RE: Lamborghini reveals 1015hp hybrid V12 powertrain
RE: Lamborghini reveals 1015hp hybrid V12 powertrain
Wednesday 8th March 2023

Lamborghini reveals 1015hp hybrid V12 powertrain

'More power, more revs, more thrill, more emotion' - the Lambo V12 is back with 825hp at 9,250rpm


Attempting to upstage Ferrari is the oldest trick in the Lamborghini playbook, and probably its most endearing one. Sticking it to the Great Old Man was famously among its founder’s early ambitions (and ranked high as a motivating factor for the designer of its first V12, too); both, surely, would love the new hybrid powertrain the firm has conjured to sit at the heart of what it says is its first High Performance Electrified Vehicle - or the LB744, as the Aventador’s replacement is currently codenamed. 

Ferrari has enjoyed enormous supremacy in recent years thanks to a) the stupendous 6.5-litre V12 engine in the 812, and b) the no-less-stupendous-in-its-own-way 1000hp, electrically-aided twin-turbocharged V8 in the paradigm-shifting SF90 Stradale. Now, Lamborghini, in one mighty, bullish charge, has attempted to slay both Italian stallions simultaneously: its all-new, mid-engined supercar will feature a) an 825hp naturally aspirated 6.5-litre V12, and b) three electric motors - two on the front axle, one integrated into the transmission - to generate a combined maximum output of 1015hp, alongside zero-emission functionality. 

It gets better. Let’s start with the V12, because plainly that’s the biggest and best bit. Is it related to the old 6.5-litre unit? Absolutely. In fact, it almost certainly shares some of its overhauled attributes with the derivative Lamborghini stuffed into the track-only Essenza SCV12 back in 2020 - certainly, it has repeated that model’s trick of spinning the motor through 180 degrees so that a new transverse gearbox can be mounted at the rear (we’ll come back to that). Either way, now designated L545, the engine is claimed as the lightest and most powerful V12 Lamborghini has ever made. 

Specifically, it weighs 218kg, which is said to be 17kg less than the Aventador’s V12, and delivers 534lb ft of torque at 6,750rpm. It boasts a superior compression ratio to its predecessor (12.6:1 compared to 11.8:1 in the Ultimae) and apparently delivers its 825hp output at a knee-trembling 9,250rpm - a redline it shares with the 812 Competizione. Lamborghini says it will support a ‘maximum rev range of 9,500rpm’. It also suggests particular attention has been lavished on the ‘soundtrack of the new V12, and we can expect a ‘natural harmonious crescendo’. Well, quite. 

Let’s return to that gearbox. If the V12 has been revised and reheated for life after 2023, the new transmission is described as nothing less than the ‘nerve centre of the hybrid plug-in unit’. As you might expect, it is not referring to the old Graziano single-clutch automated manual. Mercifully (let’s be honest) that has been ditched in favour of an all-new, in-house designed, all-singing eight-speed Double Clutch Transmission. Adorably, Lamborghini talks up some of its more predictable features like its introducing a flux capacitor (we’re told the ‘box will downshift multiple ratios if you hold down the left paddle - holy cow!) but there’s little doubt this is where much time and energy has been invested. 

For one thing, it’s been made as compact as possible, measuring 560mm long, 750mm wide and 580mm high. It goes without saying it's quicker than its predecessor, but it would be lighter too if you disregarded the electrical components. With its top-mounted electric motor factored in, the whole unit is said to weigh 193kg. The function of the 150hp/110lb ft motor depends on which driving mode you’ve selected: when providing additional power to the V12, it’s in what Lamborghini considers its P3 position; when it’s in P2, it helps recharge the battery at low speeds, and when parked (P1, presumably) it acts as the engine’s starter motor. 

Additionally, in P3 it is capable of driving the rear wheels itself if called upon, which, in conjunction with the brace of 150hp electric motors mounted on the front axle (i.e. one per wheel) means Lamborghini’s HPEV can claim to be an all-wheel drive supercar even in its all-electric mode (though most of the time it will be front-wheel drive). The manufacturer reckons the two oil-cooled axial flux units offer exceptional power-to-weight, and when you consider they only weigh 18.5kg each, you can see where it's coming from. Of course, their real job (beyond providing you with a reverse gear) is to make 258lb ft apiece available to their respective front tyre while the V12 dispenses its quota to the rear - Lamborghini doesn’t go into precise detail about how all this is marshalled or the level of straight-line performance you can expect, but we’re going to say ‘a-l-o-t’. 

