So, then: expensive watches....
Discussion
What it is, actually, with expensive watches?
I don't mean something that costs £1,000-3,000. I mean the ones that cost £10k-plus retail, or 'command' significant premia on the grey market, or that you have to grease up your 'AD' by taking him/her out for a candlelit dinner to get on their list.
The thing is, in all meaningful ways, you can only interact passively with a watch. It's not like dropping serious wedge on a car, or a guitar, or even audio or cinema kit. You can't actually 'experience' even the most complicated complication because it's hidden and you cannot influence its operation. And in all likelihood (a cliche, I know), a £30 Casio will keep better time. A £300 Casio will also tell better time at 200m depth, for the real heroes amongst us.
So, what's the appeal, beyond the pose of it as jewellery? If that's it, then I totally get it. But any suggestion that it's because of the engineering is, to me, a bit questionable. Unless you can really experience crafmanship (the examples above, or good wine/food, musicianship, art, etc etc) I don't really get why you'd invest in antiquated technology, except as exactly that - an investment.
I'm not trolling. It's a genuine question, coming from someone who owns about 40 watches, including a £2k Panerai, £500 Tag, £100 Omega (secondhand, battered, but v cool), three fake Rolexes, and a ton of 80's Seikos, Casio's and other random oddities.
Please try to keep it interesting, I'm not looking to start a bar fight, I'm genuinely perplexed
I don't mean something that costs £1,000-3,000. I mean the ones that cost £10k-plus retail, or 'command' significant premia on the grey market, or that you have to grease up your 'AD' by taking him/her out for a candlelit dinner to get on their list.
The thing is, in all meaningful ways, you can only interact passively with a watch. It's not like dropping serious wedge on a car, or a guitar, or even audio or cinema kit. You can't actually 'experience' even the most complicated complication because it's hidden and you cannot influence its operation. And in all likelihood (a cliche, I know), a £30 Casio will keep better time. A £300 Casio will also tell better time at 200m depth, for the real heroes amongst us.
So, what's the appeal, beyond the pose of it as jewellery? If that's it, then I totally get it. But any suggestion that it's because of the engineering is, to me, a bit questionable. Unless you can really experience crafmanship (the examples above, or good wine/food, musicianship, art, etc etc) I don't really get why you'd invest in antiquated technology, except as exactly that - an investment.
I'm not trolling. It's a genuine question, coming from someone who owns about 40 watches, including a £2k Panerai, £500 Tag, £100 Omega (secondhand, battered, but v cool), three fake Rolexes, and a ton of 80's Seikos, Casio's and other random oddities.
Please try to keep it interesting, I'm not looking to start a bar fight, I'm genuinely perplexed
fesuvious said:
There are people on here who will think you're mental having a £2k panerai.
What's the point of a £2k watch?
Answer that,
I bought it, retail, about 25 years ago, as a pure pose. No point denying it. I was young, single, flush with cash. I certainly didn't buy it for the craftsmanship and I wouldn't dream of spending a fraction of that on a watch these days. What's the point of a £2k watch?
Answer that,
That's my point I guess. I can't think of any other real motivation for buying an expensive watch (and granted, £2k is still a lot of wedge).
ETA.. X1/9, Carlton and Esprit in your chariot list... Kudos!
Edited by redrabbit on Monday 27th September 21:10
I don't own any expensive watches on that definition, but for those who do own them I would think that it's a combination of appreciating the aesthetics of the watch itself, perhaps having an affiliation with the history of the brand or model of watch in question, and perhaps some genuine 'watch nerdiness' and enthusiasm in a good way regarding its engineering, complications etc.
Plus in some cases a large dollop of peacockery and status-signalling.
It's probably the only real jewellery (or similar) that many males would adorn themselves with.
Plus in some cases a large dollop of peacockery and status-signalling.
It's probably the only real jewellery (or similar) that many males would adorn themselves with.
redrabbit said:
I bought it, retail, about 25 years ago, as a pure pose. No point denying it. I was young, single, flush with cash. I certainly didn't buy it for the craftsmanship and I wouldn't dream of spending a fraction of that on a watch these days.
That's my point I guess. I can't think of any other real motivation for buying an expensive watch (and granted, £2k is still a lot of wedge).
