Gravel traps in F1

[Melvin Udall]

So we seem to be getting more and more Tarmac runoff area on tracks on F1, as opposed to the dreaded gravel traps, but is that a good thing? While I wouldn't want someone excluded from a race because of a small ,intake, I can't help but think that the disadvantage of going offline has become very little, on the scale of things. The only reason I was thinking about it was I watched the Indian grand prix again recently, and the very nice looking spoon-esque bend, (is it turn 12 or 13?), was a superb addition, however, when anyone went offline they got a bit dusty, and lost some time, they just seem to be able to keep going and that really isn't much in the way of penalty.

I remember when someone went off on grass or gravel, it took them some time to actually make their way back onto the circuit, or beach themselves. I want those times back, I think. At the same time I remember a car going upside down, (might have been Hill, can't remember), and the car burying itself in the gravel, up to the cockpit.

Opinions? Tarmac run off areas, or the old fashioned grass or gravel?

[Vocal Minority]

I think the original idea was that it would be better for stopping a car with wheels, and prevent them from spearing into the wall.

On the other hand gravel is infinitely superior if you find yourself lacking in the black round thing department

[groomi]

Pros and cons whether they improve the racing or not, really. My only concern is for a wet race when there is a dry racing line meaning speeds nearly at dry weather - if someone were to run wide onto a still soaking wet runoff, what is going to slow them down?

[entropy]

At high speed a flat bottomed car will skate over gravel and no friction from the tyres to help slow the car down - which is the thinking for advocating asphalt run off.

Just look at McNish's huge shunt at Le Mans this year. The gravel trap did bugger all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dabZKZIGBwA

[paulrockliffe]

What's missing is the penalty for going off I think. Maybe if the whole of the car crosses the white line the driver should have to serve a drive-through or something?

Maybe the ECU should feature a 'penalty' ignition map that is linked to race control and they can issue penalties by slowing the car by a set percentage for a period of time. Would that be a better position than what exists at the moment?

[Melvin Udall]

paulrockliffe said:

What's missing is the penalty for going off I think. Maybe if the whole of the car crosses the white line the driver should have to serve a drive-through or something?

Maybe the ECU should feature a 'penalty' ignition map that is linked to race control and they can issue penalties by slowing the car by a set percentage for a period of time. Would that be a better position than what exists at the moment?

I think that is the problem. Just powering through a tarmac run off just seems wrong. You messed up, so you should have a distinct disadvantage.

[EDLT]

Doesn't the Paul Ricard have abrasive tarmac that ruins the tyres if you slide along it meaning you'd have to come in to the pits to change tyres but could still continue.

[anonymous-user]

At the Abu Dhabi circuit towards the end there are two corners which can be taken as one turn by going completely off the track. I wonder if it's been altered to punish the drivers. I'm sure Massa will find a way to punish himself whatever though.

[Scuffers]

Melvin Udall said:

paulrockliffe said:

What's missing is the penalty for going off I think. Maybe if the whole of the car crosses the white line the driver should have to serve a drive-through or something?

Maybe the ECU should feature a 'penalty' ignition map that is linked to race control and they can issue penalties by slowing the car by a set percentage for a period of time. Would that be a better position than what exists at the moment?

I think that is the problem. Just powering through a tarmac run off just seems wrong. You messed up, so you should have a distinct disadvantage.

they should have the same penalty they used in club racing here, if you cut a chicane, you had to stop, then carry on, if you failed to do this you got a black flag.

[Melvin Udall]

M

Scuffers said:

they should have the same penalty they used in club racing here, if you cut a chicane, you had to stop, then carry on, if you failed to do this you got a black flag.

Well, doing the punishing will be the hard part. I wouldn't want some electronic limiter as suggested, and I'm not sure the stop thing would work, not at those speeds! I do like the idea of abrasive Tarmac, (would aid in slowing stuff down, and punish them by borking tyres to a degree?).

Still, either way, however it was done, I would like some sort of disadvantage.

[davepoth]

Melvin Udall said:

I think that is the problem. Just powering through a tarmac run off just seems wrong. You messed up, so you should have a distinct disadvantage.

They should be automatically slowed to 10mph, as in Forza Motorsport.

-edit-

Actually, not such a bad idea really. The technology is there - just run a wire along the white lines on the track and then if you go over it the pit lane speed limiter cuts in automatically, meaning that you can't accelerate above 50mph, although obviously the brakes don't lock on. Would have been hilariously dangerous this year with exhaust blown diffusers, but might work in future.

[Melvin Udall]

davepoth said:

They should be automatically slowed to 10mph, as in Forza Motorsport.

Well, something like that. Go out of the white lines and lose KERS for 2 laps, or the chap within a second in front gets DRS ability instead, or something. Nope, that's all too gimmicky. Has to be a better way. Put really super sticky glue on the Tarmac bits, so they have to trudge through as silly slow speed. Yup, that'll work a treat.

[Kevp]

What about going back to the "catch fencing".

Stopped the car & the driver got hit on the head by flying fence posts. So a kind of built in reprimand.

[Melvin Udall]

Kevp said:

What about going back to the "catch fencing".

Stopped the car & the driver got hit on the head by flying fence posts. So a kind of built in reprimand.

Ouch. Never liked catch fencing. Always looked like the drivers could get garotted.

[Use Psychology]

just make sure there is a 5 - 10 metres wide strip of grass/dirt/dust before the surface changes to tarmac again. penalty for running wide rather a time advantage, and you still get the safety benefits of tarmac run off.

[Melvin Udall]

Use Psychology said:

just make sure there is a 5 - 10 metres wide strip of grass/dirt/dust before the surface changes to tarmac again. penalty for running wide rather a time advantage, and you still get the safety benefits of tarmac run off.

I prefer my glue idea.

[Some Gump]

Replace the tarmac run off with a 1950's jalopy full of manure. If biff runs wide, he'll then have to deal with the manure (which he doesn't like).

[Use Psychology]

Melvin Udall said:

I prefer my glue idea.

Oh yes, that well known conputergame option. We coil also have invisible walls that you would smash into and invisible kerbs that flip you instantly when you cut corners.