG is just about the same
My set up is running slighty rich so we will see come midday tomorrow.
redvictor said:
Good luck with it. Chris Impey thought exactly the same.4 engines later......
So you don't rate it then Andy.Will run C16 on Saturday
Maybe drop out some some boost / timing and see what the NosMax does.
I lost a motor owing to the dreaded Det but was running over the odds for 97 pump gas.
Like your motor, you must know George Scanlon then ?
SVTRick said:
redvictor said:
Good luck with it. Chris Impey thought exactly the same.4 engines later......
So you don't rate it then Andy.Will run C16 on Saturday
Maybe drop out some some boost / timing and see what the NosMax does.
I lost a motor owing to the dreaded Det but was running over the odds for 97 pump gas.
Like your motor, you must know George Scanlon then ?
Yes i know George.Say hello to him from me when you see him.
Thanks..
SVTRick said:
Just been to collect my race fuel from Sunoco near Membury just off the M4
What a pleasant company to deal with.
Will see how it compares with VP C16
Having contacted VP to be told no C16 in stock - WTF.
The price has also gone from £80 for 19 litres to £173
So opted for Sunoco at £109 for 25 litres.
The SG is just about the same
My set up is running slighty rich so we will see come midday tomorrow.
What is the difference between the VP C16 and the Sunoco.The VP C16 looks ridiculously expensive? Mind you the Sunoco is FOUR times the price of pump fuel! Are these fuels really worth the money? maybe water injection would be cheaper.What a pleasant company to deal with.
Will see how it compares with VP C16
Having contacted VP to be told no C16 in stock - WTF.
The price has also gone from £80 for 19 litres to £173
So opted for Sunoco at £109 for 25 litres.
The SG is just about the same
My set up is running slighty rich so we will see come midday tomorrow.
Hi Guys. I have to say I agree with Andy as we have been using the Sunoco Max NOS for some time now. Although we have never had any issues with this fuel I was however surprised to learn of it's true motor octane rating when compared to the VP. The Max NOS is advertised as having a rating of 119 octane, but apparantley the actuall 'motor octane rating' is only 113!. I submitted a query to VP recently regarding one of their fuels, and how it compares to the Sunoco Max NOS and this was their reply:
Hello, Craig Gibbs
You submitted:
We are currently using Sunoco MAX NOS Race Fuel, but have been recommended C23 for our nitrous combination. What is the 'mon' number for C23, and what are the advantages of running this fuel over Sunoco MAX NOS? Thanks for your time.
VP Racing Fuels Reply:
The Sunoco Max NOS, is closer to our C-16 than our C-23, the Sunoco fuel has a 113 motor octane and has a .733 specific gravity. Our C-16 has a 117 motor octane and the specific gravity is .735. The C-23 has much more octane at a 120 motor octane but is has a lower specific gravity at .709. The C-23 will definatly give you much more detionation protection than the Sunoco fuel.
I shall let you make your own minds up..............
Hello, Craig Gibbs
You submitted:
We are currently using Sunoco MAX NOS Race Fuel, but have been recommended C23 for our nitrous combination. What is the 'mon' number for C23, and what are the advantages of running this fuel over Sunoco MAX NOS? Thanks for your time.
VP Racing Fuels Reply:
The Sunoco Max NOS, is closer to our C-16 than our C-23, the Sunoco fuel has a 113 motor octane and has a .733 specific gravity. Our C-16 has a 117 motor octane and the specific gravity is .735. The C-23 has much more octane at a 120 motor octane but is has a lower specific gravity at .709. The C-23 will definatly give you much more detionation protection than the Sunoco fuel.
I shall let you make your own minds up..............
Tempted to try VP but both times we have spoken to them in depth we have been royally messed about(3 months waiting for a trial delivery that they promised & in the end never responded to emails) & a further time when "we will call you next week" etc & nothing again so ended up carrying on with Sunoco.
Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
I could be wrong, but having tried to deal with VP in the past they will normally recommend that you deal direct with their suppliers in this country, and aren't so keen to supply direct to individuals, and like you say that's if they call you back. I would speak to Steve Woods at Motorshack, he's been really helpful with our concerns and questions.
Going back to the C16/ Sunoco debate, If I were running a normally aspirated/Turbo or Pro charged combination, I would have a good read up on VP's Q16 which is highly oxygenated, the americans have seen vast improvements whilst using this fuel. Maybe someone using it over here could step forward to let us know their thoughts....no names mentioned.......
As I say we have run Sunoco for the last couple of years and have never had an issue, we get it from Andy Robinson Race Cars, and have always found it very reasonable from a cost point of view.....but when your at the point when every little bit helps, you have to try new things.
Going back to the C16/ Sunoco debate, If I were running a normally aspirated/Turbo or Pro charged combination, I would have a good read up on VP's Q16 which is highly oxygenated, the americans have seen vast improvements whilst using this fuel. Maybe someone using it over here could step forward to let us know their thoughts....no names mentioned.......
As I say we have run Sunoco for the last couple of years and have never had an issue, we get it from Andy Robinson Race Cars, and have always found it very reasonable from a cost point of view.....but when your at the point when every little bit helps, you have to try new things.
trackday addict said:
Tempted to try VP but both times we have spoken to them in depth we have been royally messed about(3 months waiting for a trial delivery that they promised & in the end never responded to emails) & a further time when "we will call you next week" etc & nothing again so ended up carrying on with Sunoco.
Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
It's the same old story with these racing fuel suppliers they just don't seem to want to sell the stuff. Trouble is there is not enough competition and not enough straight forward information about the fuels. it's OK having high octain fuels but some of them don't contain the same amount of energy and you need lots of it to get the same amount of power.Let alone the cost, the VP stuff costs as much as High Test Peroxide? Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
obsession said:
I could be wrong, but having tried to deal with VP in the past they will normally recommend that you deal direct with their suppliers in this country, and aren't so keen to supply direct to individuals, and like you say that's if they call you back. I would speak to Steve Woods at Motorshack, he's been really helpful with our concerns and questions.
Going back to the C16/ Sunoco debate, If I were running a normally aspirated/Turbo or Pro charged combination, I would have a good read up on VP's Q16 which is highly oxygenated, the americans have seen vast improvements whilst using this fuel. Maybe someone using it over here could step forward to let us know their thoughts....no names mentioned.......
As I say we have run Sunoco for the last couple of years and have never had an issue, we get it from Andy Robinson Race Cars, and have always found it very reasonable from a cost point of view.....but when your at the point when every little bit helps, you have to try new things.
LOL...Who is that then Craig?Going back to the C16/ Sunoco debate, If I were running a normally aspirated/Turbo or Pro charged combination, I would have a good read up on VP's Q16 which is highly oxygenated, the americans have seen vast improvements whilst using this fuel. Maybe someone using it over here could step forward to let us know their thoughts....no names mentioned.......
As I say we have run Sunoco for the last couple of years and have never had an issue, we get it from Andy Robinson Race Cars, and have always found it very reasonable from a cost point of view.....but when your at the point when every little bit helps, you have to try new things.
As i mentioned to John before,Q16 is fabulous stuff to use.Just literally pour it in the tank,add 7% in the fuel map and off you go.It'll run to 10.5 afr and still make good power.
We haven't even begun exploring what it will max out at yet because of lack of track time,but come august(if the weather is good) just look out how this thing will go with the Q16!
Anyone who doesn't have a fuel rule would do well to give it a go.Turbo engines in particular love the stuff.
John,speak to Steve.I know the 2 american guys who are in charge of the whole of europe,but as Craig says the americans want to leave it to their dealers to sort things out.Bear in mind Steve is a one man band over here who cannot give fuel away.
I'm sure he'll give you a good deal on some though if you want to try it..
kestral said:
trackday addict said:
Tempted to try VP but both times we have spoken to them in depth we have been royally messed about(3 months waiting for a trial delivery that they promised & in the end never responded to emails) & a further time when "we will call you next week" etc & nothing again so ended up carrying on with Sunoco.
Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
It's the same old story with these racing fuel suppliers they just don't seem to want to sell the stuff. Trouble is there is not enough competition and not enough straight forward information about the fuels. it's OK having high octain fuels but some of them don't contain the same amount of energy and you need lots of it to get the same amount of power.Let alone the cost, the VP stuff costs as much as High Test Peroxide? Has anyone got a contact at VP who responds ??
cheers
LOL... Cheers Andy...I was hoping you were online tonight, Steve actually recommended that we talk to you, as we were thinking of trying it ourselves, but looking at the forums and the websites, no-one has really seen any improvements from using it in a nitrous combination as yet, certainly not to the levels of turbo applications, hence the other route. I agree with everything you've said, and besides with the dollar rate the way it is, and the tough economic times were in, should we not be supporting our own boys anyway.
obsession said:
LOL... Cheers Andy...I was hoping you were online tonight, Steve actually recommended that we talk to you, as we were thinking of trying it ourselves, but looking at the forums and the websites, no-one has really seen any improvements from using it in a nitrous combination as yet, certainly not to the levels of turbo applications, hence the other route. I agree with everything you've said, and besides with the dollar rate the way it is, and the tough economic times were in, should we not be supporting our own boys anyway.
I think on the nitrous side it's the lower temp that doesn't allow the gain seen in turbos.I know QI6 likes 100degf air temp to atomise best. Nitrous air temps get lower than that.I can speak with Jason from VP and see what his thought are for you if you like.I agree 100% about supporting the british guys.I keep seeing people try to do the efforts of british drag racing business's down and often wonder why anyone would do that..
I know what you mean.
Yeah if you could have a word to see what his thoughts are, that would be great. Were hoping to test the VP on the peak performance the friday before so will be interesting to see what difference that makes. I know because obviously nitrous acts as an oxygenator in itself, the nitrous guys in the states have seen greater improvements with the C23 as it is un-oxygenated, than they have the Q16, but would be good to get some feedback from the guys themselves.
Cheers.
Yeah if you could have a word to see what his thoughts are, that would be great. Were hoping to test the VP on the peak performance the friday before so will be interesting to see what difference that makes. I know because obviously nitrous acts as an oxygenator in itself, the nitrous guys in the states have seen greater improvements with the C23 as it is un-oxygenated, than they have the Q16, but would be good to get some feedback from the guys themselves.
Cheers.
obsession said:
I know what you mean.
Yeah if you could have a word to see what his thoughts are, that would be great. Were hoping to test the VP on the peak performance the friday before so will be interesting to see what difference that makes. I know because obviously nitrous acts as an oxygenator in itself, the nitrous guys in the states have seen greater improvements with the C23 as it is un-oxygenated, than they have the Q16, but would be good to get some feedback from the guys themselves.
Cheers.
I'll shoot him a PM for you and see what he says.. I know he's mentioned C23 too but i'll get the scoop directly.Yeah if you could have a word to see what his thoughts are, that would be great. Were hoping to test the VP on the peak performance the friday before so will be interesting to see what difference that makes. I know because obviously nitrous acts as an oxygenator in itself, the nitrous guys in the states have seen greater improvements with the C23 as it is un-oxygenated, than they have the Q16, but would be good to get some feedback from the guys themselves.
Cheers.
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