Current views on Twin Plates clutches for V8Vs and prices

[LPH]

I know this has been done before but maybe worth an update from people in the know?

Determined to use my car more, went off through the Peaks the other week, great drive but the clutch is a real pain. 2007 V8V on original clutch - which is very heavy. Have thought about twin plate clutches in the past but never committed to spending the money, however I think I need to do it to make me use the car more. It's not on its way out as far as I can tell, just heavy.

So what's the current views on the one to have an the costs?

My car has had all of its mods done at AM dealers by the first owner. So going to AM would make sense in that respect. However VAP units are cheaper AFAIK. £3600 fitted rather than about £4.5k at Aston. Is that correct?

Are there any noticeable differences in the function / driveability of the AMR v VAP? Does one give more chatter than the other? I believe this is a thing quite common with twin plates?

Are there any other options?

Cheers

Edited by LPH on Thursday 14th May 15:22

[yeti]

Also very interested in answers to this; I'm on the original clutch at 43k miles and with 6 owners presumably careful owners. Still drives perfectly and the heaviness doesn't bother me,

Although when I get back in the Mini, it feels like I'm nearly putting my foot through the bulkhead for the first few shifts...

I would REALLY like the lighter flywheel to make it easier to balance the revs on a downshift! At 43k, a change can't be far away.

[LPH]

Mine's only on 23k miles and I'm just the second owner. Compared to my other cars the clutch takes a lot of effort! I like the idea of a lighter flywheel too as the current setup does take a while to spin up.

Edited by LPH on Thursday 14th May 15:32

[LTP]

I've just recently had a twin-plate fitted to my car, but as it's an SSII, I don't have a dog in the particular fight of this thread.

What I will say is my clutch was nowhere near worn out, but I'd heard that a twin-plate considerably improves a SportShift. So if it made the car better, and I don't plan to change it, why would I wait until the existing clutch is worn out before I make a change that could improve the car? This would apply doubly to those complaining of a heavy clutch pedal, or a heavy flywheel reducing throttle response.

Just something for you to think about.

Typo fixed

Edited by LTP on Thursday 14th May 18:10

[giveitfish]

I’ve recently been through this - 4.3 manual with 59k miles on at the time, was still on original clutch which was not slipping.

I had the Velocity AP lightweight twin-plate fitted, with the various prop bearings and gaskets which had to be replaced and seized bolts to drill it totalled £3436 + VAT = £4123.

- Very happy with DAE, it’s been back there for other work since (and it’s a 500 mile round trip)
- My old clutch was very worn so I timed it about right
- Biting point has not changed
- Pedal effort is reduced significantly
- Engine rev response is much improved, it’s almost race-car like
- Car is easier to stall with the lighter flywheel, have to add revs when using full lock in a car park
- Transmission rattle/chunter at idle is definitely a thing though, you’ll have to think carefully about that. It’s really quite unrefined which is not in keeping with the luxury credentials of the car. OK on mine which is a tuned weekend sporty driving car with a loud exhaust, might be less happy if city driving especially if trying to impress a passenger

All in all, not long back back from 1000 miles blasting around Scotland and no regrets.

[LPH]

giveitfish said:

I ve recently been through this - 4.3 manual with 59k miles on at the time, was still on original clutch which was not slipping.

I had the Velocity AP lightweight twin-plate fitted, with the various prop bearings and gaskets which had to be replaced and seized bolts to drill it totalled £3436 + VAT = £4123.

That's quite a bit more than the 'Car required for 24hrs. £3,000.00 + Vat including install' advertised on their site.

I wonder if the AMR version has less clatter? I don't think the flywheel is quite as light as the VAP?

[yeti]

LTP said:

So if it made the car better, and I don't plan to change it, why would I wait until the existing clutch is worn out before I make a change that could improve the car? This would apply doubly to those complaining of a heavy clutch pedal, or a heavy flywheel reducing throttle response.

Because money £££

If I get a year or two out of the current one I’ll be pleased. This year is bits and bobs like carpets and gearknobs and a bit more noise.

