Ferrari say we don't care about the fans.

[skeggysteve]

Well as good as:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85587

"Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has told Formula 1 fans that he has 'no interest' in the furore that has been caused by his outfit using team orders to help Fernando Alonso win the German Grand Prix."

I know they say all publicity is good but sometime you have to wonder.

Or is Luca just digging a bigger hole for when they appear at the WMC?

[Daz68]

Srange statement to make considering they are still not in the clear. Sorry got it wrong
Todt has given the nod and wink behind closed doors. All pals together.

[Fire99]

Daz68 said:

Srange statement to make considering they are still not in the clear. Sorry got it wrong
Todt has given the nod and wink behind closed doors. All pals together.

I was under the impression that when Todt took on the job he wouldn't take a role in disciplinarians as obviously he'd have impartiality issues.

[DSM2]

Fire99 said:

Daz68 said:

Srange statement to make considering they are still not in the clear. Sorry got it wrong
Todt has given the nod and wink behind closed doors. All pals together.

I was under the impression that when Todt took on the job he wouldn't take a role in disciplinarians as obviously he'd have impartiality issues.

Yeah, but why let facts get in the way of a good witch hunt?

Even Eddie Jordan is now saying the rule is nonsense and should be repealed. Mind you it seemed odd for him to suggest that Ferrari should have been disqualifed given his background.

[williamp]

How about this press statement:


Ferrari back on form


There was delight in Italy this morning following clear signs that the Ferrari F1 team is back on form.

‘We ‘ave been very worried that Ferrari was not at the top of the game this season,’ said Frode Voluminosa of fan club Tifosi Inglese. ‘For sure, we saw moments of the old brilliance such as blatantly testing new parts and the calling it a “photo session”, but there was not the consistent rule bending and total disregard for the sport that we ‘ope for’.

‘Of course, there was plenty of moaning,’ Mr Voluminosa continued. ‘And this gave us ‘ope that de team still ‘ad within them the burning spirit to really insult the intelligence of all F1 fans and basically, ‘ow you say, take a massive st all over the sport’.

Following the Scuderia’s blatant team orders at the German Grand Prix, Ferrari fans are filled with a renewed belief that the rest of this season the team will be able to lie, cheat and whinge its way to the top.

‘We are committed to a Ferrari world championship victory in 2010,’ said a spokesman. Unfortunately, that spokesman was FIA president Jean Toad.


http://sniffpetrol.com/2010/07/26/ferrari-back-on-...

[FourWheelDrift]

skeggysteve said:

Well as good as:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85587

"Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has told Formula 1 fans that he has 'no interest' in the furore that has been caused by his outfit using team orders to help Fernando Alonso win the German Grand Prix."

I know they say all publicity is good but sometime you have to wonder.

Or is Luca just digging a bigger hole for when they appear at the WMC?

Luca thinks he is above everything and everybody always has, always will.

[DJC]

Luca calling it like the Old Man.

Il Commendatore is back.

And he's right. He doesnt have to care about "the fans". They dont buy his cars. They dont worship the ground either he or his cars move across. The Italian fans will still worship the team, but they arent really fans, they are Italians. Different thing. His customers arent the fans in the stands, they are in the corporate hospitality boxes.

To be honest Im with Luca. I like his honesty in treating it all with contempt. I am a little suprised he didnt expect his team to be a little more competent in its execution though.

[snorkel sucker]

FourWheelDrift said:

skeggysteve said:

Well as good as:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85587

"Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has told Formula 1 fans that he has 'no interest' in the furore that has been caused by his outfit using team orders to help Fernando Alonso win the German Grand Prix."

I know they say all publicity is good but sometime you have to wonder.

Or is Luca just digging a bigger hole for when they appear at the WMC?

Luca thinks he is above everything and everybody always has, always will.

indeed. although you cannot argue with his rationale that the team comes first, Ferrari really are missing the point that they broke the rules

[Derek Smith]

Daz68 said:

Srange statement to make considering they are still not in the clear. Sorry got it wrong
Todt has given the nod and wink behind closed doors. All pals together.

I'm not sure Luca and Jean Todt would hsare a jacuzzi together. There was a rather energetic falling out just before Todt vacated his position in the team.

Mind you, in such circumstances as Ferrari find themselves at the moment a forceful attitude can be helpful to their cause. A sort of: you take us on and there will be blood.

