CS - Future classic?
Discussion
I am looking at getting a porker next but I am very tempted to buy another CS.
I have noticed they have held their values very well with the manual ones over the 20k mark.
I know the CSL very well and it will always appreciate but with the limited numbers on the CS will they continue to rise?
Chris Harris rates the CS/CSL and loves the E46 in general so surely everyone will start to keep hold of the good ones.
I have noticed they have held their values very well with the manual ones over the 20k mark.
I know the CSL very well and it will always appreciate but with the limited numbers on the CS will they continue to rise?
Chris Harris rates the CS/CSL and loves the E46 in general so surely everyone will start to keep hold of the good ones.
I'm a huge fan of the CS and Mr Harris, but I'm afraid it'll never be a 'classic' no matter how much he talks it up (unless he replaces Clarkson and does a Top Gear segment on the CS!).
They'll always command more money than a standard M3; perhaps a 2k premium is the current ceiling for me, rising to 3k tops (current money) in future. Certainly that's the most premium I'd pay, if I was looking at buying a very low mileage manual replacement for my high miles SMG car and it was sat next to an otherwise identical 'standard' M3.
Over a standard car, the CS gives you (a) more grip due to larger wheels/tyres, (b) bigger front brakes, (c) alcantara wheel/gear selector, (d) track mode, (e) quicker steering and (f) CSL style wheels (albeit different parts in reality - the CSL wheels are wider at the front - 8.5J not 8J - and lighter, I believe). If you really really want any of the above, all of it can be purchased from BMW and added to a standard M3 without too much fuss (except 'e', which is a bit trickier).
By contrast, you need a CSL's V5C in order to purchase genuine CSL wheels, airbox, stripped-down interior parts, SMG control unit (which is more aggressive than the M3 or CS's, I understand), bumpers, boot lid, etc. Add to that the low production numbers of the CSL versus how many have been tracked.....and you begin to see why low miles minters are worth so much. It's made of pure 'unobtainium' for poor people like me, unable to afford Hexagon prices!
They'll always command more money than a standard M3; perhaps a 2k premium is the current ceiling for me, rising to 3k tops (current money) in future. Certainly that's the most premium I'd pay, if I was looking at buying a very low mileage manual replacement for my high miles SMG car and it was sat next to an otherwise identical 'standard' M3.
Over a standard car, the CS gives you (a) more grip due to larger wheels/tyres, (b) bigger front brakes, (c) alcantara wheel/gear selector, (d) track mode, (e) quicker steering and (f) CSL style wheels (albeit different parts in reality - the CSL wheels are wider at the front - 8.5J not 8J - and lighter, I believe). If you really really want any of the above, all of it can be purchased from BMW and added to a standard M3 without too much fuss (except 'e', which is a bit trickier).
By contrast, you need a CSL's V5C in order to purchase genuine CSL wheels, airbox, stripped-down interior parts, SMG control unit (which is more aggressive than the M3 or CS's, I understand), bumpers, boot lid, etc. Add to that the low production numbers of the CSL versus how many have been tracked.....and you begin to see why low miles minters are worth so much. It's made of pure 'unobtainium' for poor people like me, unable to afford Hexagon prices!
A manual IB CS would, in many respects, be my perfect car to keep forever.
I had an SMG IB car a few years back and I'm fairly confident it's still the best all-rounder I've owned. I'll always remember driving it down to Spain for a holiday and it performing its remarkable split-personality trick of being an economical, comfortable cruiser in one breath and a tail-out hooligan around twisting mountain roads the next.
The incremental changes over the standard e46 M3 all add up to a product that feels greater than the sum of its parts.
So I'd gladly vote for it being a future classic. It'll always be in the shadow of the CSL, but the special editions and the limited editions always carry a premium over the standard models.
A great car. I ended up with a 1M earlier this year in large part because I couldn't find a low-ish mileage spanish IB CS despite months of looking,
If you get the chance, do it!
I had an SMG IB car a few years back and I'm fairly confident it's still the best all-rounder I've owned. I'll always remember driving it down to Spain for a holiday and it performing its remarkable split-personality trick of being an economical, comfortable cruiser in one breath and a tail-out hooligan around twisting mountain roads the next.
The incremental changes over the standard e46 M3 all add up to a product that feels greater than the sum of its parts.
So I'd gladly vote for it being a future classic. It'll always be in the shadow of the CSL, but the special editions and the limited editions always carry a premium over the standard models.
A great car. I ended up with a 1M earlier this year in large part because I couldn't find a low-ish mileage spanish IB CS despite months of looking,
If you get the chance, do it!
Welshbeef said:
There cars are far too modern and made in far too high numbers.
As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
How is 275 "far too high numbers"?As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
Gruber said:
How is 275 "far too high numbers"?
Same logic how come the B5 RS4 isn't rocketing in price....? That's the top of the range, the B5 S4 is what similar to the CS in the respect of not top of the range. Either way but it like any car if you want one but don't expect appreciation - IF and that's a huge if plus long time frame then that would be a nice problem to have.... Though I guess people buying them to use as cars and not garage queens will not see the increase as miles will be what 150k plus by then and less desirable.
