Budget racing series - Aus vs UK
Discussion
There was (I'm not sure if there still is) an ROH Commodore Cup run in Australia. For me it was the definitive budget series because you were effectively driving older less developed versions of what was used in the top series of thier day.
Very simple engineering, carb-fed V8 engines, 4 speed box (I think), locked diff, old cars with readily available parts. Made for close cheapish racing.
There is also a budget version of that, being HQ racing. Even simpler, even older cars, even cheaper. Both these series were very popular and I wonder how easy it would be to replicate here?
The immediate thing that springs to mind is Max5 (only Britain could devise a one-make series in predominantly pissing wet, that requires the use of convertibles) but is that really that cheap anymore and is the parity of the cars that reliable?
I suppose and equivalent might be a one make series using only mid-90s V6 mondeos maybe? Again, the involvement of electronics makes me question the capacity to keep it cheap.
But maybe something of this sort is what is required? One make, one engine/gearbox/brake/wheel/tyre combo. E30 328 BMWs? Cavalier GSIs? Audi 80s? F/G reg Carlton GSIs? 190E Mercs?
Don't mention Clios, Seats or VW Cup. My understanding is that some of those budgets approach that of low-end BTCC.
Very simple engineering, carb-fed V8 engines, 4 speed box (I think), locked diff, old cars with readily available parts. Made for close cheapish racing.
There is also a budget version of that, being HQ racing. Even simpler, even older cars, even cheaper. Both these series were very popular and I wonder how easy it would be to replicate here?
The immediate thing that springs to mind is Max5 (only Britain could devise a one-make series in predominantly pissing wet, that requires the use of convertibles) but is that really that cheap anymore and is the parity of the cars that reliable?
I suppose and equivalent might be a one make series using only mid-90s V6 mondeos maybe? Again, the involvement of electronics makes me question the capacity to keep it cheap.
But maybe something of this sort is what is required? One make, one engine/gearbox/brake/wheel/tyre combo. E30 328 BMWs? Cavalier GSIs? Audi 80s? F/G reg Carlton GSIs? 190E Mercs?
Don't mention Clios, Seats or VW Cup. My understanding is that some of those budgets approach that of low-end BTCC.
308mate said:
Looks the goods though.
http://www.classicsportscarclub.co.uk/ourseries.ht...
&
http://www.750mc.co.uk/racing.php
wombat172a said:
hehe, I think there are a few budget racing series around at the moment, also have a look at the CSCC, and the 750mc websites.
http://www.classicsportscarclub.co.uk/ourseries.ht...
&
http://www.750mc.co.uk/racing.php
E36 Compact looks good.http://www.classicsportscarclub.co.uk/ourseries.ht...
&
http://www.750mc.co.uk/racing.php
I am duly enlightened. Thanks Wombat
problem in the UK is we like to cover ourselves in all sorts of legislation and rules so people can make money and nurse a semi from being in control.
we need more of this www.24hoursoflemons.com
If I had the money I would hire a circuit and do it here, people were falling over themselves to compete in things like the Scumball rally and I reckon they would love to do something like this. Make sure the emphasis is on finishing rather than simply winning and generate a camaraderie amongst competitors, not this win or bust mentality thats everywhere else in UK motorsport. Yes, the car would need to have a cage, a race seat and a harness, yes the drivers would all need nomex and MSA licenses (not that I would run it to MSA regs obviously but it deter the morons from entering), then let the fun begin....
this my friends, is a real racing car
and yes, i have had a drink tonight!
we need more of this www.24hoursoflemons.com
If I had the money I would hire a circuit and do it here, people were falling over themselves to compete in things like the Scumball rally and I reckon they would love to do something like this. Make sure the emphasis is on finishing rather than simply winning and generate a camaraderie amongst competitors, not this win or bust mentality thats everywhere else in UK motorsport. Yes, the car would need to have a cage, a race seat and a harness, yes the drivers would all need nomex and MSA licenses (not that I would run it to MSA regs obviously but it deter the morons from entering), then let the fun begin....
this my friends, is a real racing car
and yes, i have had a drink tonight!
but i agree, there needs to be more series that cost peanuts to prep and will encourage more people to get invovled. allow nothing to be done to the car other than safety mods. who cares how fast they go if they all go the same speed? surely its better to have a full grid of slow cars than a grid of 6 ultra fast, hyper expensive cars in every championship which does no one any favours?
mk1 mondeos would be good, they handle well enough by all accounts and the 2L zetec would be fast enough. keep them road legal with MoT, no mods, korean ditch finders for tyres, could be on a track for 2K?
mk1 mondeos would be good, they handle well enough by all accounts and the 2L zetec would be fast enough. keep them road legal with MoT, no mods, korean ditch finders for tyres, could be on a track for 2K?
Many years ago in south Yorkshire there was Bomber car racing. this was basically bangers but you were allowed to modify in many ways. all went well until two brothers started getting silly, Raymond Mays tuned engines, e type engine jags, you get the picture.
the organisers brought out a selling plate rule, which I forget the figure but lets say £200. If anyone came with the required cash, you had to sell the car for the plate price. This stopped those who were able and prepared to spend big to win a plastic cup as they would have to sell if called out. It did stop the excess and kept it sane, those wanting to spend more went stock car racing and mixed it with the big boys.
PPC have got a day where they have a £999 limit for a car value, which is a series of events to decide a winner. This was won by a celica gt4 bought as a write off.
The only issue for race organisers is that the less prepared cars tend to lay oil on the tracks spoiling it for others.
750 Locost race series seems about as low as you can go whilst having close racing.
the organisers brought out a selling plate rule, which I forget the figure but lets say £200. If anyone came with the required cash, you had to sell the car for the plate price. This stopped those who were able and prepared to spend big to win a plastic cup as they would have to sell if called out. It did stop the excess and kept it sane, those wanting to spend more went stock car racing and mixed it with the big boys.
PPC have got a day where they have a £999 limit for a car value, which is a series of events to decide a winner. This was won by a celica gt4 bought as a write off.
The only issue for race organisers is that the less prepared cars tend to lay oil on the tracks spoiling it for others.
750 Locost race series seems about as low as you can go whilst having close racing.
308mate said:
There was (I'm not sure if there still is) an ROH Commodore Cup run in Australia. For me it was the definitive budget series because you were effectively driving older less developed versions of what was used in the top series of thier day.
Very simple engineering, carb-fed V8 engines, 4 speed box (I think), locked diff, old cars with readily available parts. Made for close cheapish racing.
There is also a budget version of that, being HQ racing. Even simpler, even older cars, even cheaper. Both these series were very popular and I wonder how easy it would be to replicate here?
I believe the ROH series has gradually been replaced by the AU Falcon V VT Commodore series. Very similar regs, Pedders sell the suspension kit and the brakes and tyres are controlled and that is about all you are allowed to do. I don't think it is really that cheap though especially if you want to win.Very simple engineering, carb-fed V8 engines, 4 speed box (I think), locked diff, old cars with readily available parts. Made for close cheapish racing.
There is also a budget version of that, being HQ racing. Even simpler, even older cars, even cheaper. Both these series were very popular and I wonder how easy it would be to replicate here?
From what I have read the HQ's are not cheap things to run these days either. Manual gearboxes are impossibly rare (though I believe they are now allowing a later box to be fitted) and body panels are in very very short supply. Most of the HQ's are covered in tape to hide the damage.
It's never going to be cheap or easy no mater the cost of the cars,
Entry Fee's tyres, fuel, Getting to and from the track etc. are going to cost very similar on all club level series.
Also one area that the biggest PITA I have found is storage and transport, esp if you live in the South East.
Entry Fee's tyres, fuel, Getting to and from the track etc. are going to cost very similar on all club level series.
Also one area that the biggest PITA I have found is storage and transport, esp if you live in the South East.
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