New Tyre Time!

[davido140]

I know this has been done a million times before (just spent an hour reading through old threads) but tyres seem to change all the time, new Toyo Proxes not being as good as the old ones for example..

Anyway, I'm going to fit 255 all around in attempt to get a bit better grip at the rear (frankly the Proxe T1Rs I have now are not the best) and to reduce tramlining at the front.

Any suggestions for a very grippy all weather tyre?

I can like with 6-8k miles before replacement is due, still only one set a year, £150 a corner would be nice, but can stretch to £200 I suppose (rather not though!)

I have Continental Sport Contact 3's on my Audi and they seem pretty good, but thats 4 wheel drive and a massive lump of a car so not really a good comparision.

Are Yokohamas still super-grippy but wear out fast? How are they in the wet?

Other option would be a P-Zero rosso at £170 a corner??

Help, I'm confused and dont want to spank £800 on ste!

Thanks

Dave

[Mark A S]

Goodyear F1 are good, especially when wet, and not too expensive. I still have Toyo's on my Tuscan, but will change to these when i wear them out.
I fitted F1's to my last car, an Evo8, and whilst ultimate dry grip was poss a little less, it was a much nicer car to drive, and better when wet. Thats my two pennith worth

[johncaul]

apologies for hogging the thread, but this is kind of relevant! Anyone got a view on the correct pressure to use for a T2? I saw on a similar forum that t350 owners were recomending a low 20 psi- i've tried it my tuscan and have to say the handling was pretty spongey, i prefer 29 to 30, but then i guess i run the risk of less grip and being shaken to death on pretty much every road inside the m25. Slightly dull i know but i'd be interested in other people's views.

John

[davido140]

johncaul said:

apologies for hogging the thread, but this is kind of relevant! Anyone got a view on the correct pressure to use for a T2? I saw on a similar forum that t350 owners were recomending a low 20 psi- i've tried it my tuscan and have to say the handling was pretty spongey, i prefer 29 to 30, but then i guess i run the risk of less grip and being shaken to death on pretty much every road inside the m25. Slightly dull i know but i'd be interested in other people's views.

John

I run 24psi on my t1, but they are set up quite differently as standard (I think you've probably got 255's anyway??)

I personally find 30psi is like driving on ball bearings!!

[Funky Jo]

davido140 said:

"...Anyway, I'm going to fit 255 all around in attempt to get a bit better grip at the rear (frankly the Proxe T1Rs I have now are not the best) and to reduce tramlining at the front..."

I thought it might be better to have 235 at the front (255 at the rear) in order to reduce tramlining. Somebody any experiences / comparison ?
How about 235/40 instead of 235/35 (a bit more "air suspensioning") ?

To answer your question: I also heard about GY F1 asymetrics doing a good job on a Tuscan.

[davido140]

Funky Jo said:

davido140 said:

"...Anyway, I'm going to fit 255 all around in attempt to get a bit better grip at the rear (frankly the Proxe T1Rs I have now are not the best) and to reduce tramlining at the front..."

I thought it might be better to have 235 at the front (255 at the rear) in order to reduce tramlining. Somebody any experiences / comparison ?
How about 235/40 instead of 235/35 (a bit more "air suspensioning") ?

To answer your question: I also heard about GY F1 asymetrics doing a good job on a Tuscan.

Thats what Andy at APM suggested actually, black circles comes back with nothing when I search for 235/35/18 !

How will changing the profile affect things other than being a little more forgiving on the bumps? would it lead to any more noticable roll when cornering, especially when at the low pressures that seem to work sell in a tuscan?

GY Eagle Asymetrics seem to get good reviews, is this the same as the F1 or did they replace the F1?

some bloke on the internet said:

"I have always used Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D2/3s and been very impressed with their roadholding abilities. I was hoping these would live up to the same standards and wow... They are even better than the GSD3s in the dry and wet! Very confidence inspiring, amazing tyres. Can't comment on how long they last but who cares when they grip this well. Tested on my (nose heavy) Alfa 156 2.5 V6 with Q2 diff."

[glow worm]

I changed from 255 to 225s on the front and definitely reduces tramlining, but putting 255s on the front I'm sure you'll make it worse. 255s kept on the rear. I'm on Goodyear F1s.

PS My advice came from Ben Lang (the Mk2 suspension designer)

Edited by glow worm on Thursday 15th January 10:07

[NCE 61]

johncaul said:

apologies for hogging the thread, but this is kind of relevant! Anyone got a view on the correct pressure to use for a T2? I saw on a similar forum that t350 owners were recomending a low 20 psi- i've tried it my tuscan and have to say the handling was pretty spongey, i prefer 29 to 30, but then i guess i run the risk of less grip and being shaken to death on pretty much every road inside the m25. Slightly dull i know but i'd be interested in other people's views.

