Red Bull - Traffic Problems?
Discussion
On Ten Tenths someone suggested that the RB6 has amazing speed but is poor in traffic after this weekend where they ended up being spectacularly average having lost out in pit stops. Could this be a problem that the RB6 has? The Ferraris charged right through the field as did Hamilton yet the Red Bulls seemed to struggle behind cars that by rights should have been an easy kill for them... I know that the Renault engine isn't the most powerful but neither of them really challenged the fastest lap either at any point later on. Shame because the car itself is a venerable rocket ship!
That may well tie in with Mark Hughes' column in Autosport this week, where he was suggesting that maybe the Red Bull produces most of its downforce from the upper bodywork / wings rather than the diffuser, because of the limitations of using the pull-rod suspension set up.
My (limited) understanding is that this would probably make the car less happy in the turbulent air created by the car(s) in front, because it would lose more of its overall downforce compared to a car which can generate more downforce from the diffuser.
Wanta996Gotta said:
I thought it was there front tyres graining quicker when following cars. I believe all cars have this issue but Redbulls problem seems worse in the wet or the dry.
Yep, caused by the lack of front downforce when following another car. The front wheels will slide rather than grip causing the build up of dead rubber on the surface of the tyre.The Red Bulls seem to suffer this worse than the other teams. McLaren don't seem to suffer this anywhere near as much.
zac510 said:
Webber did allude to 'certain conditions' in which the car did not work as well as it should. But he was intentionally being vague and you could interpret his comment to mean anything you like!
Was it because the driver wanted to get past the other driver at his home GP..... In those conditions the driver aids (feet) do not work satisfactorily and cause over-ambitious overtakes...... Or is that just me?
Jasandjules said:
zac510 said:
Webber did allude to 'certain conditions' in which the car did not work as well as it should. But he was intentionally being vague and you could interpret his comment to mean anything you like!
Was it because the driver wanted to get past the other driver at his home GP..... In those conditions the driver aids (feet) do not work satisfactorily and cause over-ambitious overtakes...... Or is that just me?
The front end doesnt work will in less than perfect conditions, so it washes out and causes enhanced tyre deg. In smooth air that front end is superb, makes the car extremely "pointy" and enables them to really stick it into the apex...its where they make all their time. Suddenly give them turbulent air and their advantage goes away and the lack of outright oomph from the Reggie unit shows up.
If you watch Seb and Webber drive, neither of them are really the most touchy feely of drivers. That front gives such massive confidence, just watch Seb on a hot lap and he just throws the thing into a corner and it sticks. He really piles into an apex and just hammers it through. There is none of BJs smooth arc or Hamilton's fingertip feel of where the grip is around the tarmac.
Its an awesome car in the dry and smooth air, so much grip and confidence for the drivers that they are just brutal with it. In less than optimal conditions though it shows up.
If you watch Seb and Webber drive, neither of them are really the most touchy feely of drivers. That front gives such massive confidence, just watch Seb on a hot lap and he just throws the thing into a corner and it sticks. He really piles into an apex and just hammers it through. There is none of BJs smooth arc or Hamilton's fingertip feel of where the grip is around the tarmac.
Its an awesome car in the dry and smooth air, so much grip and confidence for the drivers that they are just brutal with it. In less than optimal conditions though it shows up.
DJC said:
The front end doesnt work will in less than perfect conditions, so it washes out and causes enhanced tyre deg. In smooth air that front end is superb, makes the car extremely "pointy" and enables them to really stick it into the apex...its where they make all their time. Suddenly give them turbulent air and their advantage goes away and the lack of outright oomph from the Reggie unit shows up.
If you watch Seb and Webber drive, neither of them are really the most touchy feely of drivers. That front gives such massive confidence, just watch Seb on a hot lap and he just throws the thing into a corner and it sticks. He really piles into an apex and just hammers it through. There is none of BJs smooth arc or Hamilton's fingertip feel of where the grip is around the tarmac.
Its an awesome car in the dry and smooth air, so much grip and confidence for the drivers that they are just brutal with it. In less than optimal conditions though it shows up.
That is how I see it too. If you watch Seb and Webber drive, neither of them are really the most touchy feely of drivers. That front gives such massive confidence, just watch Seb on a hot lap and he just throws the thing into a corner and it sticks. He really piles into an apex and just hammers it through. There is none of BJs smooth arc or Hamilton's fingertip feel of where the grip is around the tarmac.
Its an awesome car in the dry and smooth air, so much grip and confidence for the drivers that they are just brutal with it. In less than optimal conditions though it shows up.
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