What Amp for ceiling speakers? Wireless? Bluetooth? Sonos?
Discussion
Currently planning our new kitchen diner and whilst we're ripping out I'd like to chuck some ceiling speakers in.
I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
ColdoRS said:
Currently planning our new kitchen diner and whilst we're ripping out I'd like to chuck some ceiling speakers in.
I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
You are quite correct regarding the Sonos amp (£449). I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
You will be able to add other Sonos items around the house, at prices from about £180 for a current version Play 1.
They don’t connect to / from the amp as such. They all join your router and can work independently , or as a group. (No Bluetooth on Sonos)
You can hide the amp, as it’s app driven, so it has no visual presence at all.
You’ll have the choice to listen to most sub services, radio, phone stored music and all visible network places in the house, all from as many android / iOS devises as you like.
If you just want a one room system with BT, you could get a Denon DM41 or similar. It is about £279ish, but is dumb / no control app or expandability.
BT can get annoying for multiple users / devices and mostly sounds less good.
Not sure about the Polk speakers though. Never heard any that price that sound any good.
Red 5 said:
ColdoRS said:
Currently planning our new kitchen diner and whilst we're ripping out I'd like to chuck some ceiling speakers in.
I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
You are quite correct regarding the Sonos amp (£449). I think I'm set on speakers - Polk Audio RC80i. Happy to hear opinions on these? Internet reviews seem promising.
That sorted, I need an amp. Missus likes the idea of Sonos, as do I but it's more than I'd hoped to spend at £500... Neither of us are super into AV but we would both like a system that looks and sounds good and will be hassle free. She wants to pick up her phone and put a song on wirelessly, whether that's over Bluetooth or WiFi.
Is Sonos the answer here? Or will a cheap Yamaha with a Bluetooth adapter do the trick?
With the Sonos... could I connect a couple of small Sonos Play speakers (bedroom/lounge/garage) to it/the wireless network in the future and essentially have a multi room set up? Play speakers and ceiling speakers all playing the same music, networked through the amp?
Happy to hear any advice on the best way get what I want, even if it's radically different to my novice idea above.
You will be able to add other Sonos items around the house, at prices from about £180 for a current version Play 1.
They don’t connect to / from the amp as such. They all join your router and can work independently , or as a group. (No Bluetooth on Sonos)
You can hide the amp, as it’s app driven, so it has no visual presence at all.
You’ll have the choice to listen to most sub services, radio, phone stored music and all visible network places in the house, all from as many android / iOS devises as you like.
If you just want a one room system with BT, you could get a Denon DM41 or similar. It is about £279ish, but is dumb / no control app or expandability.
BT can get annoying for multiple users / devices and mostly sounds less good.
Not sure about the Polk speakers though. Never heard any that price that sound any good.
Regarding the speakers - will I appreciate £400+ Bose or BO etc... over a set at half the price? This installation will be used for various sounds - podcasts, radio, parties, background music.
EDIT: What is the direct competition to the Sonos system? I see Bose do a wireless amp (SA-5) which appears to do the job but doesn't seem as popular as Sonos.
Edited by ColdoRS on Friday 13th October 06:38
We recently fitted a pair of RC60i speakers into our dining area, running cable through to a Connect Amp in a server cabinet in the loft space.
The speakers can usually be had for a good price (£125-150 in sales on Amazon), we won the Connect Amp on eBay from a surplus house refit (saved £125 there) as they aren't as sought after as the built in speakers they offer.
Sound is good especially considering the speaker depth, though the streaming services I believe are only standard def, and they are visually pleasing - I wanted a minimalist look and eventually hope for them to have Alexa integration.
If you do go down this route, consider the location of your connect amp proximity to the router, the run of speaker cable to the speakers, your depth of your joists, and also what room is above the speakers as you will hear the bass upstairs when they are playing.
The speakers can usually be had for a good price (£125-150 in sales on Amazon), we won the Connect Amp on eBay from a surplus house refit (saved £125 there) as they aren't as sought after as the built in speakers they offer.
Sound is good especially considering the speaker depth, though the streaming services I believe are only standard def, and they are visually pleasing - I wanted a minimalist look and eventually hope for them to have Alexa integration.
