The Seiko Pogue - in 2020
Discussion
I'm been digging into the Pogue for a few years now and really enjoy the size, weight and history of the watch. The various "buyers guides" that were posted on watch forums and on The Spring Bar were a great starting point for learning, but are all a bit out of date as more and more minutiae comes to be understood.
I've written a bit on the SCWF forum and posted the same content to my blog as well.
I bought half a dozen Pogues through the year, including a couple of "grails" - yellow PROOFs - and a couple of American market blue-dial watches.
I finally got a birth month/year watch; I was hoping for a yellow PROOF so presumed that wo]uld be a 6139-6000 but ended up finding one which was an early 6139-6001, identical to the 6000 except it doesn't have a notch case.
I decided to record a nerd's guide video to the Pogue - enjoy if you like that kind of thing.
Happy 2021!
I've written a bit on the SCWF forum and posted the same content to my blog as well.
I bought half a dozen Pogues through the year, including a couple of "grails" - yellow PROOFs - and a couple of American market blue-dial watches.
I finally got a birth month/year watch; I was hoping for a yellow PROOF so presumed that wo]uld be a 6139-6000 but ended up finding one which was an early 6139-6001, identical to the 6000 except it doesn't have a notch case.
I decided to record a nerd's guide video to the Pogue - enjoy if you like that kind of thing.
Happy 2021!
Edited by ewand on Thursday 31st December 22:42
Excellent, I am watching now thanks.
As I have previously mentioned on the main Seiko thread I bought my 08/71 without doing my due diligence and it turns out to have had a replacement bezel and dial, however I didn't pay top money and I like the watch.
Ideally I'd like a June '70 and sell mine for whatever it would fetch. Hopefully with your guide I will be able to find something original.
As I have previously mentioned on the main Seiko thread I bought my 08/71 without doing my due diligence and it turns out to have had a replacement bezel and dial, however I didn't pay top money and I like the watch.
Ideally I'd like a June '70 and sell mine for whatever it would fetch. Hopefully with your guide I will be able to find something original.
My parents bought me a yellow pogue for my 18th birthday in '77, my brother was given a Silver one too in '74 (Which Duncan has refurbished beautifully)
I wore my original everyday and then it slowly deteriorated, got left in a draw then sadly lost during a house move. I've had a few yellow ones, damaging one which the insurers sent to Goldsmiths who of course could not repair
and passing another on to my Son, I've currently a Yellow, Silver and Blue (didn't know the blue were American market only)
I wore my original everyday and then it slowly deteriorated, got left in a draw then sadly lost during a house move. I've had a few yellow ones, damaging one which the insurers sent to Goldsmiths who of course could not repair
and passing another on to my Son, I've currently a Yellow, Silver and Blue (didn't know the blue were American market only)Oh, the Blue wasn't restricted to Americas only.
Both yellow and blue dials were available in 6139-6000 (JDM "Speed-Timer" and export WATER 70M PROOF) and the -6009 (US version of the 6000 model, with notch case and 6139A movement, but with 70M RESIST on the dial and only SEIKO AUTOMATIC, not SEIKO CHRONOGRAPH AUTOMATIC).
The mainstream export market 6139-6002 with a 70m RESIST (note lower case m) dial, and also widely available in blue and yellow, and the US version was 6005 (same SEIKO AUTOMATIC). Pogue's own was a Sept 71 639-6005.
The silvers are a bit more esoteric - initially the 70M PROOFs were thought to have been made as a special order for the HK / Singapore dealer, so they all have Chinese/English day wheels. The later silvers with 70m RESIST dials mostly have Roman/English wheels - none of them appear in any Seiko catalogue so it's possible they were all special order in some way.
The transition between the early 6000/6009 and the mainstream 6002/6005 that throws up other anomalies. In July 1970, the main export market 6000 was replaced with the 6001, still showing WATER 70M PROOF on the dial but in a non-notched case. Between September and October, the dials moved to 70m RESIST and then the 6001 gave way to the 6002 in early 1971.
The transition from American-market 6009 to 6005 threw up the 6007, believed to have been for Latin Americas, and that was only available in blue, and produced for only a few months. There's no apparent visual difference between the 6007 and 6005; I have a July 71 blue 6005 and a a Jan 71 blue 6007, with the only apparent difference being that the 6002 is a 6139B movement while the 6007 was 6139A.
Both yellow and blue dials were available in 6139-6000 (JDM "Speed-Timer" and export WATER 70M PROOF) and the -6009 (US version of the 6000 model, with notch case and 6139A movement, but with 70M RESIST on the dial and only SEIKO AUTOMATIC, not SEIKO CHRONOGRAPH AUTOMATIC).
The mainstream export market 6139-6002 with a 70m RESIST (note lower case m) dial, and also widely available in blue and yellow, and the US version was 6005 (same SEIKO AUTOMATIC). Pogue's own was a Sept 71 639-6005.
The silvers are a bit more esoteric - initially the 70M PROOFs were thought to have been made as a special order for the HK / Singapore dealer, so they all have Chinese/English day wheels. The later silvers with 70m RESIST dials mostly have Roman/English wheels - none of them appear in any Seiko catalogue so it's possible they were all special order in some way.
The transition between the early 6000/6009 and the mainstream 6002/6005 that throws up other anomalies. In July 1970, the main export market 6000 was replaced with the 6001, still showing WATER 70M PROOF on the dial but in a non-notched case. Between September and October, the dials moved to 70m RESIST and then the 6001 gave way to the 6002 in early 1971.
