Is Brawn going to get caught by Red Bull?

[wanacoop]

With EVERYONE at the BBC talking about this being the end of the Brawn dominance, and now working out how Button needs to come no worse than 4th in the remaining races, do you all feel the same? Or, do you think that RedBull obviously have a great car, and a great new package, but Silverstone was the perfect track for them, and Brawn can still challenge for some wins?

[heebeegeetee]

We'll have to wait and see.

[groomi]

Red Bull are certainly the quickest on low drag, fast cicuits. So expect them to dominate again at Monza.

I still think Brawn have the best balanced car with mechanical grip and easy on it's tyres. There will still be some circuits remaining where the Brawn will have the edge. The key will be to keep ahead of the improving Ferrari's and Rosberg's Williams when it's not the best car...

[PurelyRetro]

We'll have to see if the conditions suits the Brawns.

[FourWheelDrift]

Weather permitting (as in expected hot or cooler/wet conditions) I expect the two to dominate these remaining tracks. If unusual weather conditions do not materialise.

Red Bull quicker in cooler conditions @
Germany
Belgium

Brawns quicker in normally hotter conditions @
Hungary
Europe (Valencia)
Japan (Suzuka)
Brazil
Abu Dhabi

Undecided @
Italy
Singapore

Italy which could go both ways based on Vettels performance last year and Singapore being a cooler night race but humid.

[jbudgie]

It'll be Brawn from Red Bull from Red Bull from Brawn from --from ---from-----

[groomi]

jbudgie said:

It'll be Brawn from Red Bull from Red Bull from Brawn from --from ---from-----

Why does this annoy people so? It's been a standard way of reading the running order in races for donkeys years...

Edited by groomi on Monday 22 June 22:58

Edited by groomi on Monday 22 June 22:58

[LocoBlade]

FourWheelDrift said:

Red Bull quicker in cooler conditions @
Germany
Belgium

Brawns quicker in normally hotter conditions @
Hungary
Europe (Valencia)
Japan (Suzuka)
Brazil
Abu Dhabi

Undecided @
Italy
Singapore

I think a lot will depend on the tyres Bridgestone bring as well, if they turn out to be slightly conservative erring on the hard side for a particular weekend, it will suit Red Bull who can generate more heat for a given compound, if they're a shade soft and teams struggle to make them last as they have been for a few races this season, it will help Brawn slightly who are very kind on their tyres.

Regarding your predictions, I agree with Spa being a Red Bull track but Im personally not sure about them being quicker in Germany. Nurburgring is more of a point and squirt track with some big braking zones rather than fast flowing corners like Silverstone, so even if its as cool as last weekend I think the Brawns should be able to get more temperature in their tyres and Red Bull won't be able to exploit their superior high speed downforce advantage as there's no real fast corners. If its cool then I see it being close, if it's warmer then the Brawns should have an advantage I think.

For similar reasons I think Suzuka might suit the Red Bulls even if it's hot, as long as they can look after their tyres, due to the fast flowing first sector and 130R obviously

Edited by LocoBlade on Monday 22 June 22:32

[anonymous-user]

Adrian has obviously done a cracking job of his B spec car, but don't expect that advantage to continue, Brawn has a major update of their own coming very soon.

It will be closer than now, but i expect Brawn have too big a lead and a very good car even without the updates to hold out for the season.

[s3fella]

yes

[Murph7355]

Perhaps one of the bigger issues for Red Bull will be Webber and Vettel taking points from each other.

Same could be said at Brawn, but suspect the running order of those, if close in qualifying, is already settled.

[Big_Kahuna]

FourWheelDrift said:

Undecided @
Italy
Singapore

Singapore is still 30 degrees Celcius plus at night.

The night time track temperature will be cooler though.

• edited to add Celcius

Edited by Big_Kahuna on Tuesday 23 June 08:16

[matt frost]

Vettel is only 25 points behind...that is nothing at this stage.....Hamilton lost these points in 3 races and he is much better than Button Especially with Button and Vettel never being in an F1 Championship battle before, who knows how either of them will handle the pressure at the end?

But they were saying Silverstone did flatter the Red Bull's so we will have to see what happens at the next few races. I bet Brawn aren't feeling too comfortable right now. At least it could be beginning to become exciting.

I love how Button does 1 bad race and blames the car though, its still the best or 2nd best car out there easily, and there is a big gap to 3rd.

[groomi]

matt frost said:

I love how Button does 1 bad race and blames the car though, its still the best or 2nd best car out there easily, and there is a big gap to 3rd.

Practice and qualifying followed the familiar pattern of Barrichello being on the pace but Button not. Except previously, in the last session Button has changed some settings (I believe to reflect Barrichello's set-up) and then got a last-gasp pole. This time there was no such improvement and the race set-up still wasn't as good as Barrichello's.

Could it be that Rubens is no longer sharing set-up info?

[FourWheelDrift]

They do share each others information and will do but considering they like the car to handle differently they will never be running each others complete setup when happy with the car.

[Jungles]

Red Bull's success was only conditional, I fear. As others have said, the RB5 likes low temp, high speed circuits. There aren't that many of those on the calendar. The BGP is still the better car for most race conditions.

FourWheelDrift said:

They do share each others information and will do but considering they like the car to handle differently they will never be running each others complete setup when happy with the car.

I wonder how different their preferences are? Webber said that he and Vettel like similar setups, so that makes Red Bull's job easier than if they had completely different preferences. I would have have thought that Barrichello, with his vast experience, would be able to adapt himself to a wide range of setups.

[ewenm]

Jungles said:

I wonder how different their preferences are? Webber said that he and Vettel like similar setups, so that makes Red Bull's job easier than if they had completely different preferences. I would have have thought that Barrichello, with his vast experience, would be able to adapt himself to a wide range of setups.

There are lots of stories about Barrichello struggling to adapt to left-foot braking when the clutch pedal was removed so I'm not sure how flexible he is on setup. I'd have thought his engineers would be able to provide him with his best setup regardless of Button's setup (within the parameters of the car anyway).

[FourWheelDrift]

Schumacher always liked his car to have some understeer and I can't remember if Rubens was the same or the opposite.

[anonymous-user]

groomi said:

matt frost said:

I love how Button does 1 bad race and blames the car though, its still the best or 2nd best car out there easily, and there is a big gap to 3rd.

Practice and qualifying followed the familiar pattern of Barrichello being on the pace but Button not. Except previously, in the last session Button has changed some settings (I believe to reflect Barrichello's set-up) and then got a last-gasp pole. This time there was no such improvement and the race set-up still wasn't as good as Barrichello's.

Could it be that Rubens is no longer sharing set-up info?

The Brawn team made a mistake and called Button in when he was on is last flying lap, he should have been 4th on the grid, not 6th. Had they not done that he wouldn't have been stuck behind Trulli and we would have seen a Red Bull 1-2, Brawn 3-4 finish. Nothing fundamental has changed regarding Buttons pace, they just reaped the result of a cockup in qualy.

[Melman Giraffe]

wanacoop said:

With EVERYONE at the BBC talking about this being the end of the Brawn dominance, and now working out how Button needs to come no worse than 4th in the remaining races, do you all feel the same? Or, do you think that RedBull obviously have a great car, and a great new package, but Silverstone was the perfect track for them, and Brawn can still challenge for some wins?

Silverstone and the temp favoured the Red Bull

thats all!!