Did Alonso throw away a win in Brasil?

[sjn2004]

As Alonso was only 12 secs behind Massa, why didn't he stay out and try and take the chequered flag? Massa pitted a lap latter but as Alonso had nothing to lose why didn't he stay out and go for the win hoping Massa either spins off/pits/or goes very slow and gets overtaken?


edited to point out that I forget he was driving the Ferrari service car

[Catherine197]

Well possibly because he had hoped Massa would win and then get the world championship.

I had understood that if Massa didn't win then he wouldn't have won the Championship.

[sjn2004]

Catherine197 said:

Well possibly because he had hoped Massa would win and then get the world championship.

I had understood that if Massa didn't win then he wouldn't have won the Championship.

True, but apparently Renault and Ferrari are different teams but you wouldn't have thought it. Did you notice Briatore go other and with Massa luck before the start?

[Rocky Balboa]

He said he would help Massa if possible?

[speedfreaky]

Correct ,FA has gone on record as saying he would do whatever he could to make sure LH didnt win the title.Taking points off Massa would hardly fit with that scenario .

[team underdog]

Gave the win to Massa my arse. Remember Spa? He rued not pitting earlier when it rained there and everyone on dries went backwards.

[Mr_Thyroid]

speedfreaky said:

Correct ,FA has gone on record as saying he would do whatever he could to make sure LH didnt win the title.Taking points off Massa would hardly fit with that scenario .

I'm sure he doesn't care that much. He'd take the win.

How much time did Glock gain over Hamilton? I think he finished about six seconds behind Hamilton. I would guess that he was more than that before the rain but not as much as eighteen seconds so I reckon Alonso would ultimately have lost out to Massa either way.

[Jungles]

speedfreaky said:

Correct ,FA has gone on record as saying he would do whatever he could to make sure LH didnt win the title.Taking points off Massa would hardly fit with that scenario .

Don't exaggerate. He didn't say he would do whatever he could to make sure LH didn't win the title. He simply said if he can help Massa then he would.

In this case, he could not have helped Massa in any meaningful way. He would have lost time because of the rain.

Edited by Jungles on Wednesday 5th November 03:25

[kevin ritson]

The point being that Glock no more helped Hamilton than Alonso with Massa. At least the conspiracy theories balance themselves out on this one.

[garycat]

If Alonso wants a seat at Ferrari, it would have done his cause no good at all to deprive Massa of the (a) a race win and (b) a possibility of the championship.

[Bombjack]

Glock made up about 15 seconds by staying out I think. Alonso could perhaps have won, but it wasn't the percentage move - the rain held off for longer than expected as it was.

[greygoose]

garycat said:

If Alonso wants a seat at Ferrari, it would have done his cause no good at all to deprive Massa of the (a) a race win and (b) a possibility of the championship.

I know conspiracy theories are popular in here but this is just nonsense.

Using your logic Ferrari would still be upset that Alonso beat Schumacher to the title in 2006 and so wouldn't consider employing him.

[mattikake]

"Did Alonso throw away a win in Brasil?"

Yes. Threw too many tantrums and got sacked from McLaren. If it wasn't for that he very well could've won this race.

[jonnylayze]

greygoose said:

garycat said:

If Alonso wants a seat at Ferrari, it would have done his cause no good at all to deprive Massa of the (a) a race win and (b) a possibility of the championship.

I know conspiracy theories are popular in here but this is just nonsense.

Using your logic Ferrari would still be upset that Alonso beat Schumacher to the title in 2006 and so wouldn't consider employing him.

Whatever else you might think about Alonso is a racer for whom winning is everything- I am sure that he would have gone for the win if he felt he could have done - he didn't pit to simply handicap himslef and prevent himself from winning. In fact, 5 laps from the end it looked as if it was about to rain very hard. In fact it was the delay in the rain which nearly cost Hamilton the championship. IMO, those who pitted had no option but to do so. It was the conservative strategy. Conversely, in not stopping, Glock took a risk which very nearly paid off by catapulting up the order.

[anonymous-user]

Fred would not have tried to pass Massa, his face on the podium told you that, talk about having swallowed a wasp.

Fred had no incentive to try and win, it wouldn't have increased the finishing position of himself or Renault in the championship and it would have cost him $4,000 more for his superlicence next year. He did have an incentive not to win, that of losing Lewis and McLaren the championship.

[VladD]

johnfelstead said:

Fred would not have tried to pass Massa, his face on the podium told you that, talk about having swallowed a wasp.

Fred had no incentive to try and win, it wouldn't have increased the finishing position of himself or Renault in the championship and it would have cost him $4,000 more for his superlicence next year. He did have an incentive not to win, that of losing Lewis and McLaren the championship.

I'm not so sure. I was watching the race with a mate and we discussed this point when Alonso got ahead of Lewis when they changed from inters to slicks. Alonso has a huge hunger for winning, and given a sniff of the top step I don't think he'd even think about it. These guys are all about winning, it's what's driven them from a very early age.

However, assuming that he did want to help Massa, why would he just not take the lead and then monitor what was happening? He could easily have thrown in off the track on the last lap to let Massa past if he wanted Massa to have the win, but if Lewis had a disaster Alonso could still win the race and give Massa the championship. Massa had everything under control in Brazil. He seems unstopable there at the moment.

[anonymous-user]

VladD said:

Alonso has a huge hunger for winning

He has an even bigger chip on his shoulder regarding Lewis and McLaren.

In any other race i agree he would try to win, but not that one, with what was at stake. Him taking the lead then giving it back is fantasy land stuff.

[VladD]

johnfelstead said:

VladD said:

Alonso has a huge hunger for winning

He has an even bigger chip on his shoulder regarding Lewis and McLaren.

In any other race i agree he would try to win, but not that one, with what was at stake. Him taking the lead then giving it back is fantasy land stuff.

No offence John, but the whole thread is fantasy, it's just the degrees that vary.

[andyps]

johnfelstead said:

Fred would not have tried to pass Massa, his face on the podium told you that, talk about having swallowed a wasp.

Fred had no incentive to try and win, it wouldn't have increased the finishing position of himself or Renault in the championship and it would have cost him $4,000 more for his superlicence next year. He did have an incentive not to win, that of losing Lewis and McLaren the championship.

I think that if he had the chance to pass Massa he is enough of a racer to do so, and Renault are a competitive team who would expect him to do so. His duty is to his current employer, and I can't imagine Renault being impressed if one of their drivers could have won the race but chose not to in order to ensure one particular team/driver other than Renault won the championship. He may have little choice but to race for Renault next year, finishing the last race of the season by not trying to fin for them would not help his situation.

I suspect he would happily pay the $4000 for an extra win to his name.