Welshbeef said:
Same logic how come the B5 RS4 isn't rocketing in price....? That's the top of the range, the B5 S4 is what similar to the CS in the respect of not top of the range.
Either way but it like any car if you want one but don't expect appreciation - IF and that's a huge if plus long time frame then that would be a nice problem to have.... Though I guess people buying them to use as cars and not garage queens will not see the increase as miles will be what 150k plus by then and less desirable.
I really have no idea how your post follows mine with the "same logic".Either way but it like any car if you want one but don't expect appreciation - IF and that's a huge if plus long time frame then that would be a nice problem to have.... Though I guess people buying them to use as cars and not garage queens will not see the increase as miles will be what 150k plus by then and less desirable.
1. No-one said they're rocketing in price. But good B5 RS4s and good e46 M3s are rising - even more so the CS.
2. The RS4 is generally regarded as the Audi "equivalent" to the standard contemporary M3 at any point in time, so I'm unclear how the CS only manages to achieve parity with the B5 S4.
3. The CS was produced 2005-6, meaning it was sold alongside the B7 RS4 and not the B5 (which went out of production 5 years earlier).
4. The B5 RS4 is almost certainly a future classic, just as the RS2 has proved to be already.
5. I've never heard anyone sensible define "future classics" by whether they're currently "rocketing in price".
So I really don't have a clue what you're on about. Sorry.
Welshbeef said:
There cars are far too modern and made in far too high numbers.
As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
I have no idea what you are mean?As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
There are only about 58 IB manual CS left in the country?
skillimz said:
Welshbeef said:
There cars are far too modern and made in far too high numbers.
As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
I have no idea what you are mean?As such if you like it but it and enjoy it. If you keep it for 30 years and maybe do 100miles a year max to keep miles down and cacoon it and BMW OEM service only then maybe.
There are only about 58 IB manual CS left in the country?
Who knows when how harsh the crash/correction will be but provided you've aware happy days. I always buy cars as they are the cars I want - if any of them would have gone up that would be a nice issue but given I use my cars as daily drivers there is little to no chance of ever getting on the gravy train
E46 M3 CS with BMW Manual Gearbox will be a future classic. IMO.
The next best thing to E46 M3 CSL.
The ultimate (factory) Manual E46 M3.
For the driver who wants sharper more focused dynamics than the regular M3 and the option of manual.
The e46 m3 CS is the ultimate all round E46 M3 and had great reviews by all the magazines.
RWD
LSD
High revving NA engine
All the required traits to be a "proper" BMW M car.
Award winning engine winner of the International Engine of the Year Award 3 - 4 litre category in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006. Thus, even beating the likes of Porsche and Ferrari.
Handsome classic BMW shape
Driver focused or driver centric interior
IMO future classic.
Although I could be wrong.
The next best thing to E46 M3 CSL.
The ultimate (factory) Manual E46 M3.
For the driver who wants sharper more focused dynamics than the regular M3 and the option of manual.
The e46 m3 CS is the ultimate all round E46 M3 and had great reviews by all the magazines.
RWD
LSD
High revving NA engine
All the required traits to be a "proper" BMW M car.
Award winning engine winner of the International Engine of the Year Award 3 - 4 litre category in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006. Thus, even beating the likes of Porsche and Ferrari.
Handsome classic BMW shape
Driver focused or driver centric interior
IMO future classic.
Although I could be wrong.
161BMW said:
E46 M3 CS with BMW Manual Gearbox will be a future classic. IMO.
The next best thing to E46 M3 CSL.
The ultimate (factory) Manual E46 M3.
For the driver who wants sharper more focused dynamics than the regular M3 and the option of manual.
The e46 m3 CS is the ultimate all round E46 M3 and had great reviews by all the magazines.
RWD
LSD
High revving NA engine
All the required traits to be a "proper" BMW M car.
Award winning engine winner of the International Engine of the Year Award 3 - 4 litre category in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006. Thus, even beating the likes of Porsche and Ferrari.
Handsome classic BMW shape
Driver focused or driver centric interior
IMO future classic.
Although I could be wrong.
What engine did Ferrari make in the 3-4ltr range? We're the F430 Scuderia simply a few cc over the 4ltr and therefore not qualify?The next best thing to E46 M3 CSL.
The ultimate (factory) Manual E46 M3.
For the driver who wants sharper more focused dynamics than the regular M3 and the option of manual.
The e46 m3 CS is the ultimate all round E46 M3 and had great reviews by all the magazines.
RWD
LSD
High revving NA engine
All the required traits to be a "proper" BMW M car.
Award winning engine winner of the International Engine of the Year Award 3 - 4 litre category in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006. Thus, even beating the likes of Porsche and Ferrari.
Handsome classic BMW shape
Driver focused or driver centric interior
IMO future classic.
Although I could be wrong.
Moot point
That said I utterly love driving the I6 E46 M3 engine ringing it's neck out is a lot of fun
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