Might be worth £20k now so might have answered your own question That's my point I guess. I can't think of any other real motivation for buying an expensive watch (and granted, £2k is still a lot of wedge).
jules_s said:
redrabbit said:
I bought it, retail, about 25 years ago, as a pure pose. No point denying it. I was young, single, flush with cash. I certainly didn't buy it for the craftsmanship and I wouldn't dream of spending a fraction of that on a watch these days.
That's my point I guess. I can't think of any other real motivation for buying an expensive watch (and granted, £2k is still a lot of wedge).
Might be worth £20k now so might have answered your own question That's my point I guess. I can't think of any other real motivation for buying an expensive watch (and granted, £2k is still a lot of wedge).
It’s a great question imo and one I have asked of myself many times. I have never bought a proper high-end watch but I have bought a few that made me feel ‘uncomfortable’ (for want of a better word) about the expense, not in terms of affordability but in terms of the ‘value for money’; if I am totally honest, I’ll admit to feeling a certain guilt and questioning my motivation for such an outlay.
But at the end of the day it comes down to beauty for me. Cheap watches just don’t look nice and if I can manage to have beautifully designed objects in my life, I am willing to pay. If someone made a stunning cheap quartz watch I’d be delighted to buy it but there are no such things. Does that make watches jewellery for me. Yes, I suppose it does.
But at the end of the day it comes down to beauty for me. Cheap watches just don’t look nice and if I can manage to have beautifully designed objects in my life, I am willing to pay. If someone made a stunning cheap quartz watch I’d be delighted to buy it but there are no such things. Does that make watches jewellery for me. Yes, I suppose it does.
Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 27th September 21:31
Because as the 1% get ever-wealthier, they want more expensive trinkets or to out-do their peers.
For example, 20 years ago the idea of a car being valued in the tens of millions would've seemed ludicrous. Now there are frequently new cars launched that are well into 7 or 8 figures - a Rolls Royce Boat Tail is the thick end of £20,000,000... It's clearly not worth that, but the fact there'll only be a handful of them means you're buying something someone else - even with serious wealth - can't.
For example, 20 years ago the idea of a car being valued in the tens of millions would've seemed ludicrous. Now there are frequently new cars launched that are well into 7 or 8 figures - a Rolls Royce Boat Tail is the thick end of £20,000,000... It's clearly not worth that, but the fact there'll only be a handful of them means you're buying something someone else - even with serious wealth - can't.
Sliding scale of wealth maybe?
Like the OP I have, (what I consider to be), a substantial collection of nice / respectable watches, many of which were used bargains. The most expensive of which was high £3ks.
With a family and many more financial commitments now compared to when I bought that watch, I couldn’t afford to buy another.
For a guy who takes home a comfortable six figures pa, maybe spending £20k on a watch isn’t that much of a big deal, especially if he gets back 60% of that when he sells it five years later. Maybe for those who are comfortably wealthy, they enjoy the chase, the jumping through hoops to obtain the almost unobtainable?
Someone further up the page commented something along the lines of ‘what’s the point in buying a £2000 watch when a £20 watch does the same thing?’
I can understand such a point. When you think about it logically, chronology is a foolish hobby that defies all reason. If I were to try and argue about admiring the brand, the history or the micro-engineering, it all soon sounds a bit poncy. It doesn’t stop me indulging though
Like the OP I have, (what I consider to be), a substantial collection of nice / respectable watches, many of which were used bargains. The most expensive of which was high £3ks.
With a family and many more financial commitments now compared to when I bought that watch, I couldn’t afford to buy another.
For a guy who takes home a comfortable six figures pa, maybe spending £20k on a watch isn’t that much of a big deal, especially if he gets back 60% of that when he sells it five years later. Maybe for those who are comfortably wealthy, they enjoy the chase, the jumping through hoops to obtain the almost unobtainable?
Someone further up the page commented something along the lines of ‘what’s the point in buying a £2000 watch when a £20 watch does the same thing?’
I can understand such a point. When you think about it logically, chronology is a foolish hobby that defies all reason. If I were to try and argue about admiring the brand, the history or the micro-engineering, it all soon sounds a bit poncy. It doesn’t stop me indulging though
Hang On said:
Funk said:
Because as the 1% get ever-wealthier, they want more expensive trinkets or to out-do their peers.