Maybe next year is the clutch and flywheel.

[giveitfish]

LPH said:

That's quite a bit more than the 'Car required for 24hrs. £3,000.00 + Vat including install' advertised on their site.

I wonder if the AMR version has less clatter? I don't think the flywheel is quite as light as the VAP?

The £3k is assuming everything comes off cleanly and is reusable, fairly unlikely on a 20yo 60k mile car. My bill included an extra hour labour spent removing one recalcitrant bolt.

[giveitfish]

LPH said:

I wonder if the AMR version has less clatter? I don't think the flywheel is quite as light as the VAP?

Can’t help on that, sorry. It’s only an issue at idle in neutral, as soon as you’re moving the NVH is same as standard.

[Z51]

I bought my car at the cheaper end knowing I'd change to a twin plate clutch immediately. It was on 61000 on the original clutch.

I had it done at AM Nottingham, purely for convenience.

I did few miles before the change, but the clutch pedal is completely different, like in a normal car hardly any pressure required - the first time pressing I thought it must not be connected properly.

Chatter is more noticeable, less so at idle, more so on the initial few revs moving off slowly. Yes, you do need slightly more throttle to avoid stalling.

You're welcome to check mine out, but I'm the other side of Nottingham to you, just let me know.

[LPH]

Z51 said:

I bought my car at the cheaper end knowing I'd change to a twin plate clutch immediately. It was on 61000 on the original clutch.

I had it done at AM Nottingham, purely for convenience.

I did few miles before the change, but the clutch pedal is completely different, like in a normal car hardly any pressure required - the first time pressing I thought it must not be connected properly.

Chatter is more noticeable, less so at idle, more so on the initial few revs moving off slowly. Yes, you do need slightly more throttle to avoid stalling.

You're welcome to check mine out, but I'm the other side of Nottingham to you, just let me know.

Thanks for that, AM Notts is my closest and it will be with them for service next week.

Can I ask what it cost and when you had it done - drop me a pm if you prefer.

[LPH]

giveitfish said:

The £3k is assuming everything comes off cleanly and is reusable, fairly unlikely on a 20yo 60k mile car. My bill included an extra hour labour spent removing one recalcitrant bolt.

Cheers - makes sense. I wonder if main dealers use this sort of charging principle, or if it's a fixed price whatever. Probably not

[Z51]

LPH said:

Z51 said:

I bought my car at the cheaper end knowing I'd change to a twin plate clutch immediately. It was on 61000 on the original clutch.

I had it done at AM Nottingham, purely for convenience.

I did few miles before the change, but the clutch pedal is completely different, like in a normal car hardly any pressure required - the first time pressing I thought it must not be connected properly.

Chatter is more noticeable, less so at idle, more so on the initial few revs moving off slowly. Yes, you do need slightly more throttle to avoid stalling.

You're welcome to check mine out, but I'm the other side of Nottingham to you, just let me know.

Thanks for that, AM Notts is my closest and it will be with them for service next week.

Can I ask what it cost and when you had it done - drop me a pm if you prefer.

Done!

FWIW, I think the AM quote took into account "difficulties" but don't know for sure. My car had the exhaust centre clamps replaced just before I bought, so I assume the exhaust came off easily and this was not an issue???

[LPH]

Thanks for the email.

[Dewi 2]

LPH said:

That's quite a bit more than the 'Car required for 24hrs. £3,000.00 + Vat including install' advertised on their site.

I wonder if the AMR version has less clatter? I don't think the flywheel is quite as light as the VAP?

From factory, gear chatter varies slightly car to car.
If your car chatters more than average on a single plate, then a lighter flywheel will make it even worse.
In that case, a twin plate clutch with standard weight flywheel is a possibility, which will give a far lighter clutch pedal and no increased chatter.
Gear chatter at tickover became apparent on my car after the twin plate was fitted. BR said that should reduce by 1,000 miles and they were correct. Rarely does that now, except if the air con is running.

Cannot remember the cost. It was done years ago, after the original clutch failed at 15,000 miles.

