Squirmy rear end

[moktabe]

The car not me..

Car is fitted with Pirelli tyres, they were brand new when I collected the car last June so plenty of life left in them.

Have noticed that when driving let's say spiritedly the back end has a slight squirm to it. Not enough to feel dangerous but enough to make you lift off slightly. Any thoughts regarding Michelins? Are they likely to stop the squirming or is it something we have to live with?

Last thing I want to do is fork out for a set of Michelins to find it's a trait of the car.

Car is a V12S btw and pressures are spot on.

Edited by moktabe on Monday 20th February 14:01

[4Q]

Cold tyres and damp roads on a high powered RWD drive car are always going to need extra care.

[moktabe]

4Q said:

Cold tyres and damp roads on a high powered RWD drive car are always going to need extra care.

Appreciate that but it happens when the tyres are warm and the road is dry.

[BiggaJ]

EDIT: Apologies, I was writing this before I saw any replies hence, exclude some of what I wrote below.

And you've never noticed it before with the Pirelli's fitted?

Was the road damp/wet? was it cold?

Could be an issue with tyres or suspension, leaking shock perhaps?

I had this issue in all conditions but the tyres on the car were past their best, plenty of tread but several years old and they were the RE05 Bridgestone's. I also knew I had a misting rear shock that eventually would hit the bump stops as it got slowly worse. I was looking to upgrade the shocks so did all 4 in time and fitted the car with new MPS4S tyres and now it feels great.

To my thinking, if you have not noticed this before and the tyres are relatively new then maybe the issue isn't related to tyres and in fact lay elsewhere.

[moktabe]

Car was into AM Notts last week for a different issue and whilst it was there they checked all suspension etc and all was fine.

Yes, noticed it last year a bit and thought I'd get Michelins once the Pirellis were worn out however, if it's a trait of having the Pirellis they'll be off sooner rather than later.

As already said, roads were dry and tyres were warm. If it was cold and damp then I'd expect it to squirm about.

Wondered if there was a difference in sidewall stiffness between the makes. had Michelins on a few previous cars and was happy with the performance of them however, no previous cars had the power that this one has. It doesn't feel as it's going to throw me into the nearest hedge, more of a feeling of slightly squirming, nothing excessive.

This is my first experience of Pirellis hence the question of them versus Michelins.

Edited by moktabe on Monday 20th February 14:27

Edited by moktabe on Monday 20th February 14:27

[BiggaJ]

moktabe said:

Car was into AM Notts last week for a different issue and whilst it was there they checked all suspension etc and all was fine.

Yes, noticed it last year a bit and thought I'd get Michelins once the Pirellis were worn out however, if it's a trait of having the Pirellis they'll be off sooner rather than later.

As already said, roads were dry and tyres were warm. If it was cold and damp then I'd expect it to squirm about.

I guess you've answered your own question. I will say, the Michelin's do make a huge difference but then I wasn't exactly comparing like with like given the age of the tyres my car came with. I would think you will have a much more objective view as the Prielli's you have are fairly new.

It would be interesting to see what others think.

Edited by BiggaJ on Monday 20th February 14:30

[reddiesel]

I have the Pirellis fitted to a year old Vantage and suffer from exactly the same problem . I put it down to the car being RWD and over enthusiasm with the throttle . My first thoughts were I had never experienced this with the F Type SVR nor the 911 GTS though the SVR to be fair was an AWD system so more controlled if thats the right expression .

[Longy00000]

My Vanquish S does exactly the same on pirelli tyres whether warm, cold doesn't make that much difference when you get on it.
I think it's rhe tyres on mine but again they are almost new so will be staying on for a while yet.
They have never let go they just give the sense they might it's quite weird really but I don't notice anything at less than 2/ 3rds power it's only noticed at the top of power band.
I do think the tc comes in about a second too late though

[AdamV12V]

moktabe said:

The car not me..

Car is fitted with Pirelli tyres, they were brand new when I collected the car last June so plenty of life left in them.

Have noticed that when driving let's say spiritedly the back end has a slight squirm to it. Not enough to feel dangerous but enough to make you lift off slightly. Any thoughts regarding Michelins? Are they likely to stop the squirming or is it something we have to live with?

Last thing I want to do is fork out for a set of Michelins to find it's a trait of the car.

Car is a V12S btw and pressures are spot on.

Which type of Pirelli's?

You could have two different type of Pirelli tyre on a V12VS as both were options.

There is the "Pirelli P-Zero Corsa" - these are a summer tyre and are terrible in the cold (below say 10C) or the wet. Sure they are awesome in on a hot dry day, but they would most definately make your rear end squirmy during Feb!

Then there is the normal "Pirelli P-Zero" - these are an all year round tyre and are much much better in the cold / wet. Sure many people here will tell you the Michelin is way better but these tyres are much closer to the Michelin in overall performance than the Corsa is. Providing you are driving with an eye on conditions you really shouldn't be too squirmy with these.

So if you have Corsa's then that is your problem - 100%

[moktabe]

AdamV12V said:

moktabe said:

The car not me..