I'm not sure they have the authority to back it up at the moment. However, you can be sure an army of lawyers is at this very moment eating lots of pasta. But tomorrow they'll have a meeting to refine their tactics.

McLren's tactics with Stepneygate were all wrong. They all but said: we've nothing to hid. Come and look through all our computers, investigate all our staff, and you will find nothing incriminating.

[skeggysteve]

DJC said:

Luca calling it like the Old Man.

Il Commendatore is back.

And he's right. He doesnt have to care about "the fans". They dont buy his cars. They dont worship the ground either he or his cars move across. The Italian fans will still worship the team, but they arent really fans, they are Italians. Different thing. His customers arent the fans in the stands, they are in the corporate hospitality boxes.

To be honest Im with Luca. I like his honesty in treating it all with contempt. I am a little suprised he didnt expect his team to be a little more competent in its execution though.

DJC,
I can see what you mean and agree with the last bit.
Rob/Ferrari should have made it less obvious.

I was just pissed off that Ferrari/Luca made it so plain that they/he doesn't care about the fans.

BTW I think you are wrong "Il Commendatore is back."
IMHO Enzo did respect the fans.

[woof]

Queue WMSC taking the team points away from Ferrari.
Alonso and Massa retain points and result stand.

Maybe an increase in the fine as well

[Evo]

someone said "I can see what you mean and agree with the last bit.
Rob/Ferrari should have made it less obvious"

I think that's the point, i'm not so sure they wanted to make it seem genuine either Smedley or Massa.

Very funny listening back to it though.

[oilspill]

If fans could grow some balls maybe Ferrari would give a st.

Both ferrari drivers gave it there all over the weekend. Other employees have been grafting for weeks to put together a Red Bull beater.
But internet fans are sitting at home, sunny outside, screaming blue murder. Making pathetic threats, name calling (some of them bordering on slander) across forums, news comments sections and claiming they were robbed. Many of them have probably never bought a product related to the show in their lives. Maybe the fans who wernt sitting in the huge corporate stands at Hockenheim might feel robbed, but then the empty seats should have been a clue for what to expect. The usual bore-fest followed by controversy.

It's quite sad that controversy has eclipsed any real racing in the last couple of seasons. 2009 was the worse season for overatking in decades. 2008 decided by team orders, but that was ok as both drivers involved are nice to the press. The fans still come back for more.

The media hype up Formula One more and more every year, but its the same old circus. Importantly though, Ferrari are still selling cars to the chinese.

[mattikake]

I wonder who much money Ferrari make out of merchandising from the fans? Or rather, USED to make? I burned all my Ferrari T-shirts after the 2002 Austrian GP, but I still have 1 left, just incase I run out of bogroll one day...

Anyway, who cares that Ferrari don't care about the fans? The fans don't care about them.

[TonyToniTone]

mattikake said:

I burned all my Ferrari T-shirts after the 2002 Austrian GP, but I still have 1 left, just incase I run out of bogroll one day....

[cpufreak]

If it was a horse race, and a trainer ordered one of his jockeys to pull up, and let another win, he would be banned for life, as its race fixing.

How can it be considered 'ok' by anyone in motorsport?

[Jungles]

cpufreak said:

If it was a horse race, and a trainer ordered one of his jockeys to pull up, and let another win, he would be banned for life, as its race fixing.

How can it be considered 'ok' by anyone in motorsport?

Horse racing revolves around betting. Motorsport does not. Also horse racing is an individual sport, while F1 has a significant team element (although not a pure team sport like football, soccer, basketball, etc).

I'm not saying racing fixing is a good thing, because it is not. But you have to be careful about analogies. Horse racing and motorsport are not nearly similar enough to draw an analogy.

Edited by Jungles on Tuesday 27th July 01:31

[slivka]

DJC said:

Luca calling it like the Old Man.

Il Commendatore is back.

And he's right. He doesnt have to care about "the fans". They dont buy his cars. They dont worship the ground either he or his cars move across. The Italian fans will still worship the team, but they arent really fans, they are Italians. Different thing. His customers arent the fans in the stands, they are in the corporate hospitality boxes.

To be honest Im with Luca. I like his honesty in treating it all with contempt. I am a little suprised he didnt expect his team to be a little more competent in its execution though.

