Road charging to go nationwide
More surveillance, more cameras and more cash extraction
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Image: EA Group UK |
Autocar also reports that it has discovered documentation suggesting that radio technology dubbed DSRC (dedicated short range communications) , will be implemented in London first. By February 2009, it will replace the inaccurate ANPR (automatic number plate recognition) system -- see link below for PistonHeads' ANPR report.
DSRC implementation will involve installing tag readers using the 5.9GHz radio band at motorway entrances and exits. The driver gets charged directly from his or her bank account when the reader detects a tag. The reading will be backed up by an ANPR camera (pic) photo of the number plate. If you don't have a tag, the ANPR sends you a photo with a bill for the fine.
Autocar's reports goes to say that drivers will, initially at least, probably be charged a fixed fee only for using the most congested motorways -- which is simpler than using the system being rolled out in Germany that deploys satellite tracking. The system is even being tested as you read this, somewhere in London. Contracts for the system will be placed in August next year, and the system will be phased in gradually.
Presentations prepared by the EU also suggest that systems such as this could soon be rolled out across the continent with EU blessing, if not backing.
As an article published last June in The Economist points out, the driver is primarily financial. The recent growth of road tolling across Europe is happening because governments now face a double problem, according to Jack Opiola of Hyder Consulting, a tolls expert who is currently helping the British, Australian and New Zealand governments to design schemes for lorries.
The Economist continues: "First, the fiscal fountain of revenues from petrol taxes has begun to dry up: although there are ever more cars driving ever more miles, tax revenues have not held up because of ever more efficient vehicles—a trend likely to continue as electric and hybrid cars become more widespread.
"This is bad news for finance ministers, but their colleagues in transport departments are also feeling the heat. Building more roads is becoming more difficult and more expensive, due to environmental concerns and the increasing prices of land, materials and labour. So governments have no choice but to start managing demand more directly."
Think the surveillance society is bad now? Pack your bags or put up with it...
www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=9447
European document [pdf]: www.prelude-portal.org/
The Economist article: www.economist.com/
Consider also the even more sneaky anti-car activity in Australia and NZ, and they're out.
The USA/Canada would be more appealing, but for the lack of ANY decent roads (or decent cars, largely)...I'd have to move right next to Laguna Seca and get a season ticket!!!
Face facts everyone - the environmentalists are in power, but are afraid of big business (or are more likely in their pockets), so are hitting the easy targets - the populace!
Article said:
The Economist continues: "First, the fiscal fountain of revenues from petrol taxes has begun to dry up: although there are ever more cars driving ever more miles, tax revenues have not held up because of ever more efficient vehicles—a trend likely to continue as electric and hybrid cars become more widespread.
So because we are being taxed to death on petrol and buying more efficient cars we now have to make up the shortfall in other ways? This makes me absolutely furious. Who voted for this?
Strange, I thought car owner in Britain pays road tax which enables us to drive on the roads!
Either go with the road toll plan so that all tourists and EU travellers get charged too (whilst dropping car tax and petrol tax altogether) or leave us the hell alone!
As far as building more roads goes, maintaining the exisiting ones seems beyond this country!
To say I somewhat hate this is an understatement - and I do not do many miles a year (those I do are "fun")....for someone like my Dad for example (35k a yr) it is horrific
Article said:
The Economist continues: "First, the fiscal fountain of revenues from petrol taxes has begun to dry up: although there are ever more cars driving ever more miles, tax revenues have not held up because of ever more efficient vehicles—a trend likely to continue as electric and hybrid cars become more widespread.
I just don't believe these figures. The numbers of these Eco cars are tiny.
FFS The tax raised from motorists comes to around 4-5 times what is actually spent on the roads. And that is not enough for them.
Anybody else fancy starting their own country?
rsvmilly said:
Anybody else fancy starting their own country?
I'm in!
I've never bought into the whole 'land of the free' thing for america - when they spend 21 million dollars (about 35p) on a party celebrating the re-election of a nuptie, but at least your thoughts aren't monitored out there.
I think I'll switch all my cash out to a numbered Swiss account - see them try to extract the money directly out of an empty account that doesn't let me pay my other bills when it's empty!
