Moving from a straight six to a 2.0l hybrid
Discussion
Something I'm mulling over at the moment that I'd be interested to hear people's wisdom on.
Currently have a 2011 F11 535i Touring. Had it 3.5 years. It's brilliant. Makes a very strong case for being the best 'proper' car I've ever owned. I would happily keep it until it's bitter end but....
About this time last year, my son started a new school and it means that my wife and I now have to do both do school runs with our daughter going in one direction and my son the other. Our mileage has increased a lot. Up until last week we were doing the trips in our Panda Cross Twinair and the 535i. Both averaging little more than 30mpg. Our fuel bills are enormous! Last week, I bought an i3 and we'll try to do as much mileage as possible in that but it still leaves us with either the Panda or 535i doing a lot of the heavy lifting. We have the Panda because, A) I love it and B) we live quite rurally on an ungritted, steep hill and when we get snow (which does happen a fair bit) it's really the only car that stays mobile.
So I'm wondering whether I should change the 535i to something that can run on electricity for all the short journeys. Not a massive fan of SUV's. Have had a string of 5-series. They very much suit me. At the reasonably affordable end of the market there is very little that appeals other than Panamera's but their battery size is quite limiting and the estate ones which is what I'd want are too new to be cheap. Which leaves the 530e. Possibly X-Drive. There are some Volvo options kicking around but in all honesty none of this stuff is making me very excited to spend proper money on.
Has anyone made the change to the 2.0 litre hybrid cars? It ticks a lot of boxes for our needs especially in x-drive touring form but I'm very worried I'll miss the straight six and the general noise and refinement that comes with that. I'm also a little concerned about performance when the battery is depleted, though maybe it could be remapped a little?
Have to admit, I'm also dreading the prospect of selling the 535i privately but I think I'd have to do to get any sort reasonable money out of it.
Currently have a 2011 F11 535i Touring. Had it 3.5 years. It's brilliant. Makes a very strong case for being the best 'proper' car I've ever owned. I would happily keep it until it's bitter end but....
About this time last year, my son started a new school and it means that my wife and I now have to do both do school runs with our daughter going in one direction and my son the other. Our mileage has increased a lot. Up until last week we were doing the trips in our Panda Cross Twinair and the 535i. Both averaging little more than 30mpg. Our fuel bills are enormous! Last week, I bought an i3 and we'll try to do as much mileage as possible in that but it still leaves us with either the Panda or 535i doing a lot of the heavy lifting. We have the Panda because, A) I love it and B) we live quite rurally on an ungritted, steep hill and when we get snow (which does happen a fair bit) it's really the only car that stays mobile.
So I'm wondering whether I should change the 535i to something that can run on electricity for all the short journeys. Not a massive fan of SUV's. Have had a string of 5-series. They very much suit me. At the reasonably affordable end of the market there is very little that appeals other than Panamera's but their battery size is quite limiting and the estate ones which is what I'd want are too new to be cheap. Which leaves the 530e. Possibly X-Drive. There are some Volvo options kicking around but in all honesty none of this stuff is making me very excited to spend proper money on.
Has anyone made the change to the 2.0 litre hybrid cars? It ticks a lot of boxes for our needs especially in x-drive touring form but I'm very worried I'll miss the straight six and the general noise and refinement that comes with that. I'm also a little concerned about performance when the battery is depleted, though maybe it could be remapped a little?
Have to admit, I'm also dreading the prospect of selling the 535i privately but I think I'd have to do to get any sort reasonable money out of it.
Go drive one.
The battery fills in the 2.0 lack of torque compared to a bigger engine.
So it never feels like a small engine.
The car will always keep a reserve of battery for the hybrid system to work so wont just suddenly be a 2.0l car because you’ve used the battery.
It won’t sound as good as a straight six but new cars are so quiet you barely hear it anyway.
The hybrid bmw systems are really quite good. Seamless transition and a decent turn of pace for what it is.
Be mindful the batteries have to go somewhere so boot space is less than a full ice car.
The battery fills in the 2.0 lack of torque compared to a bigger engine.
So it never feels like a small engine.
The car will always keep a reserve of battery for the hybrid system to work so wont just suddenly be a 2.0l car because you’ve used the battery.
It won’t sound as good as a straight six but new cars are so quiet you barely hear it anyway.
The hybrid bmw systems are really quite good. Seamless transition and a decent turn of pace for what it is.