If you do go down this route, consider the location of your connect amp proximity to the router, the run of speaker cable to the speakers, your depth of your joists, and also what room is above the speakers as you will hear the bass upstairs when they are playing.
Engineerino said:
We recently fitted a pair of RC60i speakers into our dining area, running cable through to a Connect Amp in a server cabinet in the loft space.
The speakers can usually be had for a good price (£125-150 in sales on Amazon), we won the Connect Amp on eBay from a surplus house refit (saved £125 there) as they aren't as sought after as the built in speakers they offer.
Sound is good especially considering the speaker depth, though the streaming services I believe are only standard def, and they are visually pleasing - I wanted a minimalist look and eventually hope for them to have Alexa integration.
If you do go down this route, consider the location of your connect amp proximity to the router, the run of speaker cable to the speakers, your depth of your joists, and also what room is above the speakers as you will hear the bass upstairs when they are playing.
Excellent, all noted.The speakers can usually be had for a good price (£125-150 in sales on Amazon), we won the Connect Amp on eBay from a surplus house refit (saved £125 there) as they aren't as sought after as the built in speakers they offer.
Sound is good especially considering the speaker depth, though the streaming services I believe are only standard def, and they are visually pleasing - I wanted a minimalist look and eventually hope for them to have Alexa integration.
If you do go down this route, consider the location of your connect amp proximity to the router, the run of speaker cable to the speakers, your depth of your joists, and also what room is above the speakers as you will hear the bass upstairs when they are playing.
I agree with CR above.
Yamaha MusicCast and Denon Heos are both credable alternatives to Sonos, and IMO the new Sonos App is Sh*te, horrid to use when you have used the original one for close to 8 years.
I used to love the Polk range, they then disappeared off the uk market for a while, they are now back via a new distributor and still on a par with others.
V.
Yamaha MusicCast and Denon Heos are both credable alternatives to Sonos, and IMO the new Sonos App is Sh*te, horrid to use when you have used the original one for close to 8 years.
I used to love the Polk range, they then disappeared off the uk market for a while, they are now back via a new distributor and still on a par with others.
V.
ColdoRS said:
Excellent - that all makes sense.
Regarding the speakers - will I appreciate £400+ Bose or BO etc... over a set at half the price? This installation will be used for various sounds - podcasts, radio, parties, background music.
EDIT: What is the direct competition to the Sonos system? I see Bose do a wireless amp (SA-5) which appears to do the job but doesn't seem as popular as Sonos.
Bose and B&O are bad examples. Bose are pretty bottom of the pile for home audio! Plastic AND expensive! Regarding the speakers - will I appreciate £400+ Bose or BO etc... over a set at half the price? This installation will be used for various sounds - podcasts, radio, parties, background music.
EDIT: What is the direct competition to the Sonos system? I see Bose do a wireless amp (SA-5) which appears to do the job but doesn't seem as popular as Sonos.
Edited by ColdoRS on Friday 13th October 06:38
B&O kit can be good and is usually very well executed, but isn’t really in the same market as Sonos.
B&W, KEF and Monitor Audio ceiling speakers might be a beter example.
You can buy a set of entry level B&W for £200, which are pretty good.
I think you’d struggle to beat them for the money!
If you step up to CCM684 @ £450, the difference is dramatic and very noticable indeed.
Go up again to the CWM7.4 at £1400 and there is a HUGE great jump again.
You really do get what you pay for with speakers and it’s very easy to tell the difference.
Denon Heos is a competitor to Sonos. It has more options for connections, includes bluetooth and aux inputs on all devices. There are two surround systems and even a battery powered solution.
The app is ok, but the system is not as well supported or reliable as Sonos is.
Denon bought a half baked system from an IT supplier and polished it up (pretty well in fairness)
Bluesound is the next step up the quality spectum from Sonos. Better electronics and Hi-Res download activities etc.
Again the app is ok, but can be annoying. Pretty well supported by NAD.
Way fewer options though and quite a lot more to buy.
For the average house though, Sonos is the answer. It’s just easier and more robust and developmemt is never ending.