Driving the motors - and, indeed, the reason for spinning the engine around - is the lithium-ion battery pack sequestered in the now helpfully vacated transmission tunnel. Naturally, Lamborghini has mounted this 1,550mm long, 301mm high, 240mm wide unit as low as possible and with a view to ensuring optimising weight distribution. How much precisely it does weigh is left unanswered for now, but, much like in the SF90, the electric-only range is likely to be very modest on the basis that its maker quotes an overall capacity of 3.8kWh. Still, Lamborghini reckons you can completely recharge it in 30 minutes from a domestic plug - or the mighty V12 (with some assistance from regenerative braking) will do the job in as little as six minutes.

As ever, the devil is in the detail to come - and we're promised plenty as we approach the LB744’s official unveiling - but if there was any doubt that Lamborghini might struggle to adequately replace its much-loved supercar, it is starting to fade. By marrying a naturally aspirated (and reliably brilliant) V12 engine to the sort of electrified architecture that has proven to work in a supercar setting, the manufacturer can already claim to have delivered precisely the sort of hybrid flagship its customers will have been clamouring for. Its average CO2 emissions are 30 per cent lower than the Ultimae’s, yet power is up. Assuming it doesn’t look like a potato or drive like a lead-filled DeLorean, there’s a good chance Lamborghini’s 60th year will be one to remember. 


Author
Discussion

Geoffcapes

Original Poster:

1,313 posts

194 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Starting price north of 500k?

Still, I bet it will be epic!

Jurdy

314 posts

314 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
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Awesome!...will it be available in metallic Orange? or Hulk green?

Twinair

1,039 posts

172 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Potato-ghini… Lead-borghini… who cares!

V12 - absolute filth.

Wonderful-ghini… imho :-))

  • *** Have been wondering. (Seeing as how the EVangelists now walk amongst the ICE diehards (blowhards?! As you might call us)) Don’t get all grumpy, no offence..!
How much ‘hybrid’ do you have to have before you can call the vee-hickel a ‘hybrid’…?

Could you have an ‘AA’ battery powering a Lego motor, with a small gearbox onto one of the driven axles?

This Lambo seems to be somewhat in ‘loop hole’ territory to me?

I mean V12 @800+ HP, and a ‘thin slice’ of bevvy planted in the middle. Let’s say they ‘smallered’ the bevvy bit to say 50 HP, and wound the wick up on the V12?

At what point is a hybrid a hybrid?

And why the ‘eff didn’t AMG do some of this trickery for the C63 - iso going full on: ‘neither one thing or another’ with the 4 pot?

Is the way forward to live in the loopholes…? (Until they are closed - of course)…

Edited by Twinair on Tuesday 7th March 16:35

TGCOTF-dewey

7,926 posts

85 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
It's utter madness that legislation has forced three electric motors and a battery into this type of car due to CO2 emissions.

Given these cars do only a few thousand miles in their life, there is no way all the production and testing of e-guff offsets the limited miles that v12 will do over its life.

For High mileage cars there is a case.

Dombilano

1,457 posts

85 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Any new V12 is a winner for me

Bobley

730 posts

179 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
blah blah blah 825CV blah blah 9250rpm blah blah blah V12

Sounds great. I missed the rest

Sway

35,310 posts

224 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
TGCOTF-dewey said:
It's utter madness that legislation has forced three electric motors and a battery into this type of car due to CO2 emissions.

Given these cars do only a few thousand miles in their life, there is no way all the production and testing of e-guff offsets the limited miles that v12 will do over its life.

For High mileage cars there is a case.
Agreed. Seems mostly pointless.

As for being able to recharge a 3.8kWh battery in 30 minutes from a "domestic plug" - bks. That's a 32A supply needed.

Evil.soup

4,047 posts

235 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
TGCOTF-dewey said:
It's utter madness that legislation has forced three electric motors and a battery into this type of car due to CO2 emissions.

Given these cars do only a few thousand miles in their life, there is no way all the production and testing of e-guff offsets the limited miles that v12 will do over its life.