Be mindful the batteries have to go somewhere so boot space is less than a full ice car.
MichalPH said:
My friend is on his 3rd, all remapped close to 400bhp. The only downside seems to be boot space and noise.
It’s quite surprising how much power the remapped versions make. I think this means taking the standard ICE output from 180bhp to nearer 300bhp. Seems a heck of a jump. MichalPH said:
My friend is on his 3rd, all remapped close to 400bhp. The only downside seems to be boot space and noise.
It’s quite surprising how much power the remapped versions make. I think this means taking the standard ICE output from 180bhp to nearer 300bhp. Seems a heck of a jump. Gad-Westy said:
MichalPH said:
My friend is on his 3rd, all remapped close to 400bhp. The only downside seems to be boot space and noise.
It s quite surprising how much power the remapped versions make. I think this means taking the standard ICE output from 180bhp to nearer 300bhp. Seems a heck of a jump. Now I'm quite risk averse when it comes to these things, but I just wouldn't want to run any modern BMW without the safety net of a manufacturer's warranty.
I am on my second
I had an X3M40i - which like you I loved and I love the straight 6
But had to be practical and got and ran for 4 years a G31 530e - that generation has the slightly raised floor, I found it no issue at all, we had a golden retriever and he was very comfortable in there.
Pros - looks great, drives very very well, ran for 4 years with 0 issues, I used 40% battery for my journeys. Even towed my caravan to the south of France twice with it. tows the van very well indeed too
Cons - small fuel tank and small battery. We generally got around 20-25miles on a full charge. So to make them work you need to charge.
I have a new G61 530e now which I picked up in July - this has no raised floor and a normal (bigger fuel tank) and a bigger battery, We now get 56-60 miles on a charge and total range of 600 miles.
Both I did personally miss the inline 6 BUT the drive for everyday and now the economy is fantastic (I must be getting old, but then I have a Caterham for fun!!)
I took this car to France with the van this summer and with 4 of us and a 1600kg caravan towing for 2k miles it returned 34mpg which is pretty good.
It can raise it skirt and get going when I want, sport mode or comfort with boost mode for overtaking is effortless.
I had an X3M40i - which like you I loved and I love the straight 6
But had to be practical and got and ran for 4 years a G31 530e - that generation has the slightly raised floor, I found it no issue at all, we had a golden retriever and he was very comfortable in there.
Pros - looks great, drives very very well, ran for 4 years with 0 issues, I used 40% battery for my journeys. Even towed my caravan to the south of France twice with it. tows the van very well indeed too
Cons - small fuel tank and small battery. We generally got around 20-25miles on a full charge. So to make them work you need to charge.
I have a new G61 530e now which I picked up in July - this has no raised floor and a normal (bigger fuel tank) and a bigger battery, We now get 56-60 miles on a charge and total range of 600 miles.
Both I did personally miss the inline 6 BUT the drive for everyday and now the economy is fantastic (I must be getting old, but then I have a Caterham for fun!!)
I took this car to France with the van this summer and with 4 of us and a 1600kg caravan towing for 2k miles it returned 34mpg which is pretty good.
It can raise it skirt and get going when I want, sport mode or comfort with boost mode for overtaking is effortless.
FWIW my sis in law went from an E90 330d to a G30 530e and she absolutely loved it (bar the lack of boot space)
I drove it a few times and it was a superb car and would have happily owned one if offered
The battery certainly makes up for the missing torque from the engine; but, it would never replace the smoothness of a BMW straight 6…
I drove it a few times and it was a superb car and would have happily owned one if offered
The battery certainly makes up for the missing torque from the engine; but, it would never replace the smoothness of a BMW straight 6…
Worth knowing those 400bhp figures are usually the petrol engine and the electric motor added together, a map only changes the petrol side, so it won’t turn into a different car with a flat battery but it does wake up the mid-range. The 2.0 is the same B48 family as the 330i and 530i, so it’s very well known to the tuning platforms. On the warranty point, it depends which car you end up with: a G31 that’s already past BMW’s warranty, it isn’t really a factor, but on a newer G61 still covered I’d leave it standard until that runs out. If you do go for a later car, check whether its ECU needs unlocking before it can be mapped, as that adds a step. And take your usual load on the test drive, the older car’s raised boot floor is the main compromise.
vimotu44 said:
Worth knowing those 400bhp figures are usually the petrol engine and the electric motor added together, a map only changes the petrol side, so it won t turn into a different car with a flat battery but it does wake up the mid-range. The 2.0 is the same B48 family as the 330i and 530i, so it s very well known to the tuning platforms. On the warranty point, it depends which car you end up with: a G31 that s already past BMW s warranty, it isn t really a factor, but on a newer G61 still covered I d leave it standard until that runs out. If you do go for a later car, check whether its ECU needs unlocking before it can be mapped, as that adds a step. And take your usual load on the test drive, the older car s raised boot floor is the main compromise.
