About to go to half wages again...been told i have disabilty
Discussion
Will try to keep this short for you all...basically have no idea about rights/benefits I'm entitled too - am pretty out of it on painkillers so please excuse typos etc.
I've had two back ops in 2.5 years - been off work a lot, dropped to half wages a couple of times for a few months. 2op was in April - felt things were going well, now in loads of pain and can barely walk. These operations have been spinal operations. I go see my specialist on 1st Sept. i decided to speak to my Union - see if they can help - I work in Forensics and have done for the last 14 years - they think I have a disability since the pain/back condition I have will be with me for life. My HR dept and bosses are s
t - really st. They dont tell me if I'm entitled to any benefits or anything - I drop to half wages on Tuesday - 0 wages in Feb next year. On monday I'm seeing an "independant" doc that work are sending me too. My Union rep told me this is their doc who really represents them. I've been in pain for 3 years but never considered myself diabled - according to the defination I do have a disability since I can't do a lot due to my back condition. I asked my HR person about when does the time come to be medically retired - never gave me an answer. I think they are happy to pay me half wages 6 months then sit and do fk all even when I'm at half. According to my Union they should be treating my sickness absence differntly since it falls under the Disability Discrimination Act - I've never calimed anything from any gov agency or any benefit place ever and I'm at a loss what to do. Im out of it - my work dont seem to care and I'm genuinely worried how I'm ever going to work again. I dont even know what Im asking here - Im coming to the end of my tether and cant be arsed with life - Im in agony and dont know what my options are until I see my specialist - my gp doesnt know what to do - he just signs me off and gives me pills. Hes written to the surgeon saying Im fked - so i think i may have another op on the cards - more time off and probably zero wages Im fked and don't know where Im going or what im going to do. When and who decides when you can no longer do your job and pension you off? I have a pension scheme through work and have contributed for the 14 years Ive been there - i know nothing about the benefits system. i dont know if any of you guys are able to offer help - its made me feel a bit better jsut typing all this out.Anyway - hope it makes sense.
Barry
Firstly why would your HR dept tell you about benefits, they will have no idea so don't take it out on them, secondly it takes a doctor to say you have a disability not a union rep so until a doctor says you are ignore the union.
If you are declared disabled by this new doc you can claim for disability living allowance, again this has nothing to do with your HR dept. There is a care component if you cannot look after yourself and a mobility component if you have difficulty walking.
If you think being declared disabled will enable you to stay off work on full pay you are mistaken and your union rep is talking bks.
Hope your back is better soon.
ETA http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/DisabledPeople/Employm...
If you are declared disabled by this new doc you can claim for disability living allowance, again this has nothing to do with your HR dept. There is a care component if you cannot look after yourself and a mobility component if you have difficulty walking.
If you think being declared disabled will enable you to stay off work on full pay you are mistaken and your union rep is talking b
ks.Hope your back is better soon.
ETA http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/DisabledPeople/Employm...
Edited by Sheets Tabuer on Saturday 21st August 12:58
Unfortunately HR depts are not state benefits experts. It is up to you to sort out. Most payroll depts will be clues up enough to get you an ssp1 so you can claim incapacity bens if your ssp has expired.
As for medical/I'll health retirement then again this occurs so infrequently that even most company pension depts scratch their heads let alone the HR team. You need to find out what the eligibility criteria are from either your HR. Dept or pensions dept. Your annual pension statement must have contact details. Don't underestimate the red tape that may surround the pension. You'll likely need 2 med reports at the time of application. 3rd party OH co, surgeon, GP should suffice. It would also be useful to have such reports during the course of your condition to show it's longevity and any changes in your condition. Good luck.
As for medical/I'll health retirement then again this occurs so infrequently that even most company pension depts scratch their heads let alone the HR team. You need to find out what the eligibility criteria are from either your HR. Dept or pensions dept. Your annual pension statement must have contact details. Don't underestimate the red tape that may surround the pension. You'll likely need 2 med reports at the time of application. 3rd party OH co, surgeon, GP should suffice. It would also be useful to have such reports during the course of your condition to show it's longevity and any changes in your condition. Good luck.
My advice is that you should go to your local Citizen's Advice Bureau, tell them of the issues you're facing and seek their advice. You'll find them pretty good on employment, disability issues etc. Take with you as much documentation as you can regarding your terms and conditions of employment, details of the employer's sick pay plans for employees who are absent from work, pension scheme booklet etc.
They should be able to help you with the State disabilty benefits.
They may also discuss potential early retirement on grounds of ill health too. In this case you need to be very careful about the documents that govern the pension scheme because they will set out what criteria you will need to meet, whether or not the benefit is discretionary, how the benefits will be calculated etc. Be aware that sickness absence etc are grounds for an employer terminating a contract of employment by giving notice as per the contract. Also note that just because they may terminate employment on sickeness grounds this does not mean that you'll get the ill health pension: the latter will have a different set of criteria.
If you go to your local CAB, report back here and if appropriate I'll advise you further if I can.
R.
They should be able to help you with the State disabilty benefits.
