Any vintage audiophiles need new amp. Pioneer A400?

[wildoliver]

I appreciate this post will be frustrating to any real audiophiles as I'm both trying to save money and use older components, 2 things that aren't necessarily going to be compatible with audio perfection, but I am realistic and I'm not after audio perfection, just something that sounds nice and has some punch with a decent tonal range.

I've always had an ok separates system bought for me by my Dad when I was circa 16, it was a load of technics separates and a pair of technics bookshelf speakers, while nothing special it speaks volumes of their quality that 20 years later (they were used when I got them too) I still have them all and am still using the CD and Amp and they all still work even after several house moves and being in and out of storage.

Anyway before this thread needs a TLDR.

So I'm in the process of slowly upgrading my gear, I'm not interested in going and buying new for some reason I like the soul of old equipment plus I genuinely can't justify throwing a couple of grand down at richer sounds.

I picked up a pretty nice record deck, it's no Linn but it's plenty enough for the very occasional use it gets with me.

I then picked up a couple of pairs of old Kef speakers, I always wanted some Kefs and managed to pick these up fairly cheaply. I know they aren't anything special but they do sound nice and I like them. They are:

Kef Cantor 3 and Kef Carina 2

http://www.kef.com/uploads/files/en/museum_pdf/80s...

http://www.kef.com/uploads/files/en/museum_pdf/80s...

Now the downside is it feels like my old amp is now struggling to drive them, I have a Technics SU-V300 Amp, details below.

https://www.hifiengine.com/manual_library/technics...

The sound that's coming out feels like when you turn it up it's just struggling to drive the speakers, just to offer some assistance the music I generally listen to is a bit of old rock (G+R/Credence Clearwater Revival/Stones etc.) and some Trance/house music.

I've been considering a vintage Pioneer A400 as it should be a substantial improvement, I'll be honest my ideal would be a Pioneer SA-9800 or similar as I'm a sucker for Fluro displays but it will just be out of budget quite substantially.

So if anyones still reading! The TLDR is will a Pioneer A400 be a good match for those speakers? If not (or even if so) does anyone have a better suggestion?

[TonyRPH]

You don't state which turntable you have (and which pickup cartridge) which would be useful to know.

Also - have you got the turntable plugged into the correct input on the amp? (Should be in the input marked Phono).

The Technics is 30W per channel (not a bad amp - a bit down on power) - the Pioneer 60W per channel.

Have you got your speakers wired in the correct polarity, and are they in phase?

The Technics amp is not that bad IIRC - I suspect apart from the power difference, the Pioneer may add a little more clarity.

[crmcatee]

The A400 is a cracking amplifier. I've got one in the loft which I've used with various speakers - Royd Conistons, Linn Keilidhs etc.

Never tried the phono stage on it though. It's a proper amp (one with an earth lead on the cable).

[wildoliver]

Sorry I should have made it clear, I'm very rarely using the turntable, most of the music is CD but actually most (and I can feel the recoil of horror) is just sound output from my old macbook playing MP3s. I know I'm not getting the best start my intention long term is to find a better digital source of music, but even though I'll be losing some quality it's not the cause for the lack of power I'm suffering.

[crmcatee]

If you're going to put garbage in in the first place, you're only going to get louder garbage out.

For what you're doing the a400 is more than capable of driving those KEFs

[wildoliver]

Thanks while a totally predictable response that has answered the question!

Would anyone mind following on with advice on a good source of a digital music library? I use the old laptop as it's convenient and handy to have an entire music collection to hand, ideally I'd like some sort of box that can be connected up and deliver decent quality source to the amp, but still allow me to hold most of my music on a hard disc and scroll through. Does a sensibly priced option exist? Does any priced option exist or is any compression of the files a bad thing full stop? Or should I get a unicorn hair power cable for my amp

[Crackie]

Imho, competent digital sources have killed the 'front end bias' promoted by Linn etc in the 70's, 80s and 90s. Some audiophiles will cringe but I'm currently using a £65.00 class D amp to drive a pair of Impulse H2 horn speakers. If these speakers we're still available today their retail price would be 100 x the amps price.

There is plenty of evidence that shows that many listeners can't tell the difference between 320kbps MP3 files and 44.1k red book CD and there's there is plenty of evidence to show the vast majority also can't consistently identify differences between amps.

wildoliver .......It may be worth investigating one of these fed with a competent source feeding the best speakers your budget can stretch to http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/bantam_gold_e.html / http://hifipig.com/temple-audio-bantam-gold-integr...

