Where would you put your money?
Discussion
Now that the kids are getting a little older, and finances are becoming a little more "relaxed" I'm looking at turning our spare car into a cheap track toy.
Car in question is a 2000 VW Polo 6n2 GTI.
The car has been sat for a little while, so is as much a learning project for me as it is a way to keep costs down. My first port of call is a good service, a new cambelt and an MOT as it ran out the beginning of the month. I will tackle any issues raised by this first, prior to moving onto track oriented parts.
With that said, I'd like to keep the build relatively cheap for starters, and then I can build upon the base as time goes on.
For now, I'm thinking;
EBC turbo grove discs and Yellowstuff pads (Fronts for £210, rears for £180) - Will I need the rears, or would a suitable OEM equivalent do okay?
Refresh suspension - TA Technix springs + shock combo. I know not ideal, but I do have to keep costs down for now.
Nankang NS-2R 185/60R14 on some spare 14" snowflakes I have laying around. Have some road wheels with some ditch finders on, which will see me to and from the track.
The above will come to just shy of £1000, and then any additional silly bits required that I've missed.
Is this a feasible route, or would I be better of spending money elsewhere? Open to all kinds of input, total newbie here to track days.
Cheers!
Car in question is a 2000 VW Polo 6n2 GTI.
The car has been sat for a little while, so is as much a learning project for me as it is a way to keep costs down. My first port of call is a good service, a new cambelt and an MOT as it ran out the beginning of the month. I will tackle any issues raised by this first, prior to moving onto track oriented parts.
With that said, I'd like to keep the build relatively cheap for starters, and then I can build upon the base as time goes on.
For now, I'm thinking;
EBC turbo grove discs and Yellowstuff pads (Fronts for £210, rears for £180) - Will I need the rears, or would a suitable OEM equivalent do okay?
Refresh suspension - TA Technix springs + shock combo. I know not ideal, but I do have to keep costs down for now.
Nankang NS-2R 185/60R14 on some spare 14" snowflakes I have laying around. Have some road wheels with some ditch finders on, which will see me to and from the track.
The above will come to just shy of £1000, and then any additional silly bits required that I've missed.
Is this a feasible route, or would I be better of spending money elsewhere? Open to all kinds of input, total newbie here to track days.
Cheers!
Better brake pads but standard discs would be my recommendation. Save the money on discs and get pads that are rated to higher temps as if you’re going any sort of pace you’ll cook yellows. I like yellows as road pads but they don’t last so long on track.
Probably wouldn’t bother with the suspension unless you’re going for coilovers. If you lower it you’ll introduce more toe in on the rear axle which will affect turn in.
A rear anti roll bar will make it turn better for much less money.
Probably wouldn’t bother with the suspension unless you’re going for coilovers. If you lower it you’ll introduce more toe in on the rear axle which will affect turn in.
A rear anti roll bar will make it turn better for much less money.
I can't really comment too much on car track days but I can on bike track days which will be somewhat similar.
I'd certainly put some decent rubber the polo, it's the only thing keeping you on the track at the end of the day and I'd be adjusting the pressures accordingly after each session to ensure they are at the optimum pressure - so you'll need a footpump/electronic pump and a decent tyre pressure gauge.
Unless the brakes and suspension are absolutely dire I'd leave as is for now, you haven't done a track day so why spend money on something you may not enjoy or you have no baseline upon. You will personally be on a huge learning curve so having to think about everything else shouldn't be your primary focus.
I'd make sure the car is mechanically sound, you've already mentioned getting it serviced/cambelt etc, then just do a track day.
In bike terms I would always say to anyone who is new to the track to get some instruction, this will hone your skills and understand lines, corner entry/exit braking/trail braking, at some point your skill will outshine the car and that is when you start to think about upgrades. But you are right, tyres, brakes, suspension will give you more than spending a grand and getting a 5bhp increase for example.
I'd certainly put some decent rubber the polo, it's the only thing keeping you on the track at the end of the day and I'd be adjusting the pressures accordingly after each session to ensure they are at the optimum pressure - so you'll need a footpump/electronic pump and a decent tyre pressure gauge.
Unless the brakes and suspension are absolutely dire I'd leave as is for now, you haven't done a track day so why spend money on something you may not enjoy or you have no baseline upon. You will personally be on a huge learning curve so having to think about everything else shouldn't be your primary focus.
I'd make sure the car is mechanically sound, you've already mentioned getting it serviced/cambelt etc, then just do a track day.
In bike terms I would always say to anyone who is new to the track to get some instruction, this will hone your skills and understand lines, corner entry/exit braking/trail braking, at some point your skill will outshine the car and that is when you start to think about upgrades. But you are right, tyres, brakes, suspension will give you more than spending a grand and getting a 5bhp increase for example.
The suspension is getting on a bit on it, and the near side rear shock has blown. Which is why I'm looking for a replacement.
Can get OE matching parts for a similar price to the TA Technix shocks + springs kit, which I'm thinking could potentially be the better option lowering the centre of gravity a smidge, and stiffening it up.
Same thing with the brakes. I'd like the re-assurance of new kit. But I didn't think about mixing OE discs with performance pads. I'd of assumed fade would of come from all three combined, being discs, pads and fluid.
My local tracks are Thruxton and Castle Combe, with Combe being my ideal between the two, as I know Thruxton is a fast circuit.
Can get OE matching parts for a similar price to the TA Technix shocks + springs kit, which I'm thinking could potentially be the better option lowering the centre of gravity a smidge, and stiffening it up.
