cheap level field racing
Discussion
white rabbit said:
could anyone recommend some good cheap level playing field racing, i'm currently into bike racing but thinking of giving the cars a go
cheers
You cold have a look at the following:cheers
Max-5, Porsche 924, Fiat Uno, etc. A one-make series is likely to have tighter restrictions and regulations.
HOWEVER - no amount of technical regulations can stop the bloke in Car 42 from fitting a new set of tyres for every meeting. Or stop the bloke in Car 27 from testing before every race meeting. Or stop the bloke in Car 9 from getting an engine rebuild every 6 meetings. Or stop the bloke in Car 5 from personal coaching.
So it all depends on your definition of 'cheap'. As I once said to Mario*, "speed costs, how fast do you want to go?".
(* Mario in my local chip shop, not Andretti)
The short answer is there isn't a level playing field, no matter what vehicle you're in. The team who won the 2CV 24hrs last year spent over 10k on just the race weekend, stark contrast to our paltry budget, but they qualified on pole and never looked back.
If you have a series that "must use standard production heads" the guys with the money will buy and flow test 20 OEM heads to see which has the best flow rate within the manufacturers tolerances and use that one (then sell the remainder to the rest of the field. If you're not allowed to use vernier pulleys, someone in the field will use an offset woodruff key to best setup their engine, etc etc. Unless all the cars are identical and setup by the same people (for example Formula Palmer Audi) you'll never get a level playing field, and even in such series you get "preferred drivers". Then obviously there is driver training, track time and all the extra factors outside of the car.
Sorry to pop the bubble but the playing field is only as level as you make it
Regards
Iain
If you have a series that "must use standard production heads" the guys with the money will buy and flow test 20 OEM heads to see which has the best flow rate within the manufacturers tolerances and use that one (then sell the remainder to the rest of the field. If you're not allowed to use vernier pulleys, someone in the field will use an offset woodruff key to best setup their engine, etc etc. Unless all the cars are identical and setup by the same people (for example Formula Palmer Audi) you'll never get a level playing field, and even in such series you get "preferred drivers". Then obviously there is driver training, track time and all the extra factors outside of the car.
Sorry to pop the bubble but the playing field is only as level as you make it
Regards
Iain
V8 Trophy.
400+bhp V8 NASCAR style Stockcars. Simple to work on, setup, repair, and fun fun fun to drive!
Provisional 2008 Calendar includes:
Snetterton x 1, Silverstone x 4, Rockingham (oval)x1?, Farnborough Air Show (sprint with pitstop challenge)x 1, Santa Pod (yep! a drag race!) x 1
Cars from £7K
Cars are all identical chassis/drivetrain, body styles are different (Chevy Monte-Carlo, Pontiac GrandPrix, and Ford Taurus).
Rob.
400+bhp V8 NASCAR style Stockcars. Simple to work on, setup, repair, and fun fun fun to drive!
Provisional 2008 Calendar includes:
Snetterton x 1, Silverstone x 4, Rockingham (oval)x1?, Farnborough Air Show (sprint with pitstop challenge)x 1, Santa Pod (yep! a drag race!) x 1
Cars from £7K
Cars are all identical chassis/drivetrain, body styles are different (Chevy Monte-Carlo, Pontiac GrandPrix, and Ford Taurus).
Rob.
I raced with the Caterham Gaduates for three seasons, three classes of cars ranging from £7k-£14k, but lose very little in depreciation (bought mine for £8.5k and sold for £10k after winning championship!)
All engines sealed and worked on by one nominated company (similar to Caterham 'official' series) everything else is STANDARD, if the regs don't specifically say that you CAN do something then you can't... works pretty well for the last 11years and currently 130ish racing members for 2008.
Team support is actively discouraged, as the club pay (ok, through subscriptions) for 'technical support' to be present. So, if anything breaks or falls off or gets damaged during testing/qualifying/racing then the owner just has to pay for parts.
In terms of a level playing field, I would say that there is very little difference, if any, in cars. Sure, anyone can break rules, but if someone suddenly became soooo much faster overnight then it would be a little too obvious and the mater dealt with accordingly. Bear in mind that last time the club raced at Silverstone the top 20 in qualifying were split by 1second....
... a fairly level playing field I would say?
All engines sealed and worked on by one nominated company (similar to Caterham 'official' series) everything else is STANDARD, if the regs don't specifically say that you CAN do something then you can't... works pretty well for the last 11years and currently 130ish racing members for 2008.
Team support is actively discouraged, as the club pay (ok, through subscriptions) for 'technical support' to be present. So, if anything breaks or falls off or gets damaged during testing/qualifying/racing then the owner just has to pay for parts.
In terms of a level playing field, I would say that there is very little difference, if any, in cars. Sure, anyone can break rules, but if someone suddenly became soooo much faster overnight then it would be a little too obvious and the mater dealt with accordingly. Bear in mind that last time the club raced at Silverstone the top 20 in qualifying were split by 1second....