For High mileage cars there is a case.
I have to agree with your thinking behind this, however, there is no way the manufacturer can guarantee that the buyer won't put a million miles on it either, despite it being unlikely for most that get sold.

With that in mind, they have no choice, unless of course they bring in some kind of distance restriction that only allows these cars to travel X number of miles per year, can't see that ever happening though.

thegreenhell

24,179 posts

249 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
So all the hype and fanfare over 'the end of the V12 era' last month was all BS then? They're just continuing with essentially the same V12 with some hybrid motors attached.

https://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-eurocars/lambo...

Vee12V

1,410 posts

190 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
So this will have the same useless 'frunk' as an SF90?

GT9

9,050 posts

202 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
TGCOTF-dewey said:
It's utter madness that legislation has forced three electric motors and a battery into this type of car due to CO2 emissions.

Given these cars do only a few thousand miles in their life, there is no way all the production and testing of e-guff offsets the limited miles that v12 will do over its life.

For High mileage cars there is a case.
I just see it as a torque-fill system for a naturally-aspirated engine that gives you the benefits of turbo-charging but without the loss of some of the magic that usually goes with that. 11 on the visceral dial, instead of 7.

Edited by GT9 on Tuesday 7th March 11:45

Wab1974uk

1,415 posts

57 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
More and more cars aimed solely for the super rich.

Even someone `well off` who could afford a V12 Lambo are even priced out now.

Still, at least it keeps the V12 engine ... for now

GT9

9,050 posts

202 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Wab1974uk said:
More and more cars aimed solely for the super rich.
Mainly funded by the punters buying fuel who insist that all cars must continue to be powered in the same way...

Krikkit

27,938 posts

211 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Sway said:
TGCOTF-dewey said:
It's utter madness that legislation has forced three electric motors and a battery into this type of car due to CO2 emissions.

Given these cars do only a few thousand miles in their life, there is no way all the production and testing of e-guff offsets the limited miles that v12 will do over its life.

For High mileage cars there is a case.
Agreed. Seems mostly pointless.

As for being able to recharge a 3.8kWh battery in 30 minutes from a "domestic plug" - bks. That's a 32A supply needed.
I think they mean the standard 7kW wall chargers, non?

Hairymonster

1,678 posts

135 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Electric-only range of 300 yards!

foxhounduk

704 posts

210 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
ANY NEW V12 THAT'S STILL BEING BUILT IN 2023 IS A WINNER FOR ME!

samoht

7,291 posts

176 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all

Cool.

The big change here it seems to me is Lambo moving away from the fundamental architecture they've stuck with since the Countach.

All prior longitudinal engined Lambos have had the gearbox ahead of the engine, in the centre of the car, then sent drive back through the sump to the rear diff. Then from the Diablo VT they took drive forwards too for 4WD.
The Harry's Garage vids of the Countach drivetrain rebuild are really good for showing all this.

Now with the electric motors driving the front wheels they can go to the more conventional layout, with the gearbox right at the back, across the rear wheels, and the engine ahead of that as per McLaren F1.

Interested to know if that gets the weight any lower, and if it means the engine is more ahead of the rear wheels or not.





fantheman80

2,656 posts

79 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Not related to the engine, but why are some articles by 'PH Staff' and some actually named. Are you playing ringers you've not signed on? Is it the Stig?

sidesauce

2,967 posts

248 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Wab1974uk said:
More and more cars aimed solely for the super rich.

Even someone `well off` who could afford a V12 Lambo are even priced out now.
Work harder, do better.

Someone has to buy these cars otherwise Lamborghini would be out of business tomorrow.

If people think it's out of their reach then, to them, it quite literally is.

To me, I see these things as simply taking time to acquire should I desire it. This specific car may not be my personal choice but there are similarly priced and even more expensive ones that I know at some point I will own.



iphonedyou

10,422 posts

187 months

Tuesday 7th March 2023
quotequote all
Wab1974uk said:
More and more cars aimed solely for the super rich.

Even someone `well off` who could afford a V12 Lambo are even priced out now.

Still, at least it keeps the V12 engine ... for now
There's no law that says you must be able to afford every item on sale.

Just think about where that would leave us.