What has happened to the BTCC?
Discussion
Please correct me if I'm wrong. I usually am and will take no offence.
1990's British Touring Car races were just epic. I can remember so many battles even now, without needing to reference youtube. 10 years later, it has just gone dull. I seem to remember that something changed in 2000 or so (it's a hazy period) that really ruined the sport for me. I cannot remember what, whether it was rule changes, a vast change of field or whatever it was, the BTCC was instantly different and much less exiting. I don't think it's because I lost my virginity..
What happened to it? (the BTCC, not my cock)
I have been to some races at Brands Hatch during the 90's, and a couple of times this millennium (most recently 2008 I think) and even there there is a noticeable difference. Just can't put my finger on it.
'Back in the day' I would avidly watch every single round, and need to video any race when I was out. Now I could take it or leave it. Normally leave it. Unlike Formula 1 which I have always loved, and still do, planning weekends around the calender. BTW F1 came second to BTCC if there was a clash.
Anybody else found this, or is it just me? I've been pondering it for a little while and it's bugging me what has changed.
Sorry for rambling, in short, What happened to the BTCC circa 2000-ish?
1990's British Touring Car races were just epic. I can remember so many battles even now, without needing to reference youtube. 10 years later, it has just gone dull. I seem to remember that something changed in 2000 or so (it's a hazy period) that really ruined the sport for me. I cannot remember what, whether it was rule changes, a vast change of field or whatever it was, the BTCC was instantly different and much less exiting. I don't think it's because I lost my virginity..
What happened to it? (the BTCC, not my cock)
I have been to some races at Brands Hatch during the 90's, and a couple of times this millennium (most recently 2008 I think) and even there there is a noticeable difference. Just can't put my finger on it.
'Back in the day' I would avidly watch every single round, and need to video any race when I was out. Now I could take it or leave it. Normally leave it. Unlike Formula 1 which I have always loved, and still do, planning weekends around the calender. BTW F1 came second to BTCC if there was a clash.
Anybody else found this, or is it just me? I've been pondering it for a little while and it's bugging me what has changed.
Sorry for rambling, in short, What happened to the BTCC circa 2000-ish?
from memory, in the late 90s costs went stratospheric, and a lot of teams pulle dout leaving Ford to win easily. Then the rules allowed 2 doors, and Vauxhall won everything for years.
I think now its back to something like the best in terms of close action. However, back then they paid for really good drivers- ex f1 drivers, etc. Now there just isnt the quality of drivers in the race, so the racing itself is still a bit...amateurish. Like at brands, on the final curve at clearways. You just know that Matt Neal or Plato will nudge the car in front out of the way to gain a place. Rather then be quicker then them
I think now its back to something like the best in terms of close action. However, back then they paid for really good drivers- ex f1 drivers, etc. Now there just isnt the quality of drivers in the race, so the racing itself is still a bit...amateurish. Like at brands, on the final curve at clearways. You just know that Matt Neal or Plato will nudge the car in front out of the way to gain a place. Rather then be quicker then them
IMHO it went downhill after they let the Alfa's keep their splitters and aerofoils.
Up till then the cars were stripped out and rebuilt road car with v.little or no aero devices at all.
All the teams had to follow to be competitive...wind tunnel and testing time all added up to it not being a viable ad for their road cars anymore, so many makers simply walked away.
I'll be surprised if it ever gets back to its former glory.
Up till then the cars were stripped out and rebuilt road car with v.little or no aero devices at all.
All the teams had to follow to be competitive...wind tunnel and testing time all added up to it not being a viable ad for their road cars anymore, so many makers simply walked away.
I'll be surprised if it ever gets back to its former glory.
Brian McGee said:
This thread appears every race weekend!
Get Karter said:
Sorry! Thanks for link. I didn't do a search, as you'll knowphilis said:
I cant quite understand why the Ford team is using a 5 door, butt ugly Focus running lpg, when theyve got the flagship 350 bhp Focus RS500 sat in the showroom. That to me doesnt make sense, and sufficiently annoys me to the point of not watching it.
The reason they use it is because its cheap to replace when they stack it. They wouldnt be able to use the engine from the Focus RS. The LPG Focus' seem to be the fastest on the straights these days anyway.clarksonisawilly said:
Please correct me if I'm wrong. I usually am and will take no offence.
1990's British Touring Car races were just epic. I can remember so many battles even now, without needing to reference youtube. 10 years later, it has just gone dull. I seem to remember that something changed in 2000 or so (it's a hazy period) that really ruined the sport for me. I cannot remember what, whether it was rule changes, a vast change of field or whatever it was, the BTCC was instantly different and much less exiting. I don't think it's because I lost my virginity..
What happened to it? (the BTCC, not my cock)
I have been to some races at Brands Hatch during the 90's, and a couple of times this millennium (most recently 2008 I think) and even there there is a noticeable difference. Just can't put my finger on it.
'Back in the day' I would avidly watch every single round, and need to video any race when I was out. Now I could take it or leave it. Normally leave it. Unlike Formula 1 which I have always loved, and still do, planning weekends around the calender. BTW F1 came second to BTCC if there was a clash.
Anybody else found this, or is it just me? I've been pondering it for a little while and it's bugging me what has changed.
Sorry for rambling, in short, What happened to the BTCC circa 2000-ish?
It's not you. Plenty of things went pear shaped around about 2000/2001.1990's British Touring Car races were just epic. I can remember so many battles even now, without needing to reference youtube. 10 years later, it has just gone dull. I seem to remember that something changed in 2000 or so (it's a hazy period) that really ruined the sport for me. I cannot remember what, whether it was rule changes, a vast change of field or whatever it was, the BTCC was instantly different and much less exiting. I don't think it's because I lost my virginity..
What happened to it? (the BTCC, not my cock)
I have been to some races at Brands Hatch during the 90's, and a couple of times this millennium (most recently 2008 I think) and even there there is a noticeable difference. Just can't put my finger on it.
'Back in the day' I would avidly watch every single round, and need to video any race when I was out. Now I could take it or leave it. Normally leave it. Unlike Formula 1 which I have always loved, and still do, planning weekends around the calender. BTW F1 came second to BTCC if there was a clash.
Anybody else found this, or is it just me? I've been pondering it for a little while and it's bugging me what has changed.
Sorry for rambling, in short, What happened to the BTCC circa 2000-ish?
Things that went pear shaped afterwards, when you look back at the decisions, you can see how it all started in that period. It was a s
t period.With the BTCC, I seem to remember something about weight penalties.
Back in the 90's BTCC was better than F1, which was still pretty damned hot.
To improve the 'show'
As above, plus:
That should do it.
- Make the last race of the day longer. Always seems to get going on the last couple of laps (which may be because it's the last couple of laps!)
- At each meet, make provision for a guest championship - Minis, Stock Hatch, etc.
- At each meet, make provision for a 'celebrity' driver - as in ex (or even current F1) stars.
- One or two 'festivals' each season - proper two/three day jobbies with more series, 6 races, air shows, etc.
- A lick of professionalism - not that it isn't at the moment, but is just a little 'scruffy' round the edges.
- More power - but not to DTM levels
- Keep aero aids to a bare minimum - no more than what you'd get on a road version.
- Apply similar license requirement as in F1 (not to the same level but at the moment, pretty much anyone with wedge can get a drive in BTCC).
As above, plus:
- Lower gate prices. £25 is OK for a bloke and mates. For a family of 4 with a teenager, it's a £110 + day out. Too much competition at that level for all but enthusiastic families.
- More press coverage. Has excellent TV coverage but needs more careful packaging and greater newspaper presence.
That should do it.
all of the above are good points, i was almost obsessed with the mondeo in the btcc, mainly due to the fact my dad had one! In fact along with toca touring cars on the ps1, the btcc was my fondest youthful motorsport memory! I even used to buy touring car monthly 
. However the days of win on sunday, sell on monday are long gone, so its gone downhill as a result
. However the days of win on sunday, sell on monday are long gone, so its gone downhill as a resultphilis said:
I cant quite understand why the Ford team is using a 5 door, butt ugly Focus running lpg, when theyve got the flagship 350 bhp Focus RS500 sat in the showroom. That to me doesnt make sense, and sufficiently annoys me to the point of not watching it.
The engines have to be 2.0 I think.philis said:
I cant quite understand why the Ford team is using a 5 door, butt ugly Focus running lpg, when theyve got the flagship 350 bhp Focus RS500 sat in the showroom. That to me doesnt make sense, and sufficiently annoys me to the point of not watching it.
Because like all top level motorsport, it's about selling cars.ETA, Pretty much all forms of motorsport have gone downhill since the 90's. Just look back at the WRC and BRC at the time - well supported by many manufacturers, exciting rounds, not watered down compact events. Cars that looked (and performed - sort of) like those you could buy in the showroom.
I think motorsport is no longer seen as an effective marketing tool by manufacturers. It is more PC to promote a car on it's efficiency and environmental credentials. Few people buy cars on the basis of performance nowadays, so there simply isn't the return on the massive investment required to go racing.
All IMHO of course.
Edited by LD1Racing on Monday 9th August 19:50
LD1Racing said:
philis said:
I cant quite understand why the Ford team is using a 5 door, butt ugly Focus running lpg, when theyve got the flagship 350 bhp Focus RS500 sat in the showroom. That to me doesnt make sense, and sufficiently annoys me to the point of not watching it.
Because like all top level motorsport, it's about selling cars.Arena buy and prepare the cars themselves with no financial input from Ford. They would have chosen the Focus because its dynamics suited their requirement.
I seem to recall reading that they needed access to the rear because of the LPG tank, hence the 5 door. And to be honest, strip off the decals, paint it matt black with black wheels, it wouldn't look a million miles from the RS500 anyway.
They were planning to use a 4 door saloon in 2008, but the project was canned because Chilton signed for Dynamics late on. They could have used the 2.5 engine from the ST if they wanted, with a reduced capacity and no turbo, but it was probably a lot easier to build a 2.0 Duratec unit.
The BTCC stopped being interesting after they st canned the turbo's. Back in the day with rs500's all over the place, some proper looney drivers,hoy,harvey,bristow,goode,gravett etc, close racing and to top it all off, they used to do that six hour endurance thing at donington park, now that was proper racing
t canned the turbo's. Back in the day with rs500's all over the place, some proper looney drivers,hoy,harvey,bristow,goode,gravett etc, close racing and to top it all off, they used to do that six hour endurance thing at donington park, now that was proper racingSeems like every production based racing series has the same problems. I think they should figure out what they want to be. A high level GT (FIA GT World Championship or AMLS) a lower level cheaper version (GT3) or even a much cheaper lower level production car based version (Grand Am Street Tuners).
They, like everyone, needs variety!
They, like everyone, needs variety!
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