Ive been looking into getting a 330e/530e and have read there are different versions of the B48 There are, but for a tune the version matters less than the car’s age. The 330e and 530e both run the 2.0 B48, earlier cars on the original version and later ones on the updated one, and the main flash platforms support both. The bit to watch is the ECU: cars on newer software, roughly 2020 builds onwards, need it unlocking before they can be mapped, which adds a step and some cost. So if you’re planning to tune it, check the build date on any car you look at. Also worth checking how much electric range it still gets, as that’s what you’ll notice day to day. Happy to answer anything else on here if you narrow it down.
vimotu44 said:
There are, but for a tune the version matters less than the car s age. The 330e and 530e both run the 2.0 B48, earlier cars on the original version and later ones on the updated one, and the main flash platforms support both. The bit to watch is the ECU: cars on newer software, roughly 2020 builds onwards, need it unlocking before they can be mapped, which adds a step and some cost. So if you re planning to tune it, check the build date on any car you look at. Also worth checking how much electric range it still gets, as that s what you ll notice day to day. Happy to answer anything else on here if you narrow it down.
Cheers. I'm only looking at Tourings so I think I'm right in saying they're all LCI and post-2020. I actually went to have a poke around one this week and a brief test drive. I was pleasantly surprised with the powertrain. It's all very muted but quite effective. The car I looked at was pretty basic on spec and looking online that seems to be a common theme on these. Our F11 is very well equipped and there are certain things that I would now not want to be without. Mainly comfort seats, pan roof and heated rear seats. The first two are easy enough to find but it seems like the latter is usually only spec'd with the comfort plus pack which is rare. Only one car for sale with that at the moment and it doesn't have the pan roof. I think for now, I'll sit on this idea and may just keep half an eye out for the right car but I'm still quite on the fence so in no rush, Uncle Meat said:
There's always the 550e if you want the straight 6 hybrid, although it's a very new model I think.
Yep. I'll keep an eye on those. Though even next to the G31, they look a big car. Next to my F11, I guess they'll seem even heftier. But they could be a good box ticker in a few years if I keep the 535i going for a while longer. That said, It would be rude of me to skip the G31 since I've had every other 5-series since the E34! To be honest, one of the reasons I'm stalling a bit, is that since getting the i3, we've actually managed to keep 'petrol' miles down to a much more sensible amount just by using the EV at every single opportunity. On Monday, I need to use the 535i for a 500 mile trip. Can't be bothered doing that in a small battery EV, REX or not. But if this is to become the typical usage now for the 535i, then I'm not really going to save a great deal of cash going to a PHEV. So it might well be the right thing to do, when it's time to replace the F11 anyway but it seems prudent to keep my powder dry for now. A big part of the problem, is that, even at 15 years old and 156k miles, it feels fresh as a daisy. Looks good, drives really nicely, comfortable, fast etc.. If I trade it in, I'd get so little for it and I'd be spending £20k on something else that, at very best, will feel about the same but actually might seem a bit worse in a few ways.
What is an enormous fuel bill? Is you are doing 15k pa in your 535i at 30mpg your fuel bill would be about £3900 at current prices. Let's say a 30e hybrid cuts your fuel bill in half (would need a LOT of electric running), then you may save £2k per year. I suspect you would lose that in increased depreciation. Plus will be driving a far inferior car. My view, keep the 535i 
matt21 said:
What is an enormous fuel bill? Is you are doing 15k pa in your 535i at 30mpg your fuel bill would be about £3900 at current prices. Let's say a 30e hybrid cuts your fuel bill in half (would need a LOT of electric running), then you may save £2k per year. I suspect you would lose that in increased depreciation. Plus will be driving a far inferior car. My view, keep the 535i
Yeah, mileage is About 25k but hopefully that is now tumbling. But the thought with the xdrive was to replace our panda as well. Trouble is, when I first started looking, I was looking at £15k cars. As soon as you start getting picky about spec etc, you're into