Same thing with the brakes. I'd like the re-assurance of new kit. But I didn't think about mixing OE discs with performance pads. I'd of assumed fade would of come from all three combined, being discs, pads and fluid.
My local tracks are Thruxton and Castle Combe, with Combe being my ideal between the two, as I know Thruxton is a fast circuit.
Taking on board freakuk’s comments, car brakes do not stand up to track days like bike brakes do. They get hot very quickly and become a bit useless.
Fair comment on the suspension if you already need to replace it. I would buy some camber plates to correct the toe on the rear, they are only cheap.
Fair comment on the suspension if you already need to replace it. I would buy some camber plates to correct the toe on the rear, they are only cheap.
Personally, if you're a complete newbie to trackdays, I'd do very little to the car other than a good service and replace any parts that need replacing (with OE matching stuff). I wouldn't modify it at all, initially. Just get out and actually do a trackday.
If you do like trackdays, then modify areas of weakness. You might find its more fun slinging a car round on low grip tyres, and given its a light car, standard brakes might be perfectly adequate for a while.
If you must mod before you track, then do uprated brake pads and fresh fluid. Standard discs will be just fine.
Will it be a full track car? There will be a decent amount of plastic interior trim that could be removed... Heck could even take out the passenger seat to save a lot of weight.
If you do like trackdays, then modify areas of weakness. You might find its more fun slinging a car round on low grip tyres, and given its a light car, standard brakes might be perfectly adequate for a while.
If you must mod before you track, then do uprated brake pads and fresh fluid. Standard discs will be just fine.
Will it be a full track car? There will be a decent amount of plastic interior trim that could be removed... Heck could even take out the passenger seat to save a lot of weight.
As others have implied I would be going with the following but deliberately keeping costs low until you decide how much you are going to get into it.
Do NOT go EBC on discs/pads you WILL regret it.
If the discs need replacing for the moment go standard good quality discs, don't replace them if they don't need to be replaced, fit a decent mid-range pad like Ferodo DS2500 or Mintex 1144 and go with a spare set of front pads just in case.
IF any suspension parts need replacing go good quality and replace in pairs.
IF you can get a set of cheap wheels get either some track focussed tyres to fit them (you can go lower profile and slightly wider obviously as speedo accuracy is meaningless on track) or a full set of part-worn top quality UHP road tyres.
Stick there for now.
If, however you do have knackered shocks I would err towards researching a half-decent set of coilovers that work for your car.
Do NOT go EBC on discs/pads you WILL regret it.
If the discs need replacing for the moment go standard good quality discs, don't replace them if they don't need to be replaced, fit a decent mid-range pad like Ferodo DS2500 or Mintex 1144 and go with a spare set of front pads just in case.
IF any suspension parts need replacing go good quality and replace in pairs.
IF you can get a set of cheap wheels get either some track focussed tyres to fit them (you can go lower profile and slightly wider obviously as speedo accuracy is meaningless on track) or a full set of part-worn top quality UHP road tyres.
Stick there for now.
If, however you do have knackered shocks I would err towards researching a half-decent set of coilovers that work for your car.
Properly good pads on good standard discs, bled through with best quality fluid. Motul 660/Castrol SRF type stuff. Not cheap though.
As said, don't go anywhere near EBC for the track.
Not DS2500 either, they're road pads which are ok. On the road. Will fade on track, then you're in the wall.
Ferodo DS1.11, DS Uno are far better when hot. When I say better they're miles ahead.
If you're planning on brakes working from speed then you need to spend more on better stuff or use road stuff and just drive gently...
As said, don't go anywhere near EBC for the track.
Not DS2500 either, they're road pads which are ok. On the road. Will fade on track, then you're in the wall.
Ferodo DS1.11, DS Uno are far better when hot. When I say better they're miles ahead.
If you're planning on brakes working from speed then you need to spend more on better stuff or use road stuff and just drive gently...
Thank you all for the feedback!
I keep seeing negative reviews of EBC, so will look elsewhere. I can get Bosch 256mm OE discs for £60ish from Euros, so will match them to some nicer pads. I am struggling on this front though, that no where appears to stock the pads for a 6N2 GTI. Are there other cars that have the same pads? M2/3 golfs etc?
The car will be semi-dedicated towards track work, and is something I will invest into, as it's been a dream of mine to have a track car since I was little. It'd be nice to build it to a spec where it is more suited towards track work, but still have the ability for occasional road use. Although this will be minimal as we have an XC90 for the family work!
I keep seeing negative reviews of EBC, so will look elsewhere. I can get Bosch 256mm OE discs for £60ish from Euros, so will match them to some nicer pads. I am struggling on this front though, that no where appears to stock the pads for a 6N2 GTI. Are there other cars that have the same pads? M2/3 golfs etc?
The car will be semi-dedicated towards track work, and is something I will invest into, as it's been a dream of mine to have a track car since I was little. It'd be nice to build it to a spec where it is more suited towards track work, but still have the ability for occasional road use. Although this will be minimal as we have an XC90 for the family work!
On the subject of brake pads "Matt Lewis Racing" has an ebay shop & a racing supplies online shop, I used him many times before & if you get in touch with him, he will let you know what he can get hold of for your car.
He deals with many of the usual manufacturers of them & is always competitive.
He deals with many of the usual manufacturers of them & is always competitive.
Edited by E-bmw on Friday 29th August 14:00
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