Cost of 'drives' in motorsport?

[Fantuzzi]

Ive seen a few posts asking if there are any drives available and see many on racecar direct, yet hardly ever do they state the costs, understandably its rather more complex than a one off fee,as there are many aspects that you cant account for (repairs ect.

So I thought Id ask if any one knew of costs say for a GT4 drive in British GT as that seems to be a pretty popular one, usually in a Ginetta G50! Or a G50 drive in the supercup.

Thanks!

Edited by Fantuzzi on Thursday 3rd May 00:22

[xr287]

This isn't exactly what you're looking for but you might still find it interesting. These were 2007 prices for a pretty decent team, as in one that had drivers winning some races.



For the Renault Clio cup based on you doing the whole season each round was £4,000 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, brake pads and a couple of gearbox rebuilds

For the Seat Cupra Championship based on you doing the whole season each round was £6,500 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, and brake pads



Both these prices are based on providing your own car and didn't include any testing or the championship registration and race entry fees. They also don't include insurance or any contingency for damage or any parts that need replaced due to wear or tear.

[Rex Ironstone]

xr287 said:

This isn't exactly what you're looking for but you might still find it interesting. These were 2007 prices for a pretty decent team, as in one that had drivers winning some races.



For the Renault Clio cup based on you doing the whole season each round was £4,000 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, brake pads and a couple of gearbox rebuilds

For the Seat Cupra Championship based on you doing the whole season each round was £6,500 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, and brake pads



Both these prices are based on providing your own car and didn't include any testing or the championship registration and race entry fees. They also don't include insurance or any contingency for damage or any parts that need replaced due to wear or tear.

Doesn't seem like a very good deal really.

[woof]

GT drive - about £8-10k
Porsche Cup (Brit) - £15-20k per race weekend
Touring Cars in a top team - £50-75k per meeting.
British F3 - £500k 1million season.
GP2 - €2.5M
F1 - Petrov brought nearly €20 million into Caterham for his drive

Of course that doesn't include insurance or damage budgets

[eddie99]

And on the other end of the scale, club level drives from £800 a meeting.

[Life Saab Itch]

xr287 said:

This isn't exactly what you're looking for but you might still find it interesting. These were 2007 prices for a pretty decent team, as in one that had drivers winning some races.



For the Renault Clio cup based on you doing the whole season each round was £4,000 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, brake pads and a couple of gearbox rebuilds

For the Seat Cupra Championship based on you doing the whole season each round was £6,500 +vat per meeting. Which included all your consumables like tyres, fluids, fuel, and brake pads



Both these prices are based on providing your own car and didn't include any testing or the championship registration and race entry fees. They also don't include insurance or any contingency for damage or any parts that need replaced due to wear or tear.

'Kinell.



LSI Motorsports is available to run your race car in either of the above series for a grand less than the above prices.

Call me.

[Olivera]

woof said:

...
Porsche Cup (Brit) - £15-20k per race weekend
Touring Cars in a top team - £50-75k per meeting.
...

I'm curious, can anyone elaborate on why the BTCC is 2-3 times as expensive Porsche Carrera Cup?

[xr287]

Olivera said:

I'm curious, can anyone elaborate on why the BTCC is 2-3 times as expensive Porsche Carrera Cup?

I think as well as other things that there is generally more people involved in running each BTCC car than each Porsche so you have more salaries to pay. There's more testing and development because there is more scope for gaining an advantage since there's a range of different cars with different characteristics/aerodynamics and different engine builders etc. I think there is also more maintenance required so more gearbox, engine and suspension rebuilds. Things wear out more quickly and need to be stripped inspected and replaced more often etc. That's my understanding of it anyway.

[thunderbelmont]

Back in 2007, it COST me about £2000/round to run my ASCAR at Rockingham.

So if someone came asking to buy a drive, the rate would be in the order of £4000/round PLUS insurance - if they bend it, it has to be mended, and that can run into tens of thousands.

To build and develop a successful car can cost lots of bucks, so to expect to buy a drive for thruppence ha'penny isn't going to happen. BTCC is BIG budget stuff at the pointed end, regardless of the cost cutting measures put in by TOCA. It's cheaper, far cheaper, to run a Porsche in the supercup because parts are pretty well off the shelf from Porsche motorsport. For many of the BTCC cars, parts are bespoke, and thus cost accordingly.

You can buy a drive in a clubby series for around a grand a race. Don't expect much though, but do enjoy yourself. If you don't enjoy yourself, why are you doing it?

[EDLT]

A day in an autograss car is £125
http://www.leewoodautograss.org/rent-a-race-car/

[woof]

Olivera said:

woof said:

...
Porsche Cup (Brit) - £15-20k per race weekend
Touring Cars in a top team - £50-75k per meeting.
...

I'm curious, can anyone elaborate on why the BTCC is 2-3 times as expensive Porsche Carrera Cup?

Because the cars are more expensive - the running costs are higher and it's higher profile.
I'm sure you can do it cheaper but if you were to buy a drive with a front running, then yr looking at those costs.

[BTCC 318d]

It gets scary. My old man upgraded to Porsche cup in it's first year of being predominantly GT3 cup cars. We used 2 sets of tyres in 5 meetings. The average for the grid was 3 per weekend - we realised we were out of our spend and gave up! Porsche cup tyres used to be 1200 quid per set, so it was pretty big money if you wanted to do well.

