Left foot braking
Discussion
Hello all!
Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
I would assume left foot braking is very difficult with a conventional gearbox (assuming some mechanical sympathy)?
Personally I think heel'n'toe is more than addequate. It's a pain in the arse with most road cars, but with the sort of pedal spacing you have in most '7s, for example, it's pretty much unavoidable unless you have dwarf feet.
Personally I think heel'n'toe is more than addequate. It's a pain in the arse with most road cars, but with the sort of pedal spacing you have in most '7s, for example, it's pretty much unavoidable unless you have dwarf feet.
Chris71, I would love to see your pedal arrange ment, my Indy sucks and my size 11's have no room to flick the go pedal whilst braking.
As for left foot braking, you really do have to be the utter nuts of a driver to benefit from it and be able to do it naturally and quick enough for it to have any real effect on your lap times.
I would make sur eyou are happy with the car, tyre and spring choice, suspension settings, steering ratio, braking points and general car control when on the limit before you start worrying about dabbing the brakes when cornering.
have to admit feel horrible in a car, but in a kart/arcade, feels mega lol
As for left foot braking, you really do have to be the utter nuts of a driver to benefit from it and be able to do it naturally and quick enough for it to have any real effect on your lap times.
I would make sur eyou are happy with the car, tyre and spring choice, suspension settings, steering ratio, braking points and general car control when on the limit before you start worrying about dabbing the brakes when cornering.
have to admit feel horrible in a car, but in a kart/arcade, feels mega lol
kriss said:
Chris71, I would love to see your pedal arrange ment, my Indy sucks and my size 11's have no room to flick the go pedal whilst braking.
That's kind of my point - in a Caterham footwell I found with normal shoes I couldn't get one pedal or the other, I had to more or less keep contact with both and roll the pressure to the right to blip the throttle! I can just about drive them normally with race boots, but heel'n'toe is easier than shifting your foot from one pedal to the other in trainers.I feel justification is required!
1) In a BEC you can clutchless shift up (good for straight to fast corner to striaght) and with extra kit can shift up and down with out a clutch. This is the same system as race cars. You just use the clutch for starting and stopping. Thats a nice way to drive if you can left foot brake.
2) Mentioned in above post. Down shift with a blip saves your gear mech and stabilises the car under heavey deceleration.
3) It does save time and confusion when in the mix of things. If it didnt people wouldnt learn the art.
4) Im considering going into BEC racing at some point and wondered if anyone here currently races, if the case do they left foot brake?
5) It helps when drifting, not that I want to!
6) (bottom of the barrel) Its a boasting point!
And just to reference back to the OP "Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake?"
Scabby boots but love the left foot action (and the only good pic I could find)!
1) In a BEC you can clutchless shift up (good for straight to fast corner to striaght) and with extra kit can shift up and down with out a clutch. This is the same system as race cars. You just use the clutch for starting and stopping. Thats a nice way to drive if you can left foot brake.
2) Mentioned in above post. Down shift with a blip saves your gear mech and stabilises the car under heavey deceleration.
3) It does save time and confusion when in the mix of things. If it didnt people wouldnt learn the art.
4) Im considering going into BEC racing at some point and wondered if anyone here currently races, if the case do they left foot brake?
5) It helps when drifting, not that I want to!
6) (bottom of the barrel) Its a boasting point!
And just to reference back to the OP "Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake?"
Scabby boots but love the left foot action (and the only good pic I could find)!
Bi22le said:
4) Im considering going into BEC racing at some point and wondered if anyone here currently races, if the case do they left foot brake?
I don't do it, not sure if any of the other RGBers do, I suspect Derek might but he's from a different species 
Only really useful for a few corners where you want to trail brake in to balance the car. In RGB no flatshifters are allowed so generally you want your left foot for the clutch.
Heel and toe is a different matter of course, much more useful and used a lot.
Bi22le said:
BobM was you at Brands on Sunday. That was the first time I have seen BEC racing and I LOVED it. What was you driving? Thanks for your heel toe comment.
Yes, sky blue Hayabusa engined Fury (with Le Mans bonnet 
), race no. 32. It was fun from where I was sitting too On board footage of BikeSports race:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RuaNTjuoBE
... and RGB race:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYkbhNmKZJE
Bi22le said:
I feel justification is required!
1) In a BEC you can clutchless shift up (good for straight to fast corner to striaght) and with extra kit can shift up and down with out a clutch. This is the same system as race cars. You just use the clutch for starting and stopping. Thats a nice way to drive if you can left foot brake.
That's hardly justification: I don't see what that's got to do with left foot braking.1) In a BEC you can clutchless shift up (good for straight to fast corner to striaght) and with extra kit can shift up and down with out a clutch. This is the same system as race cars. You just use the clutch for starting and stopping. Thats a nice way to drive if you can left foot brake.
Bi22le said:
I feel justification is required!
2) Mentioned in above post. Down shift with a blip saves your gear mech and stabilises the car under heavey deceleration.