Or perhaps not everybody is a a
hole and maybe, just maybe, people buy things they enjoy. Why does it have anything to do with outdoing others?redrabbit said:
What it is, actually, with expensive watches?
I don't mean something that costs £1,000-3,000. I mean the ones that cost £10k-plus retail, or 'command' significant premia on the grey market, or that you have to grease up your 'AD' by taking him/her out for a candlelit dinner to get on their list.
The thing is, in all meaningful ways, you can only interact passively with a watch. It's not like dropping serious wedge on a car, or a guitar, or even audio or cinema kit. You can't actually 'experience' even the most complicated complication because it's hidden and you cannot influence its operation. And in all likelihood (a cliche, I know), a £30 Casio will keep better time. A £300 Casio will also tell better time at 200m depth, for the real heroes amongst us.
So, what's the appeal, beyond the pose of it as jewellery? If that's it, then I totally get it. But any suggestion that it's because of the engineering is, to me, a bit questionable. Unless you can really experience crafmanship (the examples above, or good wine/food, musicianship, art, etc etc) I don't really get why you'd invest in antiquated technology, except as exactly that - an investment.
I'm not trolling. It's a genuine question, coming from someone who owns about 40 watches, including a £2k Panerai, £500 Tag, £100 Omega (secondhand, battered, but v cool), three fake Rolexes, and a ton of 80's Seikos, Casio's and other random oddities.
Please try to keep it interesting, I'm not looking to start a bar fight, I'm genuinely perplexed
Ultimately there is no point in having them. But...I don't mean something that costs £1,000-3,000. I mean the ones that cost £10k-plus retail, or 'command' significant premia on the grey market, or that you have to grease up your 'AD' by taking him/her out for a candlelit dinner to get on their list.
The thing is, in all meaningful ways, you can only interact passively with a watch. It's not like dropping serious wedge on a car, or a guitar, or even audio or cinema kit. You can't actually 'experience' even the most complicated complication because it's hidden and you cannot influence its operation. And in all likelihood (a cliche, I know), a £30 Casio will keep better time. A £300 Casio will also tell better time at 200m depth, for the real heroes amongst us.
So, what's the appeal, beyond the pose of it as jewellery? If that's it, then I totally get it. But any suggestion that it's because of the engineering is, to me, a bit questionable. Unless you can really experience crafmanship (the examples above, or good wine/food, musicianship, art, etc etc) I don't really get why you'd invest in antiquated technology, except as exactly that - an investment.
I'm not trolling. It's a genuine question, coming from someone who owns about 40 watches, including a £2k Panerai, £500 Tag, £100 Omega (secondhand, battered, but v cool), three fake Rolexes, and a ton of 80's Seikos, Casio's and other random oddities.
Please try to keep it interesting, I'm not looking to start a bar fight, I'm genuinely perplexed
I personally see no point in having a fake watch of any kind, and I have had a couple. They aren't the real thing so you're going for just the look but you always know it isn't real. Even with the best fakes, you still get that slight sense of cheating by not having the real thing, even if everyone thinks it is real you always know. I am not a flashy person but have a nice watch for my own sense of achievement. Don't give a damn if anyone notices or not. The fake watch has all the downsides of expensive watch ownership (people assuming you're flashy) but none of the upsides (never thought I'd have enough spare cash to buy one in my life etc).
witten said:
Ultimately there is no point in having them. But...
I personally see no point in having a fake watch of any kind, and I have had a couple. They aren't the real thing so you're going for just the look but you always know it isn't real. Even with the best fakes, you still get that slight sense of cheating by not having the real thing, even if everyone thinks it is real you always know. I am not a flashy person but have a nice watch for my own sense of achievement. Don't give a damn if anyone notices or not. The fake watch has all the downsides of expensive watch ownership (people assuming you're flashy) but none of the upsides (never thought I'd have enough spare cash to buy one in my life etc).
You can let him off I think - he's got a pre-Vendome Panerai (and doesn't realise it)I personally see no point in having a fake watch of any kind, and I have had a couple. They aren't the real thing so you're going for just the look but you always know it isn't real. Even with the best fakes, you still get that slight sense of cheating by not having the real thing, even if everyone thinks it is real you always know. I am not a flashy person but have a nice watch for my own sense of achievement. Don't give a damn if anyone notices or not. The fake watch has all the downsides of expensive watch ownership (people assuming you're flashy) but none of the upsides (never thought I'd have enough spare cash to buy one in my life etc).