John

I run my Tuscan 2 at 28 PSI all round, I tried lower pressures as in my Tuscan 1, but it did not feel as good, must be something to do with the later suspension set up.

As for tyres I am very pleased with the Goodyear F1's although I believe they are not available anymore, although have heard good things about the Goodyear Asymmetrics.

[Funky Jo]

The issue around this hot topic probably is the complexity and number of parametres influencing a "PERFECT" set-up and I think there is no "THAT´S IT" answer.
At the end of the day, you probably have to find YOUR perfect set-up by considering / playing around with:

- tyre brand and model(year)
- tyre dimensions (225, 235, 255 > 35s, 40s, 45s)
- PSI pressure (front and rear...)
- suspension (originals, Nitrons, GAZ, KW, etc.) and suspension set-up
- geometry set-up
- personal taste, experience, driving style and targeted use (allround road use, trackday, country road cornering, high speed German Autobahn... etc.)

Edited by Funky Jo on Thursday 15th January 10:40

[davido140]

Funky Jo said:

The issue around this hot topic probably is the complexity and number of parametres influencing a "PERFECT" set-up and I think there is no "THAT´S IT" answer.
At the end of the day, you probably have to find YOUR perfect set-up by considering / playing around with:

- tyre brand and model(year)
- tyre dimensions (225, 235, 255 > 35s, 40s, 45s)
- PSI pressure (front and rear...)
- suspension (originals, Nitrons, GAZ, KW, etc.) and suspension set-up
- geometry set-up
- personal taste, experience, driving style and targeted use (allround road use, trackday, country road cornering, high speed German Autobahn... etc.)

Edited by Funky Jo on Thursday 15th January 10:40

You're right, I've been doing lots of reading this morning and there is no real "perfect" setup for any car, (been everywhere from Vauxhall, Porsche, Ferrari, Caterham forums and some generic motorsport/motoring resources.

My thinking now is that due to RWD and the Tuscans habit of "squatting" under acceleration there is lots of downforce there, so nice and wide is the way to go, 255's then.

I've had the suspension firmed up a bit at the back to try and reduce this squatting effect as it makes the steering VERY light, however its quite clear that I now have much less rear-end grip under acceleration because less weight is transferred to the back of the car.

Too wide at the front will not help with the light-steering issues under acceleration, too narrow and I'll be understeering all the time.

Higher profile can help with tramlining problems, but can be a bit squishier, can compensate by sticking the suspension up a click or two..

I must admit I'm more nervous about changing the profile than the width,

I think I'm going to go for 255/35/18's at the rear, 235/40/18's at the front, Goodyear Eagle Asymetrics all around, they are also reasonably cheap at 160ish a corner (compared to yoko's or P Zero's anyway)

I'll have two rear Proxe T1Rs with about 4000 miles on them and no track use if any one needs 'em!

Cheers

Dave


ETA there's no issue with having a slightly larger profile at the front is there? changing the profile at the back might stuff up the speedo readings a bit, or am I talking out of my bum?

Edited by davido140 on Thursday 15th January 11:01

[s6boy]

davido140 said:

Too wide at the front will not help with the light-steering issues under acceleration, too narrow and I'll be understeering all the time.

Ultimately you're probably right but I'd have thought in normal driving your geometry would have more to do with under/oversteer, and I can't see wider tyres dialling out tramlining on a light car, but have also heard this before.

davido140 said:

I think I'm going to go for 255/35/18's at the rear, 235/40/18's at the front, Goodyear Eagle Asymetrics all around, they are also reasonably cheap at 160ish a corner (compared to yoko's or P Zero's anyway)

This is the combination and make I went for (although GSD3's) when changing from 235f/245r, very happy with the results and I believe the Asym's are better still.
If you have the time it's worth phoning around various suppliers here-http://www.oilypages.com/links.asp?d=1&page=tyresand getting them to compare prices, if memory serves my 235's were £125 (last July)down from the £175 of the first call, though because Asymmetrics were being introduced the prices were similar.

davido140 said:

...changing the profile at the back might stuff up the speedo readings a bit, or am I talking out of my bum?

No your bum is making sense mine went from 245/40 to 255/35 and read 3mph less at 2000 revs in 3rd.

Edited by s6boy on Thursday 15th January 12:39

[davido140]

s6boy said:

davido140 said:

Too wide at the front will not help with the light-steering issues under acceleration, too narrow and I'll be understeering all the time.

