Double Diffuser ban in 2011 - Autosport
Discussion
Formula 1 teams are closing in on a move to ban double diffusers in a bid to cut downforce and slow the cars down from the start of the 2011 season, AUTOSPORT can reveal.
The introduction of double diffusers into F1 caused huge controversy at the start of last season, when rivals protested the concept that was used to great effect by Brawn GP, Williams and Toyota in the opening races of the campaign.
The matter eventually went to the FIA International Court of Appeal, where the double diffuser was deemed fully legal and other teams had to revise the rear end of their cars to make the most of the extra downforce the design produced.
However, with downforce and car speeds having increased since then - and the diffuser designs getting increasingly more complicated - sources have revealed that moves are now afoot to change the F1 regulations to outlaw them completely.
On the back of predictions that the downforce levels of cars will this season potentially go beyond what they were at the end of 2008, teams have decided to take action.
AUTOSPORT understands that technical chiefs discussed reducing downforce levels in a meeting of FOTA's Technical Regulations Working Group (TRWG) late last year, and agreed that the rules should be changed to effectively outlaw double diffusers.
The teams want to create regulations that require the floor to be a continuous section if taken through a longitudinal or lateral plane - which if achieved will get rid of the 'slots' in the floor that have made the double diffuser concept work.
It is understood that efforts are now being made to sort out the wording of the regulations to ensure that there are no loopholes that will allow anyone to continue using a double diffuser.
Once the wording of the rules has been sorted, it will then be put to the FIA's official Technical Working Group for ratification prior to going through the channels required for it to get put into the 2011 regulations.
It is estimated that the reduction in downforce caused by the double diffuser ban would result in the cars being slowed by around one second per lap.
Lotus' chief technical officer Mike Gascoyne confirmed to AUTOSPORT that the move was being made, and it was one he supported.
"I think it is exactly right," he said. "It is what we should do, and it is what both FOTA and the FIA are looking at for 2011. I think it is very sensible and very easy to do – just tighten up the regulations and it is done."
Gascoyne did not believe that the double diffuser ban would have that big an impact in terms of helping overtaking, though.
When asked if he felt the widespread use of double diffusers in F1 had hindered overtaking, Gascoyne said: "I don't think there was a reduction in overtaking, but the changes to improve overtaking didn't help. And in fact, if you look at the numbers, it was never going to.
"But if you look at it carefully, what the [F1 teams'] aero group set out to achieve it actually did, and if you take the diffuser away it will do exactly what it said on the tin. Unfortunately that will never help you overtake anyone."
Although the majority of teams support the move, some outfits are unhappy about the double diffuser ban because it will mean an expensive redesign of the entire rear end of the car, including the gearbox and rear suspension, for 2011.
The introduction of double diffusers into F1 caused huge controversy at the start of last season, when rivals protested the concept that was used to great effect by Brawn GP, Williams and Toyota in the opening races of the campaign.
The matter eventually went to the FIA International Court of Appeal, where the double diffuser was deemed fully legal and other teams had to revise the rear end of their cars to make the most of the extra downforce the design produced.
However, with downforce and car speeds having increased since then - and the diffuser designs getting increasingly more complicated - sources have revealed that moves are now afoot to change the F1 regulations to outlaw them completely.
On the back of predictions that the downforce levels of cars will this season potentially go beyond what they were at the end of 2008, teams have decided to take action.
AUTOSPORT understands that technical chiefs discussed reducing downforce levels in a meeting of FOTA's Technical Regulations Working Group (TRWG) late last year, and agreed that the rules should be changed to effectively outlaw double diffusers.
The teams want to create regulations that require the floor to be a continuous section if taken through a longitudinal or lateral plane - which if achieved will get rid of the 'slots' in the floor that have made the double diffuser concept work.
It is understood that efforts are now being made to sort out the wording of the regulations to ensure that there are no loopholes that will allow anyone to continue using a double diffuser.
Once the wording of the rules has been sorted, it will then be put to the FIA's official Technical Working Group for ratification prior to going through the channels required for it to get put into the 2011 regulations.
It is estimated that the reduction in downforce caused by the double diffuser ban would result in the cars being slowed by around one second per lap.
Lotus' chief technical officer Mike Gascoyne confirmed to AUTOSPORT that the move was being made, and it was one he supported.
"I think it is exactly right," he said. "It is what we should do, and it is what both FOTA and the FIA are looking at for 2011. I think it is very sensible and very easy to do – just tighten up the regulations and it is done."
Gascoyne did not believe that the double diffuser ban would have that big an impact in terms of helping overtaking, though.
When asked if he felt the widespread use of double diffusers in F1 had hindered overtaking, Gascoyne said: "I don't think there was a reduction in overtaking, but the changes to improve overtaking didn't help. And in fact, if you look at the numbers, it was never going to.
"But if you look at it carefully, what the [F1 teams'] aero group set out to achieve it actually did, and if you take the diffuser away it will do exactly what it said on the tin. Unfortunately that will never help you overtake anyone."
Although the majority of teams support the move, some outfits are unhappy about the double diffuser ban because it will mean an expensive redesign of the entire rear end of the car, including the gearbox and rear suspension, for 2011.
Maybe they knew of Schumi's intent to join Brawn/Merc in 2010 and didn't want to upset the Status Quo?
Shame really, a single diffuser was the intent of the Overtaking Working Group to create some action. Interesting thing was, the Redbull was generally accepted to be the best interpretation of the OWG intent, but that car had the biggest problem of all following another in 2009... Must been those double diffusers kicking up all that dirty air?
Shame really, a single diffuser was the intent of the Overtaking Working Group to create some action. Interesting thing was, the Redbull was generally accepted to be the best interpretation of the OWG intent, but that car had the biggest problem of all following another in 2009... Must been those double diffusers kicking up all that dirty air?
paulmurr said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
used to great effect by Brawn GP, Williams and Toyota in the opening races of the campaign.
It wasn't.Should have been banned when first seen in testing at barcelona at the start of '09. Clearly a breach of the spirit of the rules, but once again weird fia logic prevailed. So most of the teams had to spend $$$$$$$$$$ redesigning their cars, now if they ban the devices they'll spend $$$$$$$$ designing new cars without double diffusers. And then they harp on about the need to reduce costs! 
Why try and slow the cars down? In terms of cost cutting doesn't this just mean they are going to have to redesign the cars again?
I wish they would just leave the teams alone to get on with it. Even though the article says FOTA and the FIA want the same things, its funny how they have to quote MG from Lotus who are in favour of it. I'm sure the bigger teams who can afford the development would want to keep things as they are.
I wish they would just leave the teams alone to get on with it. Even though the article says FOTA and the FIA want the same things, its funny how they have to quote MG from Lotus who are in favour of it. I'm sure the bigger teams who can afford the development would want to keep things as they are.
The thing I don't get is why they keep banning all these, frankly excellent, innovations. 6 wheeled cars; banned. The fan car; banned. Ground effect; banned. Turbocharging; banned (ok it took them years but thats not the point). Active suspension; banned. Traction control; banned. And of course there's probably more I've missed out. All of these innovations have or will influence road car design and are more useful advances than KERS.
Forgive any dodgy speeling and/or mindless rambling, due to my new best friend Mr Peroni.
Forgive any dodgy speeling and/or mindless rambling, due to my new best friend Mr Peroni.
holes! Makes no difference and just increases the cost of making the cars. In order to get innovation back into the sport we need rules stability. Then if somebody finds a way to make the car quicker and it's legal leave it!! That allows the fast thinking teams to get on terms with the "grandees". Otherwise all that happens is that teams spend millions on "refining" the cars meaning that the teams with most money have the advantage.
LordGrover said:
Is downforce something that can be measured?
If so, set a limit of 100 downforces per newton-pascals per metre or whatever it is and allow them to do what they like.
That was discussed a few years ago but unfortunately forgotten.If so, set a limit of 100 downforces per newton-pascals per metre or whatever it is and allow them to do what they like.
Maybe they feared that the engineers would be pushed to make the cars stiffer and stiffer and then potentially uncontrollable.
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