Insurer cuts premiums with spy box
Don't drive at night or the spy will report you.
Norwich Union, the UK's largest insurer, is cutting the cost of insurance for younger drivers. The price, however, is a spy in the boot that logs where you go and when, and reports back to the insurer. Some would argue that it's the thin end of a fairly thick wedge.
NU's take is that, based on actual car usage, the 'Pay As You Drive For Young Drivers' system is aimed at motorists aged 18-21. The company reckons it uses cutting-edge, in-car technology to calculate premiums based on when and how often they drive their car.
The 'black box' style device is fitted into the car and uses GPS technology to record car journeys. This information is then transmitted securely to Norwich Union via a mobile phone network.
According to NU, the black box device will be less than the size of a video cassette and will be fitted into your boot or passenger cabin. There will also be a small aerial for GPS and for a mobile telephone signal to send data to NU. The aerial will be placed inside the car (in most instances on the inside of your windscreen on the passenger side). The device will be wired to the car battery and ignition.
The premiums, which for drivers in this age bracket are traditionally very high, will be calculated in a similar way to mobile phone tariffs. Drivers will be able to control their premiums to more affordable levels by driving mainly during 'off peak' times between the hours of 6am and 11pm rather than driving during 'peak' times between 11pm and 6am.
These tariffs have been calculated based on accident statistics for the 18-21 age bracket, which show these motorists are at much greater risk of being killed or seriously injured in car accidents between the hours of 11pm and 6am.
By reflecting the time of day in the cost, NU said that the product makes insurance premiums more affordable and deters younger motorists from driving at night when the conditions are less safe.
Features of the scheme include:
- A tariff per mile, with the rate personalised to each driver and dependent on the time of day the car is driven
- The first 100 off peak miles each month are free
- Young drivers could see a saving of up to 30 per cent a year off the cost of their premiums
- Premiums are billed monthly - premiums will vary monthly if customers vary their driving
- There is a one-off fee of £199 for the telematic device - this is expected to cost less than the savings to be made in premiums.
- The box has a built in car locator - enabling customers to have their car located if there's been an accident, breakdown or if it has been stolen
In August, NU launched a nationwide pilot scheme of 'Pay As You Drive' insurance among 5,000 volunteers of all age ranges to investigate driving patterns and help set premium pricing.
NU said it can launch the product now because pricing can be calculated for these motorists as the time of day is such a major factor for this age group. The first 1,500 boxes are ready to be fitted.
The recently published independent Greenaway report into uninsured driving in the UK (link below) described Pay As You Drive as a 'potentially helpful innovation' by setting rates for late-night driving at a high enough level to encourage young drivers not to use their vehicle at this time.
Product manager Robert Ledger said, "The scheme brings motor insurance into the 21st century by providing affordable comprehensive insurance for young drivers in return for driving at safer times.
"There's no getting away from it, Government statistics show that this age group are more likely to be killed or injured in road accidents between the hours of 11pm and 6am - and this has been factored into tariffs for this product.
"Although the money-saving factor will probably be the main appeal for young drivers, I imagine the road safety aspect will appeal to their parents.
"Although this product may not suit all young drivers, we feel it does offer them an alternative to the standard motor insurance that is currently available. And by having their own insurance policy rather than being a named driver on their parents' policy, young drivers will be able to build up their own no claims discount, making insurance even cheaper in the future."
NU has an exclusive agreement with US insurer Progressive to pioneer Pay As You Drive insurance in the UK and Europe using telematics technology.
Young motorists or parents who want their children to sign up to be one of the 1,500 motorists on the 'Pay As You Drive'(tm) For Young Drivers test product can visit www.payasyoudriveinsurance.co.uk or contact the 'Pay As You Drive' insurance team at ayasyoudrive@norwich-union.co.uk">payasyoudrive@norwich-union.co.uk.
Greenaway report (PDF) is here.
£1 per mile for the nighttime rate as I remember.
Thinking back to my younger days though, when it was still £1,000.00+ for TPF&T on my 1.3 Maestro, a lot of my driving was done at night as it was cheaper to be the driver than to get lashed, and I was 'cab-happy'. I should point out though that I was/am unusual in that my total mileage in my car for the first year was well over 25k and I did another £25k+ in other cars I was insured on.
Can see possibilities with the ladyz though ... "Opps is that the time, oh dear it's going to cost a fortune to get home tonight, could I possibly stay the night..."
I would say those living in London, etc will be well please by this and it's a step in the right direction.
Of major concern though are the hidden implications of a GPS device in the car reporting your location. I could go on for ages about the 'thin end of the wedge' and all that. Bottom line on this is if the 'powers that be' want to track you they can, whether you like it or not. I just don't see why we should make it easy for them so that they don't feel they need a dam good reason to put the effort into doing so
rude-boy said:
Of major concern though are the hidden implications of a GPS device in the car reporting your location. I could go on for ages about the 'thin end of the wedge' and all that. Bottom line on this is if the 'powers that be' want to track you they can, whether you like it or not. I just don't see why we should make it easy for them so that they don't feel they need a dam good reason to put the effort into doing so
What strikes me as odd is why they need GPS to calculate milage... couldn't they have a device tie in with the odometer that records miles driven, the time, and then the speed from those two stats? That would provide enough info, IMO, and would also be cheaper. So it's rather obvious that the GPS is there for a slightly more sinister reason.
What would happen for instance in 5 years time every insurer required you to have such a black box-with any speed infringement reported to the authorities. It is something that needs to be stopped now, before things get much worse.
rude-boy said:
Scan read this in the paper yesterday.