Ultimately you're probably right but I'd have thought in normal driving your geometry would have more to do with under/oversteer, and I can't see wider tyres dialling out tramlining on a light car, but have also heard this before.

davido140 said:

I think I'm going to go for 255/35/18's at the rear, 235/40/18's at the front, Goodyear Eagle Asymetrics all around, they are also reasonably cheap at 160ish a corner (compared to yoko's or P Zero's anyway)

This is the combination and make I went for (although GSD3's) when changing from 235f/245r, very happy with the results and I believe the Asym's are better still.
If you have the time it's worth phoning around various suppliers here-http://www.oilypages.com/links.asp?d=1&page=tyresand getting them to compare prices, if memory serves my 235's were £125 (last July)down from the £175 of the first call, though because Asymmetrics were being introduced the prices were similar.

davido140 said:

...changing the profile at the back might stuff up the speedo readings a bit, or am I talking out of my bum?

No your bum is making sense mine went from 245/40 to 255/35 and read 3mph less at 2000 revs in 3rd.

Edited by s6boy on Thursday 15th January 12:39

Excellent, thanks! I'll be getting them from micheldever tyres near where I live, there are a distributor (or something similar) for all the tyre shops in the region and consistently come up cheaper than anywhere else, Internet or "proper" shop.


ETA £152.54 fitted for the fronts, and £177.27 for the rears £2-3 a corner cheaper than black circles which is not bad, and a drive-in drive-out service!

Edited by davido140 on Thursday 15th January 13:23

[andyoleary]

David - I think the profile is just a percentage of the width, not a fixed number or dimension. So if you reduce the width of the tyre but use a higher profile value then you might well end up with the same rolling circumference, if you know what I mean....

Andy

[davido140]

andyoleary said:

David - I think the profile is just a percentage of the width, not a fixed number or dimension. So if you reduce the width of the tyre but use a higher profile value then you might well end up with the same rolling circumference, if you know what I mean....

Andy

I see what you mean, and now you say it I did know that really

Going to stick with 255/35 on the arse, I'm a bit nervous about what the 235/40's will look like on the front, but would rather sacrifice silly cosmetics of tyres for better handling/grip!

[andyoleary]

Cool, good luck with your choices matey (have you considered Falkens?)

Andy

[NCE 61]

A useful tyre size calculator http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html shows 225/40/18 to be the closest to 255/35/18 for the fronts.

[davido140]

andyoleary said:

Cool, good luck with your choices matey (have you considered Falkens?)

Andy

I did look at the Falkens, what have you heard about them?

Only reviews I could find were people with Corollas and Mondeos, comments like "Comfy and quiet" sprang up!

I'm generally a believer in "you get what you pay for", they seem suspiciously inexpensive!

[andyoleary]

I don't have any experience with them personally but they often crop up when discussing tyre choices. Can't recall the exact type though, sorry. I think a few of the Cerb owners have tried them and feedback tends to be pretty good but I don't think they last as well as the likes of the Toyo Proxes. I have T1R's on mine all round and I think they are excellent, in dry or wet. Each to their own I guess.

Another one that I keep meaning to investigate further is the Vredestein Ultrac Sessanta tyres - check them out. http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Tyre/Vredestein/Ultra...

HTH

Andy

[S6 Devil]

I've just fitted Falken 452's to my Tuscan, can't comment on how they feel yet as I haven't driven it but seem to have similar reviews to the Toyo T1-R's
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

[Barry Ashcroft]

davido140 said:

s6boy said:

davido140 said:

Too wide at the front will not help with the light-steering issues under acceleration, too narrow and I'll be understeering all the time.

Ultimately you're probably right but I'd have thought in normal driving your geometry would have more to do with under/oversteer, and I can't see wider tyres dialling out tramlining on a light car, but have also heard this before.

davido140 said:

I think I'm going to go for 255/35/18's at the rear, 235/40/18's at the front, Goodyear Eagle Asymetrics all around, they are also reasonably cheap at 160ish a corner (compared to yoko's or P Zero's anyway)

This is the combination and make I went for (although GSD3's) when changing from 235f/245r, very happy with the results and I believe the Asym's are better still.
If you have the time it's worth phoning around various suppliers here-http://www.oilypages.com/links.asp?d=1&page=tyresand getting them to compare prices, if memory serves my 235's were £125 (last July)down from the £175 of the first call, though because Asymmetrics were being introduced the prices were similar.

davido140 said:

...changing the profile at the back might stuff up the speedo readings a bit, or am I talking out of my bum?

No your bum is making sense mine went from 245/40 to 255/35 and read 3mph less at 2000 revs in 3rd.

Edited by s6boy on Thursday 15th January 12:39

Excellent, thanks! I'll be getting them from micheldever tyres near where I live, there are a distributor (or something similar) for all the tyre shops in the region and consistently come up cheaper than anywhere else, Internet or "proper" shop.


ETA £152.54 fitted for the fronts, and £177.27 for the rears £2-3 a corner cheaper than black circles which is not bad, and a drive-in drive-out service!

Edited by davido140 on Thursday 15th January 13:23

Do shop around, I have befriended my local kwik-fit and got mine for £110 front £125 rear and they still made a profit