I can't help thinking Honda are still kicking themselves

[RedexR]

As the title says


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80544


lets face it they paid for the majority of that achievement but got absolutely no publicity , one season more and they may have achieved the same result if their engine was reasonably competitive.

[kevin ritson]

It will probably go down in history as one of the biggest mistakes in the sport, however to their credit the way they handled it and allowed the Brawn team to exist appears to have brought them a lot of respect that perhaps won't be winging its way to, say, BMW or Toyota.

[aeropilot]

RedexR said:

one season more and they may have achieved the same result if their engine was reasonably competitive.

Which it wasn't, judging by the enthusiam the Brawn team had for the MB engine in comparison.

Had Honda stayed, Red Bull would have won both champs imho.

[williamp]

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

[10 Pence Short]

williamp said:

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

If it wasn't for Honda investing in the region of £100m into a team they had already sold, there wouldn't have been any workforce.

Either way, the Honda engine wasn't competitive enough and I agree with the poster above in that Red Bull would probably have won at least the drivers championship were it not for the Mercedes one.

[llewop]

aeropilot said:

RedexR said:

one season more and they may have achieved the same result if their engine was reasonably competitive.

Which it wasn't, judging by the enthusiam the Brawn team had for the MB engine in comparison.

Had Honda stayed, Red Bull would have won both champs imho.

possibly - but then the Honda may have been able to have a similar 'equalisation' that Renault benefitted from last winter, so would have at least been respectable. After all, the Renault lump seemed pretty decent this year! Whereas last year they were definitely moaning about having been left behind.

[matc]

10 Pence Short said:

williamp said:

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

If it wasn't for Honda investing in the region of £100m into a team they had already sold, there wouldn't have been any workforce.

Did they not 'invest' the £100m because this was cheaper than paying redundancies to the 700 odd staff they employ? Dont't think they did it out of the goodness of their hearts TBH.

[10 Pence Short]

matc said:

10 Pence Short said:

williamp said:

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

If it wasn't for Honda investing in the region of £100m into a team they had already sold, there wouldn't have been any workforce.

Did they not 'invest' the £100m because this was cheaper than paying redundancies to the 700 odd staff they employ? Dont't think they did it out of the goodness of their hearts TBH.

Statutary redundancy wouldn't have cost anywhere near £100m. The goodwill and respect it brought them was probably with it, to them.

[DSM2]

llewop said:

aeropilot said:

RedexR said:

one season more and they may have achieved the same result if their engine was reasonably competitive.

Which it wasn't, judging by the enthusiam the Brawn team had for the MB engine in comparison.

Had Honda stayed, Red Bull would have won both champs imho.

possibly - but then the Honda may have been able to have a similar 'equalisation' that Renault benefitted from last winter, so would have at least been respectable. After all, the Renault lump seemed pretty decent this year! Whereas last year they were definitely moaning about having been left behind.

It probably wasn't possible to get that engine anywhere near equalization. By all accounts it was one of the real issues behind the poor performances but, for obvious reasons, no-one at Honda could say that.

As for the Renault, I think that engine was more than good enough at the latter end of 2008, before any equalisation.

[matc]

10 Pence Short said:

matc said:

10 Pence Short said:

williamp said:

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

If it wasn't for Honda investing in the region of £100m into a team they had already sold, there wouldn't have been any workforce.

Did they not 'invest' the £100m because this was cheaper than paying redundancies to the 700 odd staff they employ? Dont't think they did it out of the goodness of their hearts TBH.

Statutary redundancy wouldn't have cost anywhere near £100m. The goodwill and respect it brought them was probably with it, to them.

According to the reports at the time it would have:

Daily Mail said:

Brawn persuaded the company to bequeath the £100m dowry rather than fork out a similar amount on making the 700 staff at the Brackley factory redundant.

From:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/artic...

I agree they should be kicking themselves; it was common knowledge that they had spent the whole year developing the car for the 2009 season, so why they decided not to see it through is crazy; but I guess with the world on the brink of an economic meltdown they thought they were making the right decision.

[10 Pence Short]

Lines totted out to the media are rarely the real truth.

[DSM2]

matc said:

10 Pence Short said:

matc said:

10 Pence Short said:

williamp said:

Tough. I have no sympathy for Honda at all. The way the unceremoniously announced it, woithout giving a thought to the workforce. Well done for the workforce for an incredable turn-around.

If it wasn't for Honda investing in the region of £100m into a team they had already sold, there wouldn't have been any workforce.

Did they not 'invest' the £100m because this was cheaper than paying redundancies to the 700 odd staff they employ? Dont't think they did it out of the goodness of their hearts TBH.

Statutary redundancy wouldn't have cost anywhere near £100m. The goodwill and respect it brought them was probably with it, to them.

According to the reports at the time it would have:

Daily Mail said:

Brawn persuaded the company to bequeath the £100m dowry rather than fork out a similar amount on making the 700 staff at the Brackley factory redundant.

From:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/artic...

I agree they should be kicking themselves; it was common knowledge that they had spent the whole year developing the car for the 2009 season, so why they decided not to see it through is crazy; but I guess with the world on the brink of an economic meltdown they thought they were making the right decision.

Don't forget that almost 300 of that 700 did get made redundant.

The terms were payment in lieu of notice (typically 3 months), plus statutory redundancy and 1 week's salary for every year of employment. Unlikely to add up to £100M. The majority would have got less than £20K or so.

[hairyben]

Apart from the engine issue, Brawn/Honda is a fantastic example of why F1 teams can't be run when shackled to the management board of a big car company, overlooking and approving everything "their" team is doing. Even with a better engine would the honda RA109 have won? Would honda PLC have let Ross take a gamble on the double diffuser, or decided it to be bad publicity, and all the other decisions he made throughout the year as the man in complete control? Would they have descended with another layer of bureaucracy when RB whined that he felt Jens was being favourited, instead of ross pulling him aside and dealing with it quietly? Who knows...