Yep, do that with heel n'toe: I don't see what it's got to do with left foot braking.2) Mentioned in above post. Down shift with a blip saves your gear mech and stabilises the car under heavey deceleration.
Bi22le said:
I feel justification is required!
3) It does save time and confusion when in the mix of things. If it didnt people wouldnt learn the art.
Nope, don't see how it saves time and confusion at all. That's not why people left foot brake.3) It does save time and confusion when in the mix of things. If it didnt people wouldnt learn the art.
Bi22le said:
I feel justification is required!
4) Im considering going into BEC racing at some point and wondered if anyone here currently races, if the case do they left foot brake?
Never raced a BEC, but I'd be interested to learn if BEC racers left foot brake.4) Im considering going into BEC racing at some point and wondered if anyone here currently races, if the case do they left foot brake?
Bi22le said:
I feel justification is required!
5) It helps when drifting, not that I want to!
The only use that I've had for left foot braking is to reduce the grip at the rear in a FWD rally car to make the rear move out a bit, also can be useful to be able to keep the turbo spinning on the way into the corner in a turbo engined car.5) It helps when drifting, not that I want to!
I'm only pressing the point because I'd really like to know why anyone would want to left foot brake on a circuit. If you want to learn/train your left foot to acquire the feel to be able to brake effectively, then a track day is the best time to try it, but I still don't see why.
Left foot braking is generally done by rally drivers to keep the power on while cornering in LSD equipped FWD cars on gravel or loose surfaces. And to see an expert doing it is a sight to behold. Cannot see what benefit it would have in a RWD car on a circuit. Not by mere mortals anyway. There is maybe a case for trail braking, and to get an understeering car to turn in while you are covering the throttle to power through a bend, but it is all a bit advanced for me. I am doing a driver training day with Andrew Walsh next month, I will ask him! Heel and toeing is more important to master, but i find it is not as critical in my BEC's compared to normal cars as no flywheel effect and a higher revving engine. In my GTM I had to heel and toe when at 10/10ths locking the rear wheels.
Was introduced to the art of left foot braking by Penti Arrikala many moons ago on a Lancia driving experience thingy. It was very effective at tightening the line of a Thema turbo winding in & out of a slalom. I made pretty much of an arse of it when I first tried it but did eventually get into the swing. Felt great. Tried it on my old Beta coupe when I got home but it lacked the grunt to make it work properly.
Bi22le said:
Hello all!
Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
I never used to left foot brake in my kart, what kart did you have? as said before just heel and toe.Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
Edited by RT Phil on Wednesday 24th June 15:25
Hello all,
First of all Kart's have diferent callipers wich are more soft and more precise (due to the size of the discs) than those used on cars. U have to consider also the weight of the vehicle and the driver position, on a Kart your legs are almost stretched, slightly bent but you are sitting almost in a 90 degree angle.
I use both feet on braking, and i use heel and toe every time, even when im driving in a normal road. U can practice on a automatic gear car to start having the feeling of a car braking on your left foot...but u will pick it up very fast!
And if u do it u will have better times on the counter. Left foot braking its only used when u dont have to pass gear (of course, your left foot is busy with the brake pedal), and i use it to point the front of the car for the apex, the same has in Karts. U will also need to find the right brake distribution on your car, i prefer having more brake on the rear than on the front but this is a habit created from Karts, i never lost it.
U can see some videos that will give u some points on Youtube. U will find one there from Macrae giving a left foot braking lesson.
It's quite simple...believe me!
First of all Kart's have diferent callipers wich are more soft and more precise (due to the size of the discs) than those used on cars. U have to consider also the weight of the vehicle and the driver position, on a Kart your legs are almost stretched, slightly bent but you are sitting almost in a 90 degree angle.
I use both feet on braking, and i use heel and toe every time, even when im driving in a normal road. U can practice on a automatic gear car to start having the feeling of a car braking on your left foot...but u will pick it up very fast!
And if u do it u will have better times on the counter. Left foot braking its only used when u dont have to pass gear (of course, your left foot is busy with the brake pedal), and i use it to point the front of the car for the apex, the same has in Karts. U will also need to find the right brake distribution on your car, i prefer having more brake on the rear than on the front but this is a habit created from Karts, i never lost it.
U can see some videos that will give u some points on Youtube. U will find one there from Macrae giving a left foot braking lesson.
It's quite simple...believe me!
RT Phil said:
Bi22le said:
Hello all!
Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
I never used to left foot brake in my kart, what kart did you have? as said before just heel and toe.Just a general question. Do you guys do regular track days, hill climb events and if so do you left foot brake? I find it strange that it feels so natural in a kart but difficult in a car. I would of thought the people racing RGB do. I dont have a kit car yet but would love to left foot brake when I do do a track day. It would take a bit of practice but I recon I can get the hang of it.
Edited by RT Phil on Wednesday 24th June 15:25
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