It is also the easiest system to sell for strong money, if you decide to upgrade.
Every single company has jumped on the bandwagon now, but few other systems gain much traction.
I hope this helps?
Red 5 said:
ColdoRS said:
Excellent - that all makes sense.
Regarding the speakers - will I appreciate £400+ Bose or BO etc... over a set at half the price? This installation will be used for various sounds - podcasts, radio, parties, background music.
EDIT: What is the direct competition to the Sonos system? I see Bose do a wireless amp (SA-5) which appears to do the job but doesn't seem as popular as Sonos.
Bose and B&O are bad examples. Bose are pretty bottom of the pile for home audio! Plastic AND expensive! Regarding the speakers - will I appreciate £400+ Bose or BO etc... over a set at half the price? This installation will be used for various sounds - podcasts, radio, parties, background music.
EDIT: What is the direct competition to the Sonos system? I see Bose do a wireless amp (SA-5) which appears to do the job but doesn't seem as popular as Sonos.
Edited by ColdoRS on Friday 13th October 06:38
B&O kit can be good and is usually very well executed, but isn’t really in the same market as Sonos.
B&W, KEF and Monitor Audio ceiling speakers might be a beter example.
You can buy a set of entry level B&W for £200, which are pretty good.
I think you’d struggle to beat them for the money!
If you step up to CCM684 @ £450, the difference is dramatic and very noticable indeed.
Go up again to the CWM7.4 at £1400 and there is a HUGE great jump again.
You really do get what you pay for with speakers and it’s very easy to tell the difference.
Denon Heos is a competitor to Sonos. It has more options for connections, includes bluetooth and aux inputs on all devices. There are two surround systems and even a battery powered solution.
The app is ok, but the system is not as well supported or reliable as Sonos is.
Denon bought a half baked system from an IT supplier and polished it up (pretty well in fairness)
Bluesound is the next step up the quality spectum from Sonos. Better electronics and Hi-Res download activities etc.
Again the app is ok, but can be annoying. Pretty well supported by NAD.
Way fewer options though and quite a lot more to buy.
For the average house though, Sonos is the answer. It’s just easier and more robust and developmemt is never ending.
It is also the easiest system to sell for strong money, if you decide to upgrade.
Every single company has jumped on the bandwagon now, but few other systems gain much traction.
I hope this helps?
I'm far more confident with what I need now - off to do some reading and pricing up!
I had Monitor Audio CT265 ceiling speakers in my last place. 5 (including two FX models) were fed from a Denon A/V amp and 4 more were used in stereo pairs and fed from Sonos Amps.
The sound quality was superb and I'll be using them again in my next project unless anything else is now able to better them.
The sound quality was superb and I'll be using them again in my next project unless anything else is now able to better them.
Just to round this thread off.
In the end I did go for a Sonos connect:amp. Driving the Polk Audio RC80i in ceiling speakers (x2). I also bought a Play:1 for the lounge area - the 3 spaces are fairly open plan, it’s nice walking from one space to another. I also like that the amp and ceiling speakers are hidden, no nasty cables or clutter on the kitchen work surfaces - compliments the new kitchen.
I’d actually go as far as to say it’s changed our lifestyle a bit... we now always have music on and the tv is on even less than before which is a big plus, for me.
In the end I did go for a Sonos connect:amp. Driving the Polk Audio RC80i in ceiling speakers (x2). I also bought a Play:1 for the lounge area - the 3 spaces are fairly open plan, it’s nice walking from one space to another. I also like that the amp and ceiling speakers are hidden, no nasty cables or clutter on the kitchen work surfaces - compliments the new kitchen.
I’d actually go as far as to say it’s changed our lifestyle a bit... we now always have music on and the tv is on even less than before which is a big plus, for me.
ColdoRS said:
I’d actually go as far as to say it’s changed our lifestyle a bit... we now always have music on and the tv is on even less than before which is a big plus, for me.
This is exactly what happened to me and Mrs G when we subscribed to Spotify premium and streamed via Sonos. We have the radio on a lot during the day and then various music playlists from Spotify in the evenings. Welcome to the future
Sonos Connect Amps seem expensive until you start looking at what else you can get to do the same job. I couldn't find anything that would successfully power ceiling speakers with anything approaching the convinenience of a SCA.
