Sending Watch to EU - VAT Post-Brexit

[theclutch]

Hi All,

A bit of a strange one that I wonder if anyone has any information on.

I am trying to sell my Tudor GMT to Chronext. Before the 31st this was all fine with an offer agreed. However, I didn't end up posting the watch before the deadline and now the offer has been reduced to account for VAT in Germany due to Brexit. I'm not sure i fully understand the reasoning behind this as the watch is a second hand item.

Fine I thought, i'll post the watch to a friend in Germany and have them collect the watch from them. However, on the way to the DHL drop point i suddenly thought that VAT may then be chargeable to my friend in Germany on arrival.

Is this the case? It's as second hand item (all be it unworn with stickers) posted from a private individual in the UK to a private individual in the EU.

Can anyone shed any light?

[n3il123]

Wrap it in happy birthday paper and send it to your friend as a "present"?

[hilly10]

n3il123 said:

Wrap it in happy birthday paper and send it to your friend as a "present"?

Will still be subject to German texes

[Dominic H]

OP. Yes your parcel will be liable for VAT upon delivery in Germany. We are now out of the Customs Union, so a parcel into Germany from the UK will be treated the same way as a parcel from the US. Similarly any UK buyer of an EU watch will be liable for VAT upon delivery into the UK.

Bugger...

[Danm1les]

Not worth now selling in the U.K.? What were they paying?

[Dammit]

Dominic H said:

OP. Yes your parcel will be liable for VAT upon delivery in Germany. We are now out of the Customs Union, so a parcel into Germany from the UK will be treated the same way as a parcel from the US. Similarly any UK buyer of an EU watch will be liable for VAT upon delivery into the UK.

Bugger...

This man speaks the truth. Your German buyer is going to have to pay German VAT (19%) on the value of the watch that you declare/insure, plus the cost of the shipping.

[fridaypassion]

This is the bit where you realise you should have voted remain. Utter pain in the arse that will have a very detrimental effect on anyone that does a bit of buying and selling!

[jackliebling]

Yes, us "remoaners" have been harping on about this sort of thing for years, but we were accused of being Project Fear.

Now it's Project Reality...

[21st Century Man]

This is on second hand goods though, new goods are sold duty/vat free for export and then duty/vat is paid upon import, regardless of direction of travel.

The dumb thing is that duty/vat has to be paid on second hand stuff, which would have already had it paid at point of origin when new in the first place. It seems wrong/unfair to me.

There was a similar thread about a used saucepan.

I've had just the same with bits and bobs sent to me by my son, which I've not even paid for, he's bought them for me and isn't expecting me to reimburse him, so they're a gift, but I'm still having to pay duty/vat on their supposed value.

The Brexit thing, whilst true, is overstated, it has no effect on the economy other than a revenue win in the country where the goods arrive. It's just the same with stuff from Japan, the US, wherever, whether it comes to the UK, or Germany.

I don't think the market in exporting car boot sale second hand saucepans is going to crash, it's just the seller cant knock the vat off, it's Doris flogging a used saucepan. But on a Rolex, it's a big deal.

Edited by 21st Century Man on Thursday 14th January 22:52

[jackliebling]

WRT watches, Brexit will have an impact I suspect. Especially on the second hand market. The whole European market for second hand watches just became a lot more expensive for us, so I think the supply will be limited here and therefore prices will rise...

[21st Century Man]

Ditto used/classic cars.

Although I bought a car in from Japan, so it makes no difference on that score. Level playing field in some ways.

Edited by 21st Century Man on Thursday 14th January 23:17

[21st Century Man]

jackliebling said:

WRT watches, Brexit will have an impact I suspect. Especially on the second hand market. The whole European market for second hand watches just became a lot more expensive for us, so I think the supply will be limited here and therefore prices will rise...

Unless one were to pick up a used watch whilst on holiday/business in Europe? It's highly unlikely that a used item would get picked up by customs on return, athough you're still no better off than before Brexit.

With a new purchase however, there's now potential to be much better off post Brexit, no need to go long haul, just pop across the channel. Not that anyone would do such a thing of course.

[RicksAlfas]

It's weird that VAT is being applied to used items isn't it?

I understand on new stuff, and for an exporter of new watches from the UK to the EU it should make their products more attractive as they will be selling less UK VAT. The recipient's local VAT will be added on arrival.

[21st Century Man]

I think the whole principle of applying a sales/purchase tax to a second hand goods transaction is wrong, especially so between private individuals. I'm surprised the WTO hasn't got onto it as it seems all countries do it, although I suppose it's outside of their remit as it's not a duty or trade tariff, it's vat.

Edited by 21st Century Man on Friday 15th January 11:14

[z4RRSchris]

i had to pay VAT on a cycling jersey the other day, that was made in china, imported into the UK, then taken to france, then sent back to UK.

so its had VAT on it twice now, once as new and once second hand.

don't think the gov knows how to sort this really.

[fridaypassion]

I suspect this anomaly will be subject to a bit of deal tweaking over the coming months/years. We will no doubt just begin a slow process of reintegration with the EU now.

[liner33]

I'm clearly the only one who doesn't have an issue with this. Rubbish from China/Singapore was often so cheap simply because it bypassed vat , purchases in the EU were always subject to tax anyhow.

To be honest the more VAT that HMRC can obtain on goods imported from overseas the better surely, better in our pocket than Germany's

[fridaypassion]

In what parallel universe does Chinese stuff not have VAT applied?

[jackliebling]

fridaypassion said:

In what parallel universe does Chinese stuff not have VAT applied?

Re the cycling Jersey posted back from France. If it were used, i.e. You wore it on holiday, forgot it in the hotel and had it posted back to you, I suspect it could be considered worthless. Is there a minimum value, below which there is no import duty? I remember it used to be £17.50 or something like that...

[jackliebling]

fridaypassion said:

I suspect this anomaly will be subject to a bit of deal tweaking over the coming months/years. We will no doubt just begin a slow process of reintegration with the EU now.

This surely was the point behind being in or out of the customs union. It was decided for us that we must be out of it. Knock on effect is we have to deal with customs. I can't see this being changed unless we just rejoin.

Don't forget all the future trade with Papua New Guinea and twelve more Dover Sole in our fishing nets will make this whole st show worth it