Car is fitted with Pirelli tyres, they were brand new when I collected the car last June so plenty of life left in them.

Have noticed that when driving let's say spiritedly the back end has a slight squirm to it. Not enough to feel dangerous but enough to make you lift off slightly. Any thoughts regarding Michelins? Are they likely to stop the squirming or is it something we have to live with?

Last thing I want to do is fork out for a set of Michelins to find it's a trait of the car.

Car is a V12S btw and pressures are spot on.

Which type of Pirelli's?

You could have two different type of Pirelli tyre on a V12VS as both were options.

There is the "Pirelli P-Zero Corsa" - these are a summer tyre and are terrible in the cold (below say 10C) or the wet. Sure they are awesome in on a hot dry day, but they would most definately make your rear end squirmy during Feb!

Then there is the normal "Pirelli P-Zero" - these are an all year round tyre and are much much better in the cold / wet. Sure many people here will tell you the Michelin is way better but these tyres are much closer to the Michelin in overall performance than the Corsa is. Providing you are driving with an eye on conditions you really shouldn't be too squirmy with these.

So if you have Corsa's then that is your problem - 100%

Normal P-Zero.

Love the idea of the Corsa but the car is used 12 months of the year so maybe not the most practical things to have fitted

[alscar]

I specced the “ normal “ P Zeros from new on my V12S and when they needed changing put a new set on. In the dry when spirited never had the slightest issue.
In the wet or just greasy then turned the spirited driving down but still no issues.

[4Q]

moktabe said:

4Q said:

Cold tyres and damp roads on a high powered RWD drive car are always going to need extra care.

Appreciate that but it happens when the tyres are warm and the road is dry.

I wasn’t trying to be facetious btw. I drive mine all year and in (almost) all weathers and it’s a very different experience this time of year. I’d be surprised if your tyres ever get properly warm on the roads unless you’re doing constant high speeds
Edited to add. When I had a DB9 I used to swap for Sottozero winter tyres and the difference was night & day. I can’t get them to fit my DBS so I drive a little more tentatively.

Edited by 4Q on Monday 20th February 16:55

[moktabe]

4Q said:

moktabe said:

4Q said:

Cold tyres and damp roads on a high powered RWD drive car are always going to need extra care.

Appreciate that but it happens when the tyres are warm and the road is dry.

I wasn’t trying to be facetious btw. I drive mine all year and in (almost) all weathers and it’s a very different experience this time of year. I’d be surprised if your tyres ever get properly warm on the roads unless you’re doing constant high speeds
Edited to add. When I had a DB9 I used to swap for Sottozero winter tyres and the difference was night & day. I can’t get them to fit my DBS so I drive a little more tentatively.

Edited by 4Q on Monday 20th February 16:55

Never thought you were for a moment bud.

Never having had a car with this power maybe I'm expecting a bit too much from the tyres.

[rallye101]

off topic but x2 grim topic titles right next to each other

[SHIFTY]

Maybe off topic but the new Vantage V12 now uses Michelins, even the dealer did not know when I spoke with him.

[belfry]

My DB9 does this too. Also in Pirelli’s. I now quite enjoy the thrill. It hasn’t spun yet!

[Caddyshack]

My Boxster felt a bit loose at the rear, I got a 4 wheel alignment checked and there was incorrect toe at the rear, it wasn’t huge changes but it transformed it.

[anonymous-user]

moktabe said:

The car not me..

Car is fitted with Pirelli tyres, they were brand new when I collected the car last June so plenty of life left in them.

Have noticed that when driving let's say spiritedly the back end has a slight squirm to it. Not enough to feel dangerous but enough to make you lift off slightly. Any thoughts regarding Michelins? Are they likely to stop the squirming or is it something we have to live with?

Last thing I want to do is fork out for a set of Michelins to find it's a trait of the car.

Car is a V12S btw and pressures are spot on.

Edited by moktabe on Monday 20th February 14:01

The Pirellis are dire. When I bought mine (same car) I was alarmed to get the rear squirming booting it in 3rd. In a straight line, on a hot dry day with warm tyres with plenty of tread.

I ditched them for the Michelins as soon as I could.

My pet theory is that AM paired with Pirellli to get the Corsa tyre working on the car. Having done that they were stuck with Pirelli as their supplier, and the PZero isn’t nearly as good a treaded tyre as the competition.

[reddiesel]

Wherever I look the P Zero seems to enjoy a pretty poor reputation , is that warranted ? I had them on a V8 R and SVR F Type and people told me they were rubbish then likewise on a 911 GTS . I even had the Pirelli P6000 on an X350 XJ back in the early 2000s and again the consensus was that they were poor .

[moktabe]

Caddyshack said:

My Boxster felt a bit loose at the rear, I got a 4 wheel alignment checked and there was incorrect toe at the rear, it wasn’t huge changes but it transformed it.

When I first got the car I booked it in for a full alignment. There wasn't a wheel that was pointing in the right direction.

Before..

Edited by moktabe on Tuesday 21st February 06:55