... a fairly level playing field I would say?
thunderbelmont said:
V8 Trophy.
400+bhp V8 NASCAR style Stockcars. Simple to work on, setup, repair, and fun fun fun to drive!
Provisional 2008 Calendar includes:
Snetterton x 1, Silverstone x 4, Rockingham (oval)x1?, Farnborough Air Show (sprint with pitstop challenge)x 1, Santa Pod (yep! a drag race!) x 1
Cars from £7K
Cars are all identical chassis/drivetrain, body styles are different (Chevy Monte-Carlo, Pontiac GrandPrix, and Ford Taurus).
Rob.
Is this based on what used to be Eurocar/ VSR V8 and are they going to race with the "Super Silhouettes" and VSR V6 cars. I saw a VSR V6 Pontiac at the Autossport show with the new 2.5 litre Duratec engine. Looked OK but how much does the conversion from the 3 litre Ford Essex V6 cost?400+bhp V8 NASCAR style Stockcars. Simple to work on, setup, repair, and fun fun fun to drive!
Provisional 2008 Calendar includes:
Snetterton x 1, Silverstone x 4, Rockingham (oval)x1?, Farnborough Air Show (sprint with pitstop challenge)x 1, Santa Pod (yep! a drag race!) x 1
Cars from £7K
Cars are all identical chassis/drivetrain, body styles are different (Chevy Monte-Carlo, Pontiac GrandPrix, and Ford Taurus).
Rob.
There's also the MR2 Championship run by Rogue Motorsport (they also do an artive & drive scheme) & the 750 Motor Club. All cars entered have to remain pretty much stock and all run the same tyres etc... they try to keep it as level as poss.
Info:
http://mr2championship.freeforums.org/
There's also the MR2 Challenge Run by Dragon Motorsport which primarily caters for the MK1 MR2 - also similar rules apply.
Info:
www.mr2racing.com
Also as mentioned
Info:
http://mr2championship.freeforums.org/
There's also the MR2 Challenge Run by Dragon Motorsport which primarily caters for the MK1 MR2 - also similar rules apply.
Info:
www.mr2racing.com
Also as mentioned
What about FF1600? we have done several seasons now and have had some pretty fair results and have certainly upset the 'Pro' teams on several occasions.
If you fancy a test in our FF1600 get in touch and we can talk terms. We are looking to hire our car out on a regular basis this year whilst my son competes in the National Series. Having won Zetec rounds at National level, raced in F3 and the SCSCA series, he is well placed to offer driver coaching as well.
www.goughracing.co.uk is our site. Not bang up to date, but will give you a good idea.
Andy
If you fancy a test in our FF1600 get in touch and we can talk terms. We are looking to hire our car out on a regular basis this year whilst my son competes in the National Series. Having won Zetec rounds at National level, raced in F3 and the SCSCA series, he is well placed to offer driver coaching as well.
www.goughracing.co.uk is our site. Not bang up to date, but will give you a good idea.
Andy
sylva41 said:
Similar to the Caterham Grads (in terms of spec & cost), but faster.....
Definately quicker than 'Graduates' (renamed Classics to avoid confusion...that didn't work then) but there are SuperGrad & MegaGrad classes... and the MST results seem to suggest that the Megas are 0.5-1second a lap quicker than the Westfield Zetecs 
If you are looking for cheap and fun racing then have a look at the Tin tops series within the Classic Sports Car Club 40 min 2 driver format - you can buy a car from £2k up and have some fun - but if you wanted to try for an outright win you would be looking for a Honda integra Type R at about £20k but thats life.
Here's my vote for the Porsche 924's. The racing is VERY close ,and its a very friendly race series, i believe there are several cars cuurrently for sale on the website
www.porscheracingdrivers.co.uk
www.porscheracingdrivers.co.uk
My two-penneth (sp?).
www.mini7.co.uk
Been around 40+ years (no danger of the series folding after a couple of years) and the cars are proven, spares are plentiful and not expensive, series have very strict regulations, control tyres and a very friendly club in which to race.
Any series out there where people still lend each other bits, even whole race engines if things go t!ts up at a raceweekend?
www.mini7.co.uk
Been around 40+ years (no danger of the series folding after a couple of years
) and the cars are proven, spares are plentiful and not expensive, series have very strict regulations, control tyres and a very friendly club in which to race. Any series out there where people still lend each other bits, even whole race engines if things go t!ts up at a raceweekend?
FWDRacer said:
Any series out there where people still lend each other bits, even whole race engines if things go t!ts up at a raceweekend?
any of the Vintage series run by the VSCC - always seem to be swapping parts, helping each other fix things...always talked about as well in the caterham series - bonnet comes off and a crowd of willing helpers arrive
Chassis 33 said:
The short answer is there isn't a level playing field, no matter what vehicle you're in. The team who won the 2CV 24hrs last year spent over 10k on just the race weekend, stark contrast to our paltry budget, but they qualified on pole and never looked back.
WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Crazy on a SHIT BOX 2CV.
Forums | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff