Why such tiny numbers on F1 cars?
Discussion
Just watching the Daytona 500 for the first time sporting these massive numbers on the roof and doors, why do F1 cars have tiny numbers hidden amongst their sponsorship livery, it is not always easy to differentiate between teams with similar colours, Ferrari is easy, but why make it so hard to tell the drivers apart? The wet race in brazil was a classic example, whats wrong with a huge number on the rear wing, top and bottom?
Or is there some other way of identifying who is who that nobody told me about?
Or is there some other way of identifying who is who that nobody told me about?
Jetl3on said:
Just watching the Daytona 500 for the first time sporting these massive numbers on the roof and doors, why do F1 cars have tiny numbers hidden amongst their sponsorship livery, it is not always easy to differentiate between teams with similar colours, Ferrari is easy, but why make it so hard to tell the drivers apart? The wet race in brazil was a classic example, whats wrong with a huge number on the rear wing, top and bottom?
Or is there some other way of identifying who is who that nobody told me about?
If we're talking drivers of the same team, look at the onboard camera at the top of the car. 1st driver has a red one, 2nd driver a yellow one.Or is there some other way of identifying who is who that nobody told me about?
But regarding the numbers, yes they should be a bit bigger, but that eats into sponsors advertising space which brings in a hell of a lot of cash,
In NASCAR, the entrant (team) owns the rights to its number. It does not arbitrarily come with the previous year's finishing position in points, nor is it computer-generated. Thus the Wood Brothers, for example, have had #21 for more than 40 years; likewise Petty Enterprises' #43.
The other factor is that in NASCAR there are some very large circuits. One of the virtues of oval track racing is that almost all the spectators can see almost all the circuit almost all the time. You often will need to be able to discern the numbers from a distance in order to know who is doing what to whom. This is in contrast to the girly racing done on circuits where you sit at a bend, have a sandwich and a drink, watch the cars come past for all of about 5 seconds, and then have another drink and sandwich and quick nap before they come 'round again.
The other factor is that in NASCAR there are some very large circuits. One of the virtues of oval track racing is that almost all the spectators can see almost all the circuit almost all the time. You often will need to be able to discern the numbers from a distance in order to know who is doing what to whom. This is in contrast to the girly racing done on circuits where you sit at a bend, have a sandwich and a drink, watch the cars come past for all of about 5 seconds, and then have another drink and sandwich and quick nap before they come 'round again.
flemke said:
In NASCAR, the entrant (team) owns the rights to its number. It does not arbitrarily come with the previous year's finishing position in points, nor is it computer-generated. Thus the Wood Brothers, for example, have had #21 for more than 40 years; likewise Petty Enterprises' #43.
That would explain it then, it's part of the teams own brand image and they've built it up like that.mike360 said:
Smaller numbers = more sponsor space
Many years ago the rules used to stipulate a minimum size (12"?)and white on black or black on white. Like many rules (eg only 2 mechanics to work on a car in the pits!!!!), this one seems to have quietly faded away in the interests of big business. The JPS cars started the rot IIRC.zac510 said:
Because nobody really cares what number it is.
In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
Absolutely, the number is irrelevant, but being able to identify which driver is which in identical cars or cars with similar livery should not be so challenging surely.In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
Jetl3on said:
zac510 said:
Because nobody really cares what number it is.
In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
Absolutely, the number is irrelevant, but being able to identify which driver is which in identical cars or cars with similar livery should not be so challenging surely.In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
Numbers have always been an intrinsic part of motorsport - including F1. For me, growing up in the 1960s and 70s, the numbers affixed to an F1 car were just as iconic as the national colours or the drivers' helmets. Indeed, numbers very often did become associated with individual drivers, such as Mansell's Red 5", Moss's "7" or Gilles Villeneuve's "27". So, once upon a time, F1 had as much affection for its car and driver numbers as other forms of motorsport.
But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
Munter said:
Jetl3on said:
zac510 said:
Because nobody really cares what number it is.
In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
Absolutely, the number is irrelevant, but being able to identify which driver is which in identical cars or cars with similar livery should not be so challenging surely.In the US they seem to make a big thing about 'the 46 car' or whatever, relating tracking the history of that number and giving it prestige and status.
Arguably the driver or team carries more importance than a mere number!
The Daytona race yesterday even had little popups with an arrow pointing to the exact car they are talking about, which was a nice touch for beginners like myself.
Eric Mc said:
Numbers have always been an intrinsic part of motorsport - including F1. For me, growing up in the 1960s and 70s, the numbers affixed to an F1 car were just as iconic as the national colours or the drivers' helmets. Indeed, numbers very often did become associated with individual drivers, such as Mansell's Red 5", Moss's "7" or Gilles Villeneuve's "27". So, once upon a time, F1 had as much affection for its car and driver numbers as other forms of motorsport.
But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
Dont the teams (other then last years winners) still get to pick numbers?But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
Munter said:
Eric Mc said:
Numbers have always been an intrinsic part of motorsport - including F1. For me, growing up in the 1960s and 70s, the numbers affixed to an F1 car were just as iconic as the national colours or the drivers' helmets. Indeed, numbers very often did become associated with individual drivers, such as Mansell's Red 5", Moss's "7" or Gilles Villeneuve's "27". So, once upon a time, F1 had as much affection for its car and driver numbers as other forms of motorsport.
But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
Dont the teams (other then last years winners) still get to pick numbers?But, as we all know, history, tradition and culture matter not a jot to modern F1. Every single iconic aspect of the "sport" is vulnerable to extinction in the modern era - historic tracks, historic countries,historic venues, numbers and other traditions have all gone by the board in the lunge for cash.
More's the pity.
There was an attempt a few years ago (although I can't remember which year - around 2001 0r 02 I think) to get the numbers fixed again so that only numbers 1 & 2 would swap and the other teams would keep the same numbers every year, but Sauber protested as they were due to be given numbers 7 & 8 to reflect having a particularly good season. If the numbers had been fixed they would have been allocated 16 & 17 (IIRC).
Edited by Teppic on Friday 13th February 14:50
Technically they don't - but not everyone has access to all the lap timing telemetry - especially spectators at the circuit who have to rely on their Mark 1 eyeball.
I really think it is a shame that the numbers have become so irrelevant. To me, they were always part of what competition cars were all about.
I really think it is a shame that the numbers have become so irrelevant. To me, they were always part of what competition cars were all about.
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