Naim Muso distortion

[matjk]

I purchased a muso back in 2014 , love it at first but after about a year I noticed some distortion on base heavy music , I tried to ignore it but it got progressively more noticeable, I retuned it to John Lewis , they didn’t even listen to it and just gave a replacement. Happy days, until yesterday I noticed the new one was doing the same thing , it’s the base driver on the left , you can hear it rasping and farting on base and anything over 70% power , I’m now going to return this one , but I now don’t trust the product, I can’t find anything online about this problem , but having 2 in 2 years seems ridiclous , the song i used to show it up is Hanna wants , Rhythms , at 47 seconds it sounds awful. Now do I just ask for yet another one and hope it doesn’t happen again , or do I give up and get something different , not impressed for £1000 speaker , can this things be blown up, I have it loud some days but never flat out , I assume it should handle full power anyway ! Thanks

[legzr1]

Driving it to 70% on bass heavy tracks isn't wise and you're probably at the limits of the amp and speaker.

[matjk]

Possible, but it didn’t do it before so have I damaged it ? I would be disappointed if you can’t use an expensive product like at 70% without damaging it ! Sounds awful now

[legzr1]

Not sure if you've damaged it but you have to remember that every product containing an amp needs to be able to produce sufficient volume with small input signals - running that same amp at high volumes with a high input signal (anything released in the past few years mastered at max levels) is going to put strain on the system.

This is the same for most systems regardless of price.


If it's under warranty, return it and go easier with the 'killer' tracks.

Edited to add:

Just listened to the track 'Rhymes' - lots of synthesised and EQ'd bass - if anything is going to do a small bass driver, this sort of music is it.

Edited by legzr1 on Monday 27th November 09:45

[hyphen]

I would be thinking the same as the OP, a £50 argos boombox I would expect to distort and damage at high volume. At a £1k price and premium brand I would expect it to self-regulate.

[VEX]

Call Naim and ask them.

You won’t be able to send directly to them for repair (not usually) but they should be able to give some guidance.

V

[legzr1]

Perhaps things are different in the world of sound bars but you can overdrive any speaker system if you're a little cackhanded with the volume knob.

I can't see anything in the Naims specs to suggest it has any kind of signal detection and overload protection - to be fair, that's normally the domain of large active speakers and subwoofers.

I think expectations need reassessing here - sending a 35Hz bass signal to a tiny bass driver in a small reflex enclosure using a 75W amp module is asking for trouble - depending on the gain in the preamp section and the input level of the track, operating it regularly at levels like those suggested is asking for trouble IMHO. Expecting it to readily accept 100% volume no matter the track is wishful thinking no matter the cost.

But, I'm an amateur with limited experience of soundbars - perhaps Crackie could comment.

In the past, I have blown speakers and it's never been with choral excerpts at moderate levels

[hyphen]

legzr1 said:

I think expectations need reassessing here - sending a 35Hz bass signal to a tiny bass driver in a small reflex enclosure using a 75W amp module is asking for trouble

Inside that £1k unit, shouldn't there be a crossover ensuring frequencies are currently off?

Op I have down a quick web search and not much on this, so I suspect you have an edge case of some sort. I would ring Naim up to see if they can advise.

[legzr1]

hyphen said:

Inside that £1k unit, shouldn't there be a crossover ensuring frequencies are currently off?

Op I have down a quick web search and not much on this, so I suspect you have an edge case of some sort. I would ring Naim up to see if they can advise.

Yes, there will be crossovers but are you talking about high-pass filter networks?

The mu so is sold as 'hifi' and advertised as a full range system - online searches show a -6db output at 37Hz, -3Db at 50Hz so it can and does produce bass. But, as I said earlier, expecting this type of product to operate at 70-100% volume with bass heavy tracks is unreasonable.

There is a chance there's a fault with both units the OP has been supplied with so I agree, a call to the supplier or Naim themselves would help.

[matjk]

so time line might help
First unit 2015 purchase noticed distortion on "killer track" 2016

went to John Lewis armed with phone using spotify connect (should take out input level)
& tested on their demo unit, got a telling off for having it to loud but sounded good.
retuned home to try the same test sounded awful.
Returned unit to JL and they swapped it out

all been good until the other day i had in cranked up a bit as the Mrs was out, noticed a bit of distortion, tracked it down to right bass driver. Used killer track, then started swearing as problem is back.