They may also discuss potential early retirement on grounds of ill health too. In this case you need to be very careful about the documents that govern the pension scheme because they will set out what criteria you will need to meet, whether or not the benefit is discretionary, how the benefits will be calculated etc. Be aware that sickness absence etc are grounds for an employer terminating a contract of employment by giving notice as per the contract. Also note that just because they may terminate employment on sickeness grounds this does not mean that you'll get the ill health pension: the latter will have a different set of criteria.
If you go to your local CAB, report back here and if appropriate I'll advise you further if I can.
R.
Firstly - you have a pretty good employer if you get 6 months on half pay, there is no right in law to anything but SSP when you are off work through illness and that is £79.15 a week. So if your employment contract gives you 6 months at half pay that is pretty good.
As far as your employer is concerned there really isn't much they can do, you need to be finding out what benefits you can get from the state. The DDA isn't greatly relevant to you, that prevents you being discriminated against when disabled, but if you are unable to work you aren't being discriminated against.
Medical Retirement isn't an employer thing either, your pension scheme may provide for it, in which case it is the people who run your pension scheme that you need to be talking to.
As far as your employer is concerned there really isn't much they can do, you need to be finding out what benefits you can get from the state. The DDA isn't greatly relevant to you, that prevents you being discriminated against when disabled, but if you are unable to work you aren't being discriminated against.
Medical Retirement isn't an employer thing either, your pension scheme may provide for it, in which case it is the people who run your pension scheme that you need to be talking to.
Just a comment on siscar's final para.
Pension scheme early retirement is usually very much an employer thing: often the pension scheme rules require the employer to give consent to ill health early retirement which in effect means getting the benefit is at the discretion of the employer. The only way to sort out rights, expectations, responsibilities etc is to look at the rules of the specific scheme.
R.
Pension scheme early retirement is usually very much an employer thing: often the pension scheme rules require the employer to give consent to ill health early retirement which in effect means getting the benefit is at the discretion of the employer. The only way to sort out rights, expectations, responsibilities etc is to look at the rules of the specific scheme.
R.
Personally I'd be lighting fires under my union head office - looks like the local bod is as much use as a choc fire-guard . You pay union dues -you EXPECT to get the BEST help available - start SHOUTING at the Union head office , most have sickness/disability specialists to look after disabled members and their rights . Ask about their legal schemes for help ,about help you might expect.I'd suggest you've been asking - TIME YOU STARTED SHOUTING AT HEAD OFFICE .
Thanks for all the words of wisdom - reading back I don't think I put myself and my situatin across very well.Occasionally on these pills I have days when everything seems dark and the world is against me - I know thats not the case. I'm off to see an their independant doc tomorrow - my own gp on Tuesday - then my surgeon on 1st Sept. My main worry is I can't keep living like this - tryin to get into work - get back, then the pain is too bad and I have to leave again. Failed ops sont help - its takes months to get MRI's/consultations - last time I paid for these privately to try speed things up-didn't do much good. My surgeon's communication skills are crap to say the least. I've struggled to even walk properly for 3 years and have refused to accept that my condition is long term.
I will contact CAB i think and see what they say and contact/look at my pension scheme - its a local govenment thing and is generally pretty good. I hope people here havent got the wrong impression. I want to work and I think my eagerness to get back has actually made things worse-not accpeting a longer phased return in the past, things like that. I enjoy what I do and hate sitting at home - I've never claimed anything in my life and don't really want to.
Thanks to all who have offered advice.
Cheers
Barry
ETA - Thanks for link i appreciate all the advice given - thank you.
I will contact CAB i think and see what they say and contact/look at my pension scheme - its a local govenment thing and is generally pretty good. I hope people here havent got the wrong impression. I want to work and I think my eagerness to get back has actually made things worse-not accpeting a longer phased return in the past, things like that. I enjoy what I do and hate sitting at home - I've never claimed anything in my life and don't really want to.
Thanks to all who have offered advice.
Cheers
Barry
ETA - Thanks for link i appreciate all the advice given - thank you.
Edited by Craphouserat on Sunday 22 August 12:31
It's good you mentioned that you are employed by a local government organisation because I can give you some more information.
Almost all local government employers, and some other employing public bodies, all belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS). I have significant experience in matters relating to the LGPS, quite a bit relating to failed applications made by employees/members for ill health early retirment pension benefits and the inevitable formal complaint that then arises. I do work for free through an independent organisation dealing with complaints about pensions.
You can, in fact, access all the LGPS regulations online here:
timeline.lge.gov.uk
The regulations are complicated and it's important you find the right set of regulations that are applicable at the time of you seeking a benefit etc. Good luck if you use this site, and get back to me if you have difficulty.
R.
Almost all local government employers, and some other employing public bodies, all belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS). I have significant experience in matters relating to the LGPS, quite a bit relating to failed applications made by employees/members for ill health early retirment pension benefits and the inevitable formal complaint that then arises. I do work for free through an independent organisation dealing with complaints about pensions.
You can, in fact, access all the LGPS regulations online here:
timeline.lge.gov.uk
The regulations are complicated and it's important you find the right set of regulations that are applicable at the time of you seeking a benefit etc. Good luck if you use this site, and get back to me if you have difficulty.