In contrast, the mother started racing in an XR2. Far less glamerous, but when we dropped a rod, the replacement engine was 80 quid from Harry pringles. Kumho tyres (4 sets per season) at 400 quid ish weren't too bad.

If you want to go racing, go club - unless you're doiing it for the TV coverage - in which have sponsors, or you'll not be able to keep up with the sponsored big boys.

[woof]

Yep - it's not a cheap pastime
You can definitely do it a lot cheaper - www.daytonamax.co.uk for starters. OK it's karting but it's fast and the racing is super close. And costs about the same as what you'll spend in tyres over a Porsche weekend !

and the Caterham Academy is a great first step into racing - though don't expect just to pay the initial costs. You'll want to do a few upgrades, test. I'm instructing a guy at the moment and he's already £5k into the season with testing setups etc and it's only just begun. I think he's still in shock in how much it's really costing

[Rude-boy]

woof said:

The Caterham Academy is a great first step into racing - though don't expect just to pay the initial costs. You'll want to do a few upgrades, test. I'm instructing a guy at the moment and he's already £5k into the season with testing setups etc and it's only just begun. I think he's still in shock in how much it's really costing

I know a chap that was in one of the first cohorts for this back in the 1990’s who went on do drive quite a few other beasties. If you want to be at the pointy end you have to test and you have to spend far more than the basic numbers on bits and bobs.

I remember them speaking to Andy Miller about how they had only managed to find ½ second at Curborough when they spent a day playing with their damper settings. Andy’s reply was along the lines of have you any idea how much it costs to find that much time in F3...

[Daston]

One thing that gets me thinking is what happens regarding the costs of damages. For example you are having a fight for position towards the back of the pack when you loose it and take out the leader as they are coming through.

Of course the chap aint going to be best pleased and the team are going to be pretty upset with you too and might even take you of the christmas card list.

My question is what happens finacially do they come knocking on your garage door for some £££ as you clearly messed up or is it just bad luck and everyone moves on?

I remember an incident at the start of a TVR Challenge season when a lead car got shunted on the start and there was a big pile up. One of the girls got caught up in it in a 3000M. They had to chuck in the season before it even started because they hadn't budgeted for a full car rebuild.

[designndrive62]

Daston said:

One thing that gets me thinking is what happens regarding the costs of damages. For example you are having a fight for position towards the back of the pack when you loose it and take out the leader as they are coming through.

Of course the chap aint going to be best pleased and the team are going to be pretty upset with you too and might even take you of the christmas card list.

My question is what happens finacially do they come knocking on your garage door for some £££ as you clearly messed up or is it just bad luck and everyone moves on?

I remember an incident at the start of a TVR Challenge season when a lead car got shunted on the start and there was a big pile up. One of the girls got caught up in it in a 3000M. They had to chuck in the season before it even started because they hadn't budgeted for a full car rebuild.

You pay for your own damage, whatever happens or how it was caused. The only series anything different was talked about was the new F2 where I know the idea was talked about whereby if there was an accident the stewards would decide whos fault the collision was and they would have to pay for the damage caused but I doubt this ever got beyond the boardroom table to be honest.

[Rude-boy]

designndrive62 said:

You pay for your own damage, whatever happens or how it was caused. The only series anything different was talked about was the new F2 where I know the idea was talked about whereby if there was an accident the stewards would decide whos fault the collision was and they would have to pay for the damage caused but I doubt this ever got beyond the boardroom table to be honest.

Wouldn't ever really work. Apart from anything else it is often a nightmare to work out who was at fault, hence the term "Racing Accident"!

IIRC FPA had a fund that you all paid @£15k (pro rata) into at the start of the season to cover damage but I can’t remember how it actually worked out.

[xr287]

BTCC 318d said:

Porsche cup tyres used to be 1200 quid per set, so it was pretty big money if you wanted to do well.

They are now £1700 a set. I hear a lot of the grid are using 3 sets or more at each testday which adds up to a pretty serious annual tyre budget!

Edited by xr287 on Friday 4th May 13:53

[Life Saab Itch]

Rude-boy said:

Wouldn't ever really work. Apart from anything else it is often a nightmare to work out who was at fault, hence the term "Racing Accident"!

IIRC FPA had a fund that you all paid @£15k (pro rata) into at the start of the season to cover damage but I can’t remember how it actually worked out.

£15K is about right. It went into a central fund and damage was taken out of there. Sometimes a top up to the fund was required. Each accident had a £1500 excess requirement too.

Something interesting to note. The only person I ever heard of who requested a price list to go with the parts list was Martin Brundle when Alex started racing. Iirc Martin took out damage insurance and insured the excess!!



Gearbox rebuilds were absorbed in with the championship entry costs, but there was a £100 fine every time you went over the rev limit of the engine. I seem to remember one driver having a £600 bill just for that after one weekend...



I'm not sure if that's how they run F2 as well, but it's how FPA worked for 12 years and Jonathan still has his helicopter, so one imagines it worked out....

[woof]

Crash damage is never fun or cheap !
Even worse when someone else punts you off. But that's motorsport.
Taking out race insurance is certainly worthwhile in someone's early years and if it's not your car !