Either that or he's on a wind up - no pun intended
redrabbit said:
Steady on. No-one called anyone an Asshole. It's not a bar fight.
And, of course, accusing anybody who buys an expensive watch of having done so purely to out-do others is not remotely aggressive. Think I’ll bow out at this point because my point of view on this topic seems not to fit the prescribed narrative.Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 27th September 22:00
witten said:
Ultimately there is no point in having them. But...
I personally see no point in having a fake watch of any kind, and I have had a couple. They aren't the real thing so you're going for just the look but you always know it isn't real. Even with the best fakes, you still get that slight sense of cheating by not having the real thing, even if everyone thinks it is real you always know. I am not a flashy person but have a nice watch for my own sense of achievement. Don't give a damn if anyone notices or not. The fake watch has all the downsides of expensive watch ownership (people assuming you're flashy) but none of the upsides (never thought I'd have enough spare cash to buy one in my life etc).
You're right about fakes. My excuse is I was pissed when I bought them. They are all actually quite pretty decent for £100 each (bought for the looks, and well...pissed, as above). But only the Milgauss is remotely convincing and only wear it in the house or out with my equally tramp-like mates.I personally see no point in having a fake watch of any kind, and I have had a couple. They aren't the real thing so you're going for just the look but you always know it isn't real. Even with the best fakes, you still get that slight sense of cheating by not having the real thing, even if everyone thinks it is real you always know. I am not a flashy person but have a nice watch for my own sense of achievement. Don't give a damn if anyone notices or not. The fake watch has all the downsides of expensive watch ownership (people assuming you're flashy) but none of the upsides (never thought I'd have enough spare cash to buy one in my life etc).
Having said that, they all keep very good time and seem well made.
redrabbit said:
Hang On said:
Funk said:
Because as the 1% get ever-wealthier, they want more expensive trinkets or to out-do their peers.
Or perhaps not everybody is a ahole and maybe, just maybe, people buy things they enjoy. Why does it have anything to do with outdoing others?"So, how shall we price this then? £2m...?"
"Ooh I know - stick another zero on it, see if they blink..!"
Is a PP worth £5m? Not in any real sane terms, clearly - £5m is a shedload of money to most people. Yet some have the means to spend that, perhaps with no more thought given to it than I gave buying my Garmin 6X Pro Solar.
There's of course a massive middle ground and a sliding scale; I don't earn a fortune and my most expensive watch is worth around £4.5k. Would I ever spend £20k on a watch? Highly unlikely, even if I won the lottery.
I'm not being rude to wealthy people (certainly not calling them 'a
holes'!) but it wouldn't be a surprise that the people with the means to buy £1m watches probably have no idea what they're buying or why, other than £+ = best. Also I'd far rather wealthy people spent their money on things - it goes back into the economy paying commissions, taxes etc. I don't begrudge them at all.Hang On said:
redrabbit said:
Steady on. No-one called anyone an Asshole. It's not a bar fight.
And, of course, accusing anybody who buys an expensive watch of having done so purely to out-do others is not remotely aggressive. Think I’ll bow out at this point because my point of view on this topic seems not to fit the prescribed narrative.Edited by Funk on Monday 27th September 22:19
Just paid £10.5k for an 18 month old sub date LN. I have wanted one for a while. Went in to local AD and the laughed and more or less told me to feck off.
Not looking to flip etc. just a watch I wanted for a few years.
It’s my 50th soon and I looked at getting one. I bought a 300m Omega for my 40th. No hassle just walked in an bought it.
My wife was so disappointed with the attitude in our local AD (as wasI) never really being a massive watch enthusiast, so thought I could walk in and buy a watch that I liked.
TBH I have a watch I love and I know I paid over the odds for it but it will be passed down the family, so I’m happy with it.
Not looking to flip etc. just a watch I wanted for a few years.
It’s my 50th soon and I looked at getting one. I bought a 300m Omega for my 40th. No hassle just walked in an bought it.
My wife was so disappointed with the attitude in our local AD (as wasI) never really being a massive watch enthusiast, so thought I could walk in and buy a watch that I liked.
TBH I have a watch I love and I know I paid over the odds for it but it will be passed down the family, so I’m happy with it.
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