nuts and bolts?

[mattstead]

Hi, I'm actually going to start building my kit (and not just the garage around it), but the last car I build came with a great big pack of MOST of the nuts and bolts you'd need; this kit has nothing.

So, having located my local nuts and bolt stockest I'm going to do a bulk order, but of what and how many? If I recall M8 was popular on my last build in a variety of lengths from just under inch to about 2.5 inch, anything longer was usually because it was also bigger at M10 and I don't recall using much smaller than M6.

In Bolt terms is BZP bright zinc plated? I think this is what I had last time and not stainless (unless on full show) and I think a strength rating of 8.8 was the norm with the odd high tensile bolt for pedals /roll cages etc?

Am I kind of heading up the right path? I want to make sure that when I need something it's already in stock and I'm not wasting time and money popping out for an hour to buy small over priced packs, but similarly I don't want loads of stock I will NEVER use and not enough of what I'll need.

any advice gratefully recieved.

thanks.

[tribbles]

I think the most common sizes I had were M8, then M12, then M10 and then M6. With a smattering of M5 and M4s.

Everything I used was 8.8 grade, except for the CV joints which I used 12.6 grade.

For lengths, the main ones I used were a selection of:

M8 x 25
M8 x 40
M8 x 60
M12 x 60
M12 x 100

The theory being you can cut it down, but you can't build it up

I'd also buy them in whatever box counts they have, rather than "7 of these, 11 of the other", because the savings you make even with some left over is normally enough. Although Imperial and Metric fine/coarse bolts I wouldn't use outside of what I was building, so those were normally bought with 1 or 2 extra (in case of loss/breakage).

I've also got a rack where I put all the spare bolts in, so I can use them for other things.

ETA: Don't use stainless on anything like suspension. Things like dashboard mounts, cycle wing mounts (e.g. LSIS) and perspex light covers, yes.

Edited by tribbles on Wednesday 30th April 13:24

[mattstead]

That's perfect info, thanks, just what I was after.

Did you use mainly bolts or setscrews ? (i believe one has got an unthreaded shank at the top - bolts if I recall, and setcrews are fully threaded)

[tribbles]

Lengths longer than 40mm I tended to get bolts; shorter than that I would use setscrews - the theory in this case is that if you need to tighten a nut all the way to the bolt shank, then you've probably chosen the wrong length - and you've got a shorter one kicking around you should be using instead *

• Although you won't be able to find any on a Sunday at 5pm...

[mattstead]

once again great info, thankyou.
I've just spent £167 on bolts, nuts, setscrews and washers with permafast who seem very reasonable indeed so that should keep me seriously stocked up.

www.permafastsheffield.ltd.uk 

www.permafastsheffield.ltd.uk

Edited by mattstead on Thursday 1st May 18:47

[Steve_D]

mattstead said:

once again great info, thankyou.
I've just spent £167 on bolts, nuts, setscrews and washers with permafast who seem very reasonable indeed so that should keep me seriously stocked up.

www.permafastsheffield.ltd.uk 

Got here too late.
Screwfix direct would have been much cheaper.

Steve

[V8OWNER]

tribbles said:

ETA: Don't use stainless on anything like suspension.

I know this is generally what people recommend.. but i dont get why? I know a regular stainless bolt is not as strong as a carbon one, but if you buy socket head im sure they are stronger (12.9?) ?

[mattstead]

Steve_D said:

mattstead said:

once again great info, thankyou.
I've just spent £167 on bolts, nuts, setscrews and washers with permafast who seem very reasonable indeed so that should keep me seriously stocked up.

www.permafastsheffield.ltd.uk 

Got here too late.
Screwfix direct would have been much cheaper.

Steve

thanks for the suggestion, but think you need to shop elsewhere steve:

for example.

m8 x40 setscrews 100 units
screwfix 4.21 permafast 2.70


m8 x60 setscrews 100 units
screwfix 4.92 permafast 3.50


m12 x 65 setscrews 100 units
screwfix 11.76 permafast 8.80


thanks for the suggestion of screwfix though I hadn't considered them.

Edited by mattstead on Thursday 1st May 18:48

[tribbles]

V8OWNER said:

tribbles said:

ETA: Don't use stainless on anything like suspension.

I know this is generally what people recommend.. but i dont get why? I know a regular stainless bolt is not as strong as a carbon one, but if you buy socket head im sure they are stronger (12.9?) ?

They're more brittle, so they can't take sudden shocks that well. Ordinary steel will stretch a bit; stainless will snap.

[Steve_D]

That's odd on the Screwfix prices.
Only checked price of M8 nuts and found them about five times cheaper on Screwfix. Didn't check any other prices.

Steve

[mattstead]

Steve_D said:

That's odd on the Screwfix prices.
Only checked price of M8 nuts and found them about five times cheaper on Screwfix. Didn't check any other prices.

Steve

interesting point...and I didn't compare the prices of nuts! It probably all evens out overall then.

[King Herald]

tribbles said:

V8OWNER said:

tribbles said:

ETA: Don't use stainless on anything like suspension.

I know this is generally what people recommend.. but i dont get why? I know a regular stainless bolt is not as strong as a carbon one, but if you buy socket head im sure they are stronger (12.9?) ?

They're more brittle, so they can't take sudden shocks that well. Ordinary steel will stretch a bit; stainless will snap.

Lots of people say that, but when was the last time you tried to break a stainless steel bolt by 'shocking' on it with a big hammer. I guarantee you it will not snap easily. It is generally tougher than steel, but not harder, or more malleable.

Most people swear 'oh, you have to use grade 8 bolts, as anything else will snap and you'll die in flames' but grade 8 are reportedly too brittle to use in many situations where some flexing will occur.

If ever I have a bolted position where there is any doubt the bolt will fail if it might possibly be the wrong grade, I will use a bolt bigger than needed. I don't need to live that close to the edge when I'm on the motorway or at speed. This is okay until you have a kit car with set sizes of holes, I suppose, in which case it'd be better to check with the manufacturer as to what grade bolt to use.

And if a grade 8 fastener IS required, make sure you DO have a grade 8 bolt, not some Chinese copy, as the market is currently being flooded with cheapo bolts, shackles, chain etc, all reputedly high tensile grade, but often garbage. I work offshore, and we use high tensile chain a lot, but a certain reputable supplier has recently sent us tens of thousands of dollars worth of cheese, shaped like chain and shackles.....