The transition from American-market 6009 to 6005 threw up the 6007, believed to have been for Latin Americas, and that was only available in blue, and produced for only a few months. There's no apparent visual difference between the 6007 and 6005; I have a July 71 blue 6005 and a a Jan 71 blue 6007, with the only apparent difference being that the 6002 is a 6139B movement while the 6007 was 6139A.
thanks - I tend to prefer PROOF or RESIST dials just because they're a known age / era and they tend to be more collectible, but there's an argument that a no-text dial looks cleaner and less busy. Whatever floats your boat basically.
I can strongly recommend Uncle Seiko bracelets if anyone who's got a Pogue on an aftermarket bracelet or a strap. Lots of the eBay watches come with aftermarket junk bracelets, with a tell-tale of having much taller letters on the SEIKO logo on the clasp - the O being round, whereas the real ones are quite squashed and the O looks oval
I can strongly recommend Uncle Seiko bracelets if anyone who's got a Pogue on an aftermarket bracelet or a strap. Lots of the eBay watches come with aftermarket junk bracelets, with a tell-tale of having much taller letters on the SEIKO logo on the clasp - the O being round, whereas the real ones are quite squashed and the O looks oval
Nice one, that looks spot on - really original and the dial is in great shape.
A lot of people recommend Duncan / The Watch Bloke - https://thewatchbloke.co.uk/2015/03/25/another-day... - though he's typically very busy so could take months to turn it around; the 6139 movement is not rocket science but I think you'd want to find a watchmaker who has experience of them, and Duncan certainly has plenty of that. Others worth talking to could be Rich Askham - http://thewatchspotblog.com/, or "Sir Alan" on the Seiko watch forums.
You should expect to pay about £300 depending on what the watch needs (it could be a decent slice if very worn internally, but we're not talking Rolex Service Centre money here).
A lot of people recommend Duncan / The Watch Bloke - https://thewatchbloke.co.uk/2015/03/25/another-day... - though he's typically very busy so could take months to turn it around; the 6139 movement is not rocket science but I think you'd want to find a watchmaker who has experience of them, and Duncan certainly has plenty of that. Others worth talking to could be Rich Askham - http://thewatchspotblog.com/, or "Sir Alan" on the Seiko watch forums.
You should expect to pay about £300 depending on what the watch needs (it could be a decent slice if very worn internally, but we're not talking Rolex Service Centre money here).
Looking back over what's come and gone in the last year, here's a smattering of the others I picked up during 2020:
A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
then a rare bird indeed, a Latin American (?) 6139-6007 from Jan 1971
(the 6007 was only made for a few months and was only ever in blue)
A Feb 1970 PROOF T-dial:
A June 1973 no-text R-dial that's quite nice and quite distinctly different from the flatter, yellow T-dials:
and to complete the colour set, a May 1972 silver R-dial:
A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
then a rare bird indeed, a Latin American (?) 6139-6007 from Jan 1971
(the 6007 was only made for a few months and was only ever in blue)
A Feb 1970 PROOF T-dial:
A June 1973 no-text R-dial that's quite nice and quite distinctly different from the flatter, yellow T-dials:
and to complete the colour set, a May 1972 silver R-dial:
ewand said:
Looking back over what's come and gone in the last year, here's a smattering of the others I picked up during 2020:
A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
Why does it say "6139-6009" on the dial?A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
ewand said:
then a rare bird indeed, a Latin American (?) 6139-6007 from Jan 1971
So does that.Sorry to jump in but.....
My Omega is at this moment with Genesis Watch Repairs.
Being sorted by Duncan.
Is it the same Duncan as The Watch Man?
Wearing my 6309 Cushion with 7548 quartz conversation while its away!
Thanks.
Don't let the word Automatic fool you!
My Omega is at this moment with Genesis Watch Repairs.
Being sorted by Duncan.
Is it the same Duncan as The Watch Man?
Wearing my 6309 Cushion with 7548 quartz conversation while its away!
Thanks.
Edited by mickyh7 on Wednesday 6th January 12:36
Don't let the word Automatic fool you!
Edited by mickyh7 on Wednesday 6th January 12:39
Edited by mickyh7 on Wednesday 6th January 12:40
I have just had a Seiko serviced by Wiltshire watches
I went up there to have one watch sorted and ended up leaving one there to see if it could get going again. I didn't think he would be able to as it was a 70's watch, and as far as i know never been serviced
He used to be a Rolex service man, but loves Seiko's. Maybe worth having a look at his web site and a call .
Very friendly, and best of all my old one is going well
I went up there to have one watch sorted and ended up leaving one there to see if it could get going again. I didn't think he would be able to as it was a 70's watch, and as far as i know never been serviced
He used to be a Rolex service man, but loves Seiko's. Maybe worth having a look at his web site and a call .
Very friendly, and best of all my old one is going well
Doofus said:
ewand said:
Looking back over what's come and gone in the last year, here's a smattering of the others I picked up during 2020:
A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
Why does it say "6139-6009" on the dial?A US-model 6139-6005 from July 1971
ewand said:
then a rare bird indeed, a Latin American (?) 6139-6007 from Jan 1971
So does that.Ditto, the export 6000, 6001 and 6002 - they all had 6030 dials.
ewand said:
The dial codes and case references are often different on Seikos. The original 6139-600x in the US was ref -6009 and the dial code matched, and the JDM version had dial ref 6000. The export market one had a different dial layout to both the 6009 and JDM 6000, and its dial code was 6030. The dial layout stayed the same in the Americas between the 6009, 6007 and 6005 case ref, but the dial code stayed 6009.
Ditto, the export 6000, 6001 and 6002 - they all had 6030 dials.
Blimey.Ditto, the export 6000, 6001 and 6002 - they all had 6030 dials.
So how do you know what you've actualy got? If the dial and case match, then it's most likely a wrong 'un?
Pictures of mine, as said I'm sure they're a bit frankenstein
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