These might be of interest too http://matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm

http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2017/07/happy-ac...

Edited by Crackie on Thursday 3rd August 19:31

[anonymous-user]

Crackie said:

There is plenty of evidence to show the vast majority can't consistently identify differences between amps.

And why should they, a properly designed amp should have no sound of its own...

[telecat]

Crackie said:

Imho, competent digital sources have killed the 'front end bias' promoted by Linn etc in the 70's, 80s and 90s. Some audiophiles will cringe but I'm currently using a £65.00 class D amp to drive a pair of Impulse H2 horn speakers. If these speakers we're still available today their retail price would be 100 x the amps price.

There is plenty of evidence that shows that many listeners can't tell the difference between 320kbps MP3 files and 44.1k red book CD and there's there is plenty of evidence to show the vast majority also can't consistently identify differences between amps.

wildoliver .......It may be worth investigating one of these fed with a competent source feeding the best speakers your budget can stretch to http://www.tnt-audio.com/ampli/bantam_gold_e.html / http://hifipig.com/temple-audio-bantam-gold-integr...

These might be of interest too http://matrixhifi.com/ENG_contenedor_ppec.htm

http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2017/07/happy-ac...

Edited by Crackie on Thursday 3rd August 19:31

I have Lali's, you really are feeding them bread and water aren't youI find it it really easy to tell the difference between MP3's and Hi-res

[Crackie]

telecat said:

I have Lali's, you really are feeding them bread and water aren't youI find it it really easy to tell the difference between MP3's and Hi-res

Its decent bread and water though; front end is an original Exposure CD player or a Wadia 301. The Impulses have been used with various Cambridge, Quad, Rotel & Naim pre powers over the years. The new digital amp uses an STA326 chip and an 18v laptop power supply.....its very good.

Agreed its not difficult to tell the difference between MP3s and Red book CD but the benefit of going higher is questionable ( for playback ). Clearly many listeners are able to identify differences / improvements between CD versions and higher res versions of their favourite tracks but imho the differences are due to mixing / mastering changes not the benefits of higher resolution per se.

http://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=14195

[Bonefish Blues]

wildoliver said:

Thanks while a totally predictable response that has answered the question!

Would anyone mind following on with advice on a good source of a digital music library? I use the old laptop as it's convenient and handy to have an entire music collection to hand, ideally I'd like some sort of box that can be connected up and deliver decent quality source to the amp, but still allow me to hold most of my music on a hard disc and scroll through. Does a sensibly priced option exist? Does any priced option exist or is any compression of the files a bad thing full stop? Or should I get a unicorn hair power cable for my amp

Cocktail Audio X12 was my solution to this conundrum. I've stored all of my CDs as FLAC and can't tell the difference between them played through a Levinson CD player or using the Levinson as a DAC from the X12.

[NuisanceFactor]

It may be worth checking that the output from the Macbook isn't overloading the input of the amplifier. It's quite possible to drive the input into clipping which may give the appearance of the amplifier struggling at the output end.

Check the output voltage of your Macbook with the input sensitivity of the amplifier input connections you're using.

[Crackie]

Bonefish Blues said:

wildoliver said:

Thanks while a totally predictable response that has answered the question!

Would anyone mind following on with advice on a good source of a digital music library? I use the old laptop as it's convenient and handy to have an entire music collection to hand, ideally I'd like some sort of box that can be connected up and deliver decent quality source to the amp, but still allow me to hold most of my music on a hard disc and scroll through. Does a sensibly priced option exist? Does any priced option exist or is any compression of the files a bad thing full stop? Or should I get a unicorn hair power cable for my amp

Cocktail Audio X12 was my solution to this conundrum. I've stored all of my CDs as FLAC and can't tell the difference between them played through a Levinson CD player or using the Levinson as a DAC from the X12.

I use an Novafidelity X12 too......perfect solution for me. All CD's stored as WAVs, vinyl ripped & archived as WAVs, Spotify, Qobuz, Deezer, Reciva, TIDAL streaming. Analogue and digital pre-amps, multi-room, etc etc . Looks are nothing special but imho the performance is........

[Bonefish Blues]

A bit of an unsung hero IMHO. It's absolutley transformed my music listening. I can find stuff, for a start!

[wildoliver]

Thanks for those comments will definitely try the macbook output suggestion.