[LPH]

Cheers.

I don't notice any chatter on my at all to be honest.

I do hear a small noise when I depress the clutch but you have to listen for it.

The only other noise appears to be a bit of 'lash' in the torque tube/driveshaft of maybe the gears in the box when you let out the clutch and start moving, but that's not clutch or flywheel related I guess.

[Davil]

I got the AMR twin plate clutch and the GT4 lightened flywheel (50% weight reduction) installed on my AMR V8 Vantage at the dealer and have been driving it since February.

When I was pricing them the AMR and the Velocity were pretty much the same price and neither were in stock. The AMR clutch is actually also quite a bit cheaper than the standard clutch. I am in Australia and the Aston dealer does give a parts and labour discount for heritage Astons (VH and older). I was always leaning to the AMR one anyway because, well, I have an AMR and I much prefer factory to 3rd party.

One good thing you have going for you is that you don t need the torque tube to be exchanged as with later model 4.7s. This is expensive and may or may not cause a long delay as they seem to make them in batches which quickly sell out.

Mine has no chatter at all. If anything it idles more quietly than it used to. No idea if this luck of the draw, the people that installed it or to do with the choice of clutch. I m just a sample of one.

Downsides.
- Slightly easier to stall, especially initially as your hind brain takes some type to re-learn, but also as the clutch is just so light modulation is not as easy. Think of it as the difference between having to press on something using resistance versus moving your ankle alone to a specific position without feedback. Minor overall though. You get used to it, more so if it is your only manual car I would imagine. I use my old WRX day to day and the clutch in that now feels very heavy whereas it used to feel light.
- Driving in first for example in a car park can get jerky due to the flywheel but this is a nothing really, more an observation.

Upsides.
- Absolutely transformative for enjoyment.
- The guys adjusted the cables to optimise for the new clutch and shifting is night and day better. Easier, quicker and more precise.
- Initial acceleration and throttle response feel so much better. normal mode is more like sport mode was. In sport mode it feels like a lighter, noticeably faster car altogether.
- Reverse is no longer stressful.
- It puts a massive smile on your face. Because I have three cars and don t drive my VH all the time, the novelty has still not worn off. I cannot recommend this modification more highly.

Edited by Davil on Friday 15th May 04:07

[cypriot]

I went from the standard to the BR clutch and flywheel. As others have mentioned, it is a night and day difference! Probably the single most impactful change you can do to our cars. The clutch pedal now is now normal in weight, and the engine is way more responsive.

Where I will offer a different view than others, is that I actually found the car more difficult to stall (ie easier to drive) after the change. Because the engine now responds faster, you have the ability to feather the throttle when you are close to stalling, and the engine will respond quickly enough to avoid the stall. This you couldnt do before.

So for me, there are literally zero downsides (aside from splashing cash!) for this change.

[BiggaJ]

When I had my 2009 4.3 I had AHM (link below) fit a new twin plate clutch and lightened flywheel, they also raise the revs at tick-over to account for the drop in rotating mass of the lighter flywheel, this was done via a remap they wrote when Adrian (the owner) had his own 4.3 clutch done. The remap was written by him on his own rolling road and so when others talk about easier to stall ... I never had that at all.

At the same time I had the 200 cell cats and GT4 air filters fitted. I chose AHM for a number reasons, one is location to me which is about 2 miles from home, all the local Aston guys use his services so Adrian came highly recommended and AHM was originally started by Adrian for building and tuning race engines mainly for Alfa Romeo's but later got into racing them himself then got involved with Aston and a GT3 race team.

The bite point didn't change for me, the pedal feel was better and the pedal weight much reduced and allows the engine to gather revs far more effectively. It is one of the best upgrades I had.

https://astonmartincare.co.uk/clutch/

Edited by BiggaJ on Friday 15th May 12:40

Edited by BiggaJ on Friday 15th May 16:33

Edited by BiggaJ on Friday 15th May 16:34

[LPH]

My bank balance is not going to thank you guys