Whilst your logic is irrefutable, it is important to remember that those clients in the corporate hospitality boxes often buy his cars to show the "fans in the stands" (read proletariat)just how rich and successful they are.
If his cars become less objects of desire to the "fans in the stands", then they in turn become less attractive to the inhabitants of the hospitality box. (In theory)

[Derek Smith]

Jungles said:

cpufreak said:

If it was a horse race, and a trainer ordered one of his jockeys to pull up, and let another win, he would be banned for life, as its race fixing.

How can it be considered 'ok' by anyone in motorsport?

Horse racing revolves around betting. Motorsport does not. Also horse racing is an individual sport, while F1 has a significant team element (although not a pure team sport like football, soccer, basketball, etc).

I'm not saying racing fixing is a good thing, because it is not. But you have to be careful about analogies. Horse racing and motorsport are not nearly similar enough to draw an analogy.

I think the analogy stands if you reduce it to its basics. Sports are controlled by rules (laws in rugby union). Break the rules and you will be penalised. There is a rule in horse racing which bans race fixing. It is very difficult to enforce and some suggest that it still goes on. Virtually unbelievable I know but then some people have funny ideas.

The 'Quins' Bloodgate (I'm a McLaren fan and used to support the Harlequins. That was a difficult year for me) was a media fest. Yet it is well known that such manipulation goes on, just not so obviously. The difference with Bloodgate is that it spoiled the spectacle. And the same goes for Ferrari's behaviour on Sunday.

Rules are difficult to enforce against a participant that wishes to break them. The response of the stewards this season has been very muted. It has improved the racing no end I think. But Ferrari can't complain about Hamilton breaking a rule and not being punished enough and then breaking one themselves.

What makes Ferrari’s actions worse is the degree of planning. This was not a spur of the moment decision with calculations of the performance of the pursuing cars being fed into a computer and a big red light bulb on top flashing. This was studied result manipulation with the methodology worked out beforehand. They knew it was in direct contravention of the rules.

The rule may well be silly but then so many are. Why should teams have to use both kinds of tyres during a race? Somewhat rhetorical, obviously. The rule is there in the hope that it will increase the spectacle. This is seen as an important target as it increases viewing figures, the one essential for the sport.

Now ask yourself a similarly rhetorical question: does such race result manipulation affect the spectacle in any way? And that is why they are banned.

A scandal or two is not necessarily bad for the sport. I bet there are many people who wish they had seen the race live to witness the events for themselves as they happened. Further, the viewing figures for Hungary will probably increase by some margin. But for the long term such blatant cheating will cost viewers.

I used to watch GPs with a mate who was not completely committed to the sport. He enjoyed watching it but his main interest was being with group of mates and having an excuse to drink beer and eat bacon sarnies. He cheered and groaned with the rest of us. Whilst the Indianapolis farce of the one horse ‘race’ was what really put him off, the earlier bit of race fixing by Ferrari made him highly critical of the sport. That said, it was the actions of the FIA that was his main criticism. Blatant favouritism ruined the spectacle for him.

He was no nerd, not like, perhaps, me. But that said, the sport needs to hold onto fans and to intrigue and delight them. Sunday’s race has been a massive blot on what was a most exciting and open season.

I was quite surprised during the years of what many saw as FIA rule-bending to favour one team that my enthusiasm waned for the formula. I found I was more interested in WSC. Some of that came about because I was following GT racing closely for Sprint but I was drifting away.

I know there is little justification for anyone suggesting ‘if it happens to me it could happen to anyone’ but I do feel that if an F1 nerd for some 40 years become disillusioned then it might happen to a lot of fans.

This is a big test for Todt. So far he hasn’t put a foot wrong. Suggesting that he’s run the FIA a bit better than the bloke he replaced is not saying much as that was a very low level. But the way he handles this is going to be interesting.

On James Allen’s blog the three most recent posts are headed:

What the FIA should do about team orders in Formula 1. This has 658 comments.

German Grand Prix tech- Ferrari updates in focus. 27 comments.

Alonso wins German Grand Prix as Ferrari tell Massa to move over. 835 comments.

This shows what interests fans the most. I think it is a reasonable assumption to suggested that the cheating on Sunday has hit the headlines as well as a nerve.

Tough times for F1 again.

When Renault are struggling to get sponsors and have to go to Bernie cap in hand, cheating is not going to help them or the other teams in a similar situation.

[snorkel sucker]

German Grand Prix tech- Ferrari updates in focus