R.
The Leaper said:
It's good you mentioned that you are employed by a local government organisation because I can give you some more information.
Almost all local government employers, and some other employing public bodies, all belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS). I have significant experience in matters relating to the LGPS, quite a bit relating to failed applications made by employees/members for ill health early retirment pension benefits and the inevitable formal complaint that then arises. I do work for free through an independent organisation dealing with complaints about pensions.
You can, in fact, access all the LGPS regulations online here:
timeline.lge.gov.uk
The regulations are complicated and it's important you find the right set of regulations that are applicable at the time of you seeking a benefit etc. Good luck if you use this site, and get back to me if you have difficulty.
R.
Thanks very much for that - and all your help. I will see how things go with docs etc - I want to keep working at doing what I do, but for my own good I have to look at all options.Almost all local government employers, and some other employing public bodies, all belong to the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS). I have significant experience in matters relating to the LGPS, quite a bit relating to failed applications made by employees/members for ill health early retirment pension benefits and the inevitable formal complaint that then arises. I do work for free through an independent organisation dealing with complaints about pensions.
You can, in fact, access all the LGPS regulations online here:
timeline.lge.gov.uk
The regulations are complicated and it's important you find the right set of regulations that are applicable at the time of you seeking a benefit etc. Good luck if you use this site, and get back to me if you have difficulty.
R.
Again - thank you very much - if I need to I will contact you.
All the best
Barry.
Craphouserat said:
Thanks for all the words of wisdom - reading back I don't think I put myself and my situatin across very well.Occasionally on these pills I have days when everything seems dark and the world is against me - I know thats not the case. I'm off to see an their independant doc tomorrow - my own gp on Tuesday - then my surgeon on 1st Sept. My main worry is I can't keep living like this - tryin to get into work - get back, then the pain is too bad and I have to leave again. Failed ops sont help - its takes months to get MRI's/consultations - last time I paid for these privately to try speed things up-didn't do much good. My surgeon's communication skills are crap to say the least. I've struggled to even walk properly for 3 years and have refused to accept that my condition is long term.
<snip>
It's good to see that you are in better form.<snip>
For most of the last 25 years I have had back pain(slipped disc). I despaired that it would ever go away. Then a couple of years ago, I used a TENS machine(£39.00) for about six weeks and I haven't had much problems since.
Your back problems sound more severe than mine, but things can improve. So, good luck!
On the employment front, sadly, I am in agreement with other people on this thread. Your employer doesn't have to pay you if you are unable to work. Also, there is no reason why they should be expert on the benefits system.
Don
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I would ask your HR team in writing what arrangements they have for long term disablement, if they don't reply then you can raise an official grievance.
One of my old employers life assurance schemes came with a permanent disablement policy attached, which if it was proven your disablement is permanent gave 3 times salary as a lump sum payment, we did use the policy as I helped the person involved through the process, his was a degenerative back problem.
One of my old employers life assurance schemes came with a permanent disablement policy attached, which if it was proven your disablement is permanent gave 3 times salary as a lump sum payment, we did use the policy as I helped the person involved through the process, his was a degenerative back problem.
Thanks again for the replies - I am and have been concerned that my condition is degenerative - this has not been confirmed. As i said before my surgeon's communication is crap - when I vist on the 1st Sept for my follow up appt - 5 months after op !! I guarantee I see one of his team. The only time,apart from right after op when i was out of it on morphine, i have spoken with him is when Ive paid £1200 for two consulatations and an MRI at the pvt hosp he works at. He said degenerative disc problems PROBABLY weren't the case.
Anyway - see works doc later - don't go to follow up (which should be six weeks - not 5 months) till 1st - thats when i hope to get answers on what to do next. I know they will tell me to give it time - but I dont have time, Im getting worse. I will pay for consyultations with another specialist and another MRI if I have to final answers - cant wait on the NHS anymore.
As for TENS - trust me - I've tried that and everything pill/treatment - list is endless - i could go on and on. Sometimes I want to chuck myself under a bus im so fed up of it all.
Thanks for all replies
Anyway - see works doc later - don't go to follow up (which should be six weeks - not 5 months) till 1st - thats when i hope to get answers on what to do next. I know they will tell me to give it time - but I dont have time, Im getting worse. I will pay for consyultations with another specialist and another MRI if I have to final answers - cant wait on the NHS anymore.
As for TENS - trust me - I've tried that and everything pill/treatment - list is endless - i could go on and on. Sometimes I want to chuck myself under a bus im so fed up of it all.
Thanks for all replies
I should have mentioned this at start of thread - the people who employ me and my colleagues amalgamted all forensic services in Scotalnd 3 yrs ago. Wont go into anything too much for rear of legal issues. basically we are in limbo with t+cs our union is in negotiations with all 8 previous employers of forensic services (police forces) - so we have staff on different t+c's - all very difficult and makes issues such as mine even more complicated - not entirely sure how legal it all is. I could say a lot more - but cant/wont - basically in limbo at moment and that came from my rep.
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