>> Edited by ninjadave on Wednesday 26th January 11:43
Oh, but what about cars on trailers...?
Keep fuel tax though - if you get 9mpg out of your 5 litre 4wd taking the kids to school then you should pay for it.
:Wolves Wanderer said:
This makes me absolutely furious. Who voted for this?
Ha! You think that anyone voted for this! Of course not, just the people that run this country doing what they want 'cos they think they can.
Ken and Tony need more money to pay for schools and hospitals (don't have kids and touch wood never ill) so nice to know they spend my tax and vat on things I want.
Goodbye UK hello USA.
BTW Checkout Venom500's experience of NZ over on the Viper Forum...................makes you realise how luck we still are.
Time to remove those front number plates I feel.
rsvmilly said:
Anybody else fancy starting their own country?
Hello RSVMILLY
We could have Aprilia Town - It would be as noisy as hell but good fun for a few summers!
Has anybody noticed the link with vehicle logging and country tax. I think the next stage will be that they will track the car on it's journey.
For example if you go from Manchester to Le Mans and then down to Italy for a nice trip and back through Germany.
Logged going on the Motorway.
Logged going on the Ferry or train.
You are then charged for the distance and a fine for the time under what the police believe to be the acceptable time for the journey.
You then go to Europe and have the toll, speeding tickets and country tax all charged to your account. This way they will be able to watch if 2 or more of you are having a race!
Of course this wil be sold on the principle of tracking car theft.
I think I'll buy a van and just do track days.
What a sad place we live in!
On the exact same topic three spaces down I said:
article said:
The driver gets charged directly from his or her bank account when the reader detects a tag. The reading will be backed up by an ANPR camera (pic) photo of the number plate. If you don't have a tag, the ANPR sends you a photo with a bill for the fine.
The very fact that they have the ability to do this is terrifying - why bother even introducing stealth taxes? Why not just extract it straight from their bank accounts and blame it on the fact they were driving.
No doubt, also, that these detectors will also detect speed, but of course won't be able to detect drink and drugs, erratic driving, dangerous moves, middle lane numpties and so on, so whenever they need some money, they just unsuspectingly drop a speed limit and hey presto, you've taken money straight from everyone's accounts!
This is the final (very expensive) manifestation of the plan that I have heard from many 'back room' Labout members, unashamedly and without question either, to 'frustrate the motorist out of their car'. And where do they want us all to go? On a hyper-polluting bus with a fixed route going nowhere you want to go in particular.
If they really meant it they'd drop road tax and put it all on fuel, but instead they'd rather spend vast amounts tagging us all like young offenders on ASBOs.
I would write what I'd like to do to Tony Bliar here, but I fear the Thought Police would come knocking.
And to all you apathetic voters who assumed this sort of thing would never happen - it is doing, like being treated like both a criminal and a cashpot at the same time now eh?
The only glimmer of hope is to get the Tories in next time.
This must be fought against.
This is not what life is all about.
Many people will be truly pi55ed off by this and will be wanting to leave the country.
Only the public sector and lower classes less ble to leave will remain.
No exaggeration, the country is spiralling down.
lockup said:
Paying by use seems to be perfectly reasonable to me, so I'm all in favour of dropping road tax altogether and replacing it with per mile charges, which vary depending on congestion etc. Maybe we should sell road charges like mobile telephone minutes - prepay for 6000 offpeak miles and have a per mile charge for peak etc etc har har har.
Oh, but what about cars on trailers...?
Keep fuel tax though - if you get 9mpg out of your 5 litre 4wd taking the kids to school then you should pay for it.
Absolutely in agreement, note that France has already abolished car tax...
lockup said:
Paying by use seems to be perfectly reasonable to me, so I'm all in favour of dropping road tax altogether and replacing it with per mile charges, which vary depending on congestion etc. Maybe we should sell road charges like mobile telephone minutes - prepay for 6000 offpeak miles and have a per mile charge for peak etc etc har har har.
Oh, but what about cars on trailers...?
Keep fuel tax though - if you get 9mpg out of your 5 litre 4wd taking the kids to school then you should pay for it.
Fuel tax is pay by use. You pay more when there's congestion. You pay more if your car uses more.
Why add another usage charge?
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