My first requirement when looking for an alternative amplifier was some kind of auto signal sensing or triggered power on/off which for one reason or another doesn't seem to exist.
Second requirement was that it be digital rather than Class A/B as its hidden away in a cupboard and I want it to be efficent and not get hot when in use.
Bluetooth is a PITA and was vetoed from the off after pairing issues with a Bose Connect mobile speaker, my other half almost threw it off our fourth floor roof terrace after a series of frustrating beeps but no actual music.
The roof terrace now has a pair of weatherproof speakers and its own zone powered by a Sonos Connect Amp.
The new App is a but of a learning curve though, I don't know what it does any better than the old app besides be confusing.
My first requirement when looking for an alternative amplifier was some kind of auto signal sensing or triggered power on/off which for one reason or another doesn't seem to exist.
Second requirement was that it be digital rather than Class A/B as its hidden away in a cupboard and I want it to be efficent and not get hot when in use.
Bluetooth is a PITA and was vetoed from the off after pairing issues with a Bose Connect mobile speaker, my other half almost threw it off our fourth floor roof terrace after a series of frustrating beeps but no actual music.
The roof terrace now has a pair of weatherproof speakers and its own zone powered by a Sonos Connect Amp.
The new App is a but of a learning curve though, I don't know what it does any better than the old app besides be confusing.
paralla said:
Sonos Connect Amps seem expensive until you start looking at what else you can get to do the same job. I couldn't find anything that would successfully power ceiling speakers with anything approaching the convinenience of a SCA.
My first requirement when looking for an alternative amplifier was some kind of auto signal sensing or triggered power on/off which for one reason or another doesn't seem to exist.
Second requirement was that it be digital rather than Class A/B as its hidden away in a cupboard and I want it to be efficent and not get hot when in use.
Except you can pay £15 for a Chromecast Audio and £20 for a Lepai amplifier. You can get signal sensing power-supplies too, but they're too expensive for what should be a simple software option.My first requirement when looking for an alternative amplifier was some kind of auto signal sensing or triggered power on/off which for one reason or another doesn't seem to exist.
Second requirement was that it be digital rather than Class A/B as its hidden away in a cupboard and I want it to be efficent and not get hot when in use.
I'm currently using a TP-Link wi-fi socket to turn my power supply on, with a IFTTT widget on my homescreen to let me turn the amps on and off from my phone when I go to find the music. It's 90% of what a signal sensing amp would do for you. I have my Tado central heating linked to the switch so that it turns off if no one is home and turns off at 11pm regardless, so you only really need to turn it on, rather than off again. I could link the central heating to turn it on again when someone comes home, but we don't listen to music all the time.
I'm sure you could find a digital amplifier if you really needed one, the Lepai amps are pretty basic but good enough, especially given what they cost. You've got an easy £400 to spend on a better amp though and still be price-competitive with Sonos, I bet there's a £100 option out there that sounds as good as Sonos, especially with ceiling speakers.
We have 4x polk audio rc60i in our kitchen and two in the ensuite, both driven by connect amps. They need a bit of a tweak with the tone controls (treble +70%, bass +15%, loudness on) because ceiling speakers by their nature sound thin IME, but with these settings they sound excellent. Better than the B&W 8" speakers in the main bathroom (and I am a fan of B&W).
If you can, conceal an echo dot in the kitchen and run the line out into the Sonos, and configure the Sonos for auto line-in. That way you can ask Alexa to play music (assuming you have Prime) or ask for the weather etc and get decent sound. Works great!
Edit: worth a read: http://www.sam-mallery.com/2016/12/5-tips-for-usin...
If you can, conceal an echo dot in the kitchen and run the line out into the Sonos, and configure the Sonos for auto line-in. That way you can ask Alexa to play music (assuming you have Prime) or ask for the weather etc and get decent sound. Works great!
Edit: worth a read: http://www.sam-mallery.com/2016/12/5-tips-for-usin...
Edited by FarmyardPants on Wednesday 29th November 13:11
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