Its so bad i can record it on my iphone and you can clearly hear which speaker is playing up.
As you say a call to Naim is next on my list, and then back to JL I guess.
Id rather have a refund now and put the money towards a pair of KEFs
One thing that peeded me off is last time they gave me a credit not for the value of the MUSO and it had gone up £100, luckily for me the guy doing the new purchase didn't twig. but my guess is i will get back £849 and be £150 worse off this time, which id a bugger

[VEX]

Or take it back to JL and see if you can swap it for a devialet phantom

The bass out of that thing is emmense.

[matjk]

Ugly as sin compared to the naim but the specs are good on the phantom , so JL even sell them ?
I spoke to naim and they claimed they had never heard of it before , so either I’m mega unlucky or they are fibbing but online reviews don’t mention it ! I’m taking it back to JL on Wednesday to see what they say, thanks for the advise guys !

[legzr1]

What sort of gear have you owned or heard in the past?

I'm guessing you're expecting far too much from what is effectively 5" racetrack drivers in a small reflex enclosure.
As good as it may be, you can't defeat physics.

[sawman]

The phantom is an awesome piece of kit but its a funny looking thing. Dont thin jl sell them. I had a listen to one in my local hi fi place.

Eventually bought a Teenage engineering OD 11. Pretty smooth, warm and natural sounding - i like it but may not suit your killer tracks ( although brief trial didnt seem to upset it!)

Edited by sawman on Monday 27th November 22:14

[matjk]

Not listened to a great deal but I know it’s definitely not right ! One driver sounds perfect one is distorting, and it didn’t do it when I got it ! They sound pretty impressive for why they are but I think I would rather have a stereo pair now anyway so if I do get a replacement I will probably sell it and go for the KEF LS50 wireless

[legzr1]

matjk said:

Not listened to a great deal but I know it’s definitely not right ! One driver sounds perfect one is distorting, and it didn’t do it when I got it ! They sound pretty impressive for why they are but I think I would rather have a stereo pair now anyway so if I do get a replacement I will probably sell it and go for the KEF LS50 wireless

I'm not doubting the obvious issues with one driver in particular just your expectations of what small drivers can actually deliver.

If your normal listening is bass and beat driven music then a subwoofer added to whatever system you choose might be a wise decision - unfortunately the Mu So doesn't have a sub out.

[matjk]

I let kicks out a surprising amount of bass and would say it punches above its weight (well for a bit anyway). I listen to a mix of music and the Hanna wants track I noticed really shows up the issue, but I think a sub and some stereo satalites may suit me better so maybe some Sonos play3 and the sub would sound better for what I want now. I still rate the muso and it such a compact unit but not sure I trust it now

[benz0]

get some active studio monitors with 8 inch woofers with your choice of google chromecast/sonos connect/yamaha music cast pre amp connected as wireless source.

that will give a lot deeper / more defined bass than most bookshelf speakers or soundbars.

may studio monitors will have a matching subwoofer that you can buy too, and it will be easy to integrate. if you go with something like a 10 or 12 inch matching subwoofer alongside, you will be rinsing out the bass. (spoken as someone who loves drum and bass, dub and dubstep.

[matjk]

Yeah , i will look into that, its kinda what you get if you buy a couple of play3's and the sub from sonos,
linking the monitors is a bit of a pain where I'm putting them and active monitors never seem to be wireless, they always need a link (where sonos has an edge)
I love the look of the Kef LS50 actives, but a £2k not cheap and i still may crave a bit more base with them, I need to audition a pair i guess.
I got a cheap bose (yes i know) CineMate GS Series II that plugs into the TV, and honestly I'm really impressed with it (for £150), i didn't want a soundbar, and i have hidden the sub , and I'm
using that to listen to my music more than the naim, it's louder has more base and the stereo is way better, just not quite as crisp a sound and i have to use my apple tv.
Its mostly dependent on what JL say, they might refuse to refund and just offer to fix in which case im stuck anyway.

[Tony1963]

A couple of points.

The Muso isn't intended to recreate, for example, heavy and complicated rock music to a 'hifi' standard and at high volumes. But the sales staff in JL might not let on. I was in my local hifi shop at the weekend and the shop owner made that very clear to the customers.

I've a typical Naim system of pre, power, power supplies and a decent pair of PMC floor standing speakers. I wouldn't expect the drive units to last long if I ran drum and bass music as loud as my ears could take for hours at a time. The cones are manmade items, built to a price, and although my PMCs cost over twice what a Muso costs, I wouldn't expect anything else.

I like the above recommendation of active monitors. I heard some JBLs at a recent show and was pleasantly surprised. Not hifi, but enjoyable enough.