£1 per mile for the nighttime rate as I remember.
Yep I saw this. So if you did the average 10k miles a year and a lot of them were at night, you'd be faced with a premium of £10,000. Nice little earner for our underfunded insurance companies.
Ian A.
[Quote]
Drivers will be able to control their premiums to more affordable levels by driving mainly during 'off peak' times between the hours of 6am and 11pm rather than driving during 'peak' times between 11pm and 6am.[/quote]
I would have thought "off peak" would be 11pm to 6am & "peak" to be 6am to 11pm
or am I missing something?
we're well and truly F
ked !!! other companies will follow suit, and soon it'll be mandatory.. then the acceleromators(sp?) will be fitted to the box.. "0-60 in less than 30 minutes.. that'll be an extra £500 insurance plese.."
K THAT!!!!! 
NU said:What? Because it's dark?
deters younger motorists from driving at night when the conditions are less safe.
There are less cars on the road at night (well there is round here) so I can't see how conditions can be any less safe than driving in the day when there are no end of morons on the road. >> Edited by Graham.J on Friday 14th January 14:38
si_j said:No, they're probably using the thinking that most people in that age bracket either a) go out drinking every night b)out racing their mates c) driving like arses because the roads are quiet d) all the above.
Now surely this is wrong...
I would have thought "off peak" would be 11pm to 6am & "peak" to be 6am to 11pm
or am I missing something?
If this is the case it's the same with a lot of things, a few people spoil it for the rest of us.
Not happy about this, it's a farce.
Your Dad drives it after 11pm one night and you get charged???
Totally ridiculous and agree with trying upmost to stop it. The timing device and wired into the oddometer of the car is a much better idea although I can see issues with warranty and wiring into the cars current wiring (could be over come with a wheel sensor on ABS for example though).
This is one thing I will be standing against. When is this sort of rubbish gonna stop.
Graham.J said:
...they're probably using the thinking that most people in that age bracket either a) go out drinking every night b)out racing their mates c) driving like arses because the roads are quiet d) all the above...
Nicely translated matey.
Because we all know how much safer it is to drive the highways and byways between 6am and 11pm, with thousands upon thousands of other cars on the roads. I mean, what are the odds of hitting one of those?
As BS goes, that's some pretty stinky stuff from N.U.
>> Edited by ubergreg on Friday 14th January 15:38
ubergreg said:See now I'm thinking their shooting themselves in the foot a bit here...
Because we all know how much safer it is to drive the highways and byways between 6am and 11pm, with thousands upon thousands of other cars on the roads. I mean, what are the odds of hitting one of those?
They charge you to drive at night, people think, "not bloody likely" so drive more during the day (but that age group has college/uni/work etc) so if you're out in the day with the main volume of traffic, you have more chance of having an accident or having the car nicked whilst it's sat in a car park = insurance company has to pay out.....but then premium goes up for customer
And if they drive at night, they get shafted anyway.
Makes no sense
.......but then when has insurance ever made any sense? One of life's great unfathomables. >> Edited by Graham.J on Friday 14th January 16:04
Everybody might as well buy a Nissan Micra limited to 30 and be done with it and we can all be sycophantic automatons.
This kind of thing needs to be stopped and it's people like us on here that need to make a stand.
WHERE WILL IT END?
Grouch.
>> Edited by groucho on Friday 14th January 16:20
Dear Sir,
It has come to our notice via your ultra-spy 3000 (fitted in accordance with you MotorTheft inc DayLightRobbery policy, see terms & conditions for details) that on the 13th of March this year you did exceed the national speed limit by travelling in excess of 100mph (115.23 to be precise). As a result we have informed the police of this fact and are now unable to insure you as a driver. What's more, the GPS features of the ultra-spy 3000 show that the area in which you where travelling at this speed there is not even a tarmac road, in fact you where in the middle of a welsh forest, half way up the side of a mountain! What do you think you are? A rally driver?
Yours faithfully,
Names Changed to Protect the Ignorant
Boggit and Snitch Insurance Brokers Limited
And you think I'm kidding, just wait and see!
Graham.J said:
They charge you to drive at night, people think, "not bloody likely" so drive more during the day (but that age group has college/uni/work etc) so if you're out in the day with the main volume of traffic, you have more chance of having an accident or having the car nicked whilst it's sat in a car park
And whilst we're on the topic of driving patterns... are the more irresponsible young drivers going to put these in their cars? Do boy racers want a black box in the boot? Only if it has two big woofers in it. And I don't blame them at all.
So the 'responsible' young drivers drop in a box to try and save a few quid (hopefully?) because they don't give a monkey's about writing their names in tyre smoke at 03:30 in the B&Q lot anyway.
If tthis is the case, where's the benefit? Which of you fellow petrolheads would have stuck one of these in your ride when you were 19?
Didn't think so. Interesting experiment though.
Apparently for every £100 they (insurers) take in,
they pay out £120.....and I'm sure I read recently
that 20% of insured vehicles will report an event of some sort (which results in a claim or not) .
Pay as you go is the 'way to go' for all sorts of reasons. Some of my neighbours use the car for a 5 min journey, whats the point when they could as easily walk. With the sheer number of road users in London now, I'd rather drive weekends only.
I'm sure a car manufacturer in the US used a similar
black box device on a certain model last year and the year before. To report 'useful info to the company' ,
this info can be passed to legal / government agencies should they request it.
At the end of the day this gets people thinking about driving (style /time/potential for an accident).
Cars are more safer now, pollute less but can be far more powerful.
R
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