At the risk of a repost.........

[StuartMcKay]

........I had to post this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ex36B7pp5o

[Fire99]

exceptionally cool!! Cheers!

[khevolution]

great bit of video, but i've always wondered when looking at the car, how does an extra set of wheels turning on the front of the car actually help with the cornering, when there both sets of wheel are turning at the same angle?

[StuartMcKay]

khevolution said:

great bit of video, but i've always wondered when looking at the car, how does an extra set of wheels turning on the front of the car actually help with the cornering, when there both sets of wheel are turning at the same angle?

As it never caught on I'd think that they are more for show then anything else!!

[dougc]

Massive overrun fireworks

[.Adam.]

I think it was done for more aero reasons, with the smaller wheels having less drag, maybe they needed the extra to make up the grip lost from the larger wheels?

edit: Snap!

Edited by .Adam. on Wednesday 12th May 22:25

[LocoBlade]

It was all to do with aero and front end grip. There was a big advantage to reduce the frontal area so they went to 10" wheels at the front rather than 13", but using tyres that small wouldnt generate enough grip at the front, so they went with two sets to regain the grip lost by reducing wheel size.

[khevolution]

a quick catch up on wikipedia, says it was to increase the contact patch or rubber on the car due to a change in rules stating the front wheels to be smaller then the rears, nothing to do with cornering so it seems

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrrell_P34

[dr_gn]

LocoBlade said:

There was a big advantage to reduce the frontal area so they went to 10" wheels at the front rather than 13",

Frontal area was defined by the rear tyres, not the fronts.

[dr_gn]

khevolution said:

a quick catch up on wikipedia, says it was to increase the contact patch or rubber on the car due to a change in rules stating the front wheels to be smaller then the rears, nothing to do with cornering so it seems

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrrell_P34

It's got everything to do with cornering...the contact patch of the front wheels is obviously fundamental to this.

[khevolution]

OK I'll re phrase that, before i read that wiki page i was under the impression that increased the turning circle somehow, after reading it, it seems like that's not the case, more to do with increased grip so your able to take corners quicker....... I think

[LocoBlade]

dr_gn said:

LocoBlade said:

There was a big advantage to reduce the frontal area so they went to 10" wheels at the front rather than 13",

Frontal area was defined by the rear tyres, not the fronts.

Yeh OK perhaps slightly the wrong wording if you want to split hairs, but if you have a larger wheel at the front the air still has to go around it which is less efficient than having a smaller wheel there, regardless of how big or small the rear tyres are.

With smaller front wheels they could get the front bodywork lower and improve the overall aero of the car compared to having a 13" tyre at the front.

[dr_gn]

khevolution said:

OK I'll re phrase that, before i read that wiki page i was under the impression that increased the turning circle somehow, after reading it, it seems like that's not the case, more to do with increased grip so your able to take corners quicker....... I think

The concept was to streamline the front wheels within the front of the car, to reduce turbulence, drag & lift. Four front wheels were needed becasue of tyre wear issues and the smaller contact patch on the track.

Edited by dr_gn on Wednesday 12th May 23:03

[nsmith1180]

The car + The Tunnel = OHHHHHHHHH THE NOOOIIIIISSSEEEE

Thanks OP that was brill.

[Ahonen]

StuartMcKay said:

khevolution said:

great bit of video, but i've always wondered when looking at the car, how does an extra set of wheels turning on the front of the car actually help with the cornering, when there both sets of wheel are turning at the same angle?

As it never caught on I'd think that they are more for show then anything else!!

Do you honestly, genuinely think that Tyrrell went to all the trouble of designing and building something as radical as a 6-wheel F1 car and convincing Goodyear to make special tyres just for them mainly 'for show'?

I despair.

Edited by Ahonen on Thursday 13th May 01:19

[Evangelion]

I'd venture to suggest that this footage is not from an official practice session because:
1) the top bodywork is off so you can see what he's doing
2) I believe there was a rule in those days that onboard cameras were forbidden during official practice
3) his is the only car on the circuit.

Interesting to see how much suspension movement there is compared with today.

[anonymous-user]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/LAP-GODS-DVD-SET/dp/B002IF...

its from a video/dvd called "lap of the gods" well worth buying if you dont already have it.
this is what you get, the highlight for me is Patrick Depailler at long beach

OVER 3 HOURS OF SUPER RARE F1 FOOTAGE A DRIVER'S EYE VIEW OF AN A-Z OF GRAND PRIX CIRCUITS, FROM ADELAIDE TO ZOLDER... "These are two ideal DVDs for all you enthusiasts who enjoy "on-car" action during a GP meeting. The famous French director Alain Boisnard mounted a movie camera centrally behind the driver s head giving you a genuine "driver's eye" view of the track. The commentary comes from Murray Walker, who remains for many of us the definitive "Voice of Grand Prix racing". This is an opportunity to "drive" some of the most powerful F1 cars ever built on many of the greatest circuits in the World

PART 1
Patrick Tambay ( Renault ) at Adelaide
Mario Andretti ( Lotus ) at Anderstorp
Jackie Stewart ( Tyrrell )
Nigel Mansell ( Lotus ) at Brands Hatch
Jean-Pierre Jabouille ( Renault) at Buenos Aires
Eddie Cheever ( Renault ) and
Nelson Piquet ( Lotus ) at Detroit
Patrick Tambay ( Renault ) at Estoril
Didier Pironi ( Tyrrell ) at Hockenheim
Philippe Streiff ( Tyrrell ) at Hungaroring
Derek Warwick ( Renault ) at Imola
Alain Prost ( Renault ) at Kyalami
Patrick Depailler ( Tyrrell ) at Long Beach
Alain Prost ( Renault ) and Patrick Depailler ( six wheel Tyrrell ) at Monaco

PART 2
Patrick Depailler (Tyrrell) and Rene Arnoux at Montreal
Jacques Laffite (Ligier) and Eddie Cheever (Renault) at Monza
Eddie Cheever (Renault) and Patrick Tambay (Renault) at Osterreichring
Eddie Cheever (Renault) at Paul Ricard
Patrick Depailler (Tyrrell) at Rio de Janeiro
Jean-Pierre Jabouille (Renault) at Silverstone
Patrick Tambay (Renault) at Spa-Francorchamps
Alessandro Nannini (Minardi) and Satoru Nakajima (Lotus) at Suzuka
Didier Pironi (Tyrrell) at Watkins Glen
Alain Prost (Renault) at Zandvoort
Nikki Lauda (Brabham) at Zolder

[RB Will]

The overhead cam shows just how small the cars are with so little protection.

[LDN]

Apparently Ferrari thought about 6 wheels at one point. What about this Williams...

Edited by LDN on Thursday 13th May 12:18

[timbo48]

Seems strange watching somebody with only a steering wheel and gear shift to play with. I don't know how they managed in those days!