FTO or GTS-T or Silvia

[onny]

Hi all,

I need some advice. I'm normally on the TVR forum but I'm about to move back to Oz taking my TVR Tuscan with me. The Tuscan will be a weekend car with maybe 3 track days per year.

I'm looking for a daily drive back in Oz that I can take to the track maybe once a month. I need a car that is easy to drive around town first and foremost but it should also be good on a track. That'll rule out most of the Assie cars like the falcon and commodore etc as they don't handle well around a track.

I've done some research and for my budget I can get a Japanese import such as a FTO, R33 or S13 silvia.

My preference at the moment is for the FTO as its not a turbo car. I've got nothing against a turbo car but the FTO V6 is a better option for driving around town with the tough speeding laws in Oz.

Is the FTO right for me or should I get something else?

What is the FTO like to drive in traffic and what's it like around the track? Are they reliable? What's the tipronic gearbox like?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Onny.

[sparkyhx]

R33 and S13 sylvia are a lot older than FTO's so its difficult to equate 'daily drivability' as the FTO is probably a lot 'tighter' and being younger would probably be more reliable (not that the sylvia is unreliable - plenty of 100k+ ones about). What about an S14 the SR engines are possibly more reliable than the CA.

do you want to tune? if yes then realistically the Sylvia and GTST are cheaper to tune than an NA.

I like the FTO, but for me RWD rules.

[onny]

I'm not interest in tuning it, the more standard the better for me except for maybe better suspensions. Can not get S14 in Oz as they can't be imported.

RWD do rule! The Tuscan is RWD and its really great fun, but I think a front or 4WD is better for doing <40mph around town.

What's the FTO like around the track? Is it a reasonably quick car? Is the handling good?

Edited by onny on Thursday 14th June 20:18

Edited by onny on Thursday 14th June 20:19

[Vixpy1]

I have a big soft spot for the FTO, we have alot of them in, and they are really good little cars, the Gpx is not slow either

[sparkyhx]

onny said:

Can not get S14 in Oz as they can't be imported.

What's the FTO like around the track? Is it a reasonably quick car? Is the handling good?

I believe they have a reputation for one of the best handling FWD cars.

S14 not available?????? - i'm puzzled there is a big S14 community in Oz - We get a lot of parts from oz in fact SXOC have organised group buys of vvt parts from OZ

[onny]

Sorry, need to rephrase that to say the S14 is not available as an import because Nissan had officially released it in Oz and because of that they can not be brought in as import from Japan. Because of no cheaper import, the S14 is outside of my price range.

Can anyone give me a bit more details about the performance and handling of a standard R33 turbo. Is there much difference in performance between the R33 and the FTO?

[GravelBen]

onny said:

Is there much difference in performance between the R33 and the FTO?

YES. The Skyline is also far far more tuneable but will probably cost you a bit more to run.



ETA: Actually I found out that the top FTOs (GPX) are pushing about 200 bhp so there may not be quite as much difference as I thought, the Skyline is about 200kg heavier. biggest difference will be traction and handling (RWD v FWD) and torque - the Skyline will have a strong mid-range whereas the Mitsubishi MIVEC motors are broadly similar to Honda VTEC, you have to rev them pretty hard to get the power.

Skyline R33 GTS-25T : 250hp / 294Nm / 1370kg = 182 hp/tonne, 215 Nm/tonne

FTO GPX Mivec : 200hp / 200Nm / 1170kg = 171 hp/tonne, 171 Nm/tonne

Edited by GravelBen on Friday 15th June 05:25

[_Batty_]

Vixpy1 said:

I have a big soft spot for the FTO, we have alot of them in, and they are really good little cars, the Gpx is not slow either

not hugely quick either though.

mine was all mouth no trousers

184bhp @ fly according to Mr RR himself..

handle very nicely though, and look more expensive than they are.
cost buttons to run, and not a huge amount goes wrong.
sounds better than a MR2 Tub, but with less 'action'.

i'd have a Black MR2 turbo t-bar or Black GPX manual, if it where me

[delS1]

Hi Onny,

I owned an FTO for about 4 Yrs, and have to say what an excellent car she was. Reliable, cheap to run, bullet proof engine which sounded awesome at about 3000+ revs and still a head turner ( even if 10Yrs old)

For a FWD she was very good on road handling, and although not as quick as some 2.0Lt she didn’t hang about.

delS1

[kippax]

Have said lots of times but for the money the FTO is by far the best car that I have ever owned. Not hugely fast no but looks great & that Mivec engine is a cracker (Make sure you get the GPX model not the GR although both are V6 only the GPX has the Mivec engine)

H

[liner33]

You can make the GTST quicker very easily ie bigger tyres and getting rid of the 2 stage boost makes the car a lot faster and its a 2 min job requiring a small change to the wiring.

Tis a heavy car the stock suspension and brakes arent up to trackday use

[MrFlibbles]

_Batty_ said:

Vixpy1 said:

I have a big soft spot for the FTO, we have alot of them in, and they are really good little cars, the Gpx is not slow either

not hugely quick either though.

mine was all mouth no trousers

To be honest though, I'd go as far as saying the Silver Slut *was* slow!

[LegacyLad]

I had an FTO 2.0GPX for 2 years and covered 50k miles taking the cars mileage to 80kish.

I loved every minute of it, the noise when you changed up a gear at maximum revs was fantastic and as stated above it never failed to turn heads. I averaged 30mpg using optimax(now V-power) and the car never gave me any problems but servicing costs when using the Mitsi main dealers was shocking.

I took it over to the Ring as well and it even drew a crowd there with people wanting to know what was under the bonnet and what it was(!). It handled very well and being a FWD you never felt like you were going to kiss the armco!

In short it isn't the best handling car I've ever owned (MR2 mk3) or the most comfortable (Legacy) or even the most frugal (Clio) but it was the best all rounder and for me the best car I've owned to date!!!

[onny]

I've changed my mind again as I've just landed back in Oz. I was looking to get a FTO GPX but its not as tuneable as a Nissan.

I'm now looking at a Silvia S15 as I've scraped a little bit more money together and the Yen is weaker so I will be importing one now. Will this be better for handling around the track? The other option is still a R33/R34 turbo (not the GTR). S15 or Skyline.

Thanks
Onny.

[Chauch]

I ran an R34GTT for a while - fantastic all round car and certainly OK for daily use. I am a big fan of the Silvia as well and at least you will end up with creature comforts with either of these...

[GravelBen]

onny said:

I'm now looking at a Silvia S15...Will this be better for handling around the track? The other option is still a R33/R34 turbo (not the GTR).

Yes. The S15 is much lighter than a Skyline, and has a reputation for very nice handling (never driven one myself), especially if you like a bit of sideways action.

[Foolish Dave]

The FTO GPX I used to have was good

- the Tip Gearbox was quick, but had issues going 2nd to 3rd under full load.
It was very easy to drive and they're really more GT cars than out and out speed cars: as said they have no low-down torque, but the high end is really good.
Point to point they are pretty slick.
They are one of the best FWD cars there is - the 'Teg type R has it for feeling, but not the top end. The Elan M100 has it for low-end torque, grip and feeling.
They can go very quick - on EuroHoon I could mix it with the exotica on the twisties no problem - but my speed limiter (JDM cars are limited to 180kmph) meant they left me on the long straights.
I spent a LOT of money making my car go much quicker than standard and keeping it NA, but for a much smaller amount you can get the chassis stiffer (get the rear as stiff as you can as this really helps the handling (as long as you hold your nerve and punch the brakes just as you get to the apex)).
The engines are really hard.
The GPX (V6 with extra cams profile) suffers from engine oil sweating, but that's normal.
The engines are strong, but mine started to suffer with fueling, mainly as I hadn't done a proper remap after all the work I did to it.

A MUST for the car is an induction kit (fancy air filter) and a good exhaust. Whenever I hear one now, they sound very weak and small comapared to mine. They are just straight swap parts and don't need anything to happen to the ECU.
If you can in Oz, get a decat pipe too - it actually saps a bit of top end power, but gives slightly better mid-range. I couldn't tell these changes - but I could hear the extra volume is

If I got another, it'd be a manual GR (V6 non-mivec (silly cams)) as they are a lot easier to balance and make nutter-like.

Oh, and even though it's a V6, and even though I have already said it - these engine have really pants torque!

RE Tack days - I used mine on track a fair bit. The brakes will need upgrading, not the discs as everybody seems to do, but the pads, the fluid and the lines. Put in braided hoses, but make sure you cover them up as they aren't made to take the strain of normal road use and not get changed all the time.
The rear panels also took a lot of strain and would seperate enough to let water in off the road. The spare wheel area has a bung to drain the water out though and it only ever let water in under high cornering loads - as soon as I was off the track, it was fine again.

Can't comment on the other cars you mentioned, but I hope that helps.

[JRX7]

onny, I've owned a couple of the cars on your short list. firstly the R33 GTS-t, good bulletproof RB25DET engine, but the car is a bit on the heavy side. very tuneable though. a great exhaust note when you put a 3" straight off the turbo. And I'm currently driving a S15 Silvia Spec-R. while not as powerful, it is of course lighter and handles well. they're a popular drift car, after all. SR20DET engine is good but is still only a 4cyl. the S15 is arguably better looking and a more recent car than the R33. I've found both easy to live with, but I've only done basic bolt-on mods. HTH.

[Pierscoe1]

I hope this is on-topic enough... but please do tell more about your S15..

I'm seriously considering one as a next car..

(lots of pics would be cool too.... can't beat a bit of car-porn!)

[JRX7]

yeah sure, although at the risk of hijacking onny's thread! its a Spec-R, 250bhp, it doesn't have the aero kit though (I prefer the no rear wing look). got some Apexi toys on it, and some aftermarket wheels, but apart from that is stock standard. I'm thinking of getting a HKS downpipe and de-cat, if anyone knows whether this is a worthwhile modification (ie any performance gain?), please let me know.
some nice touches to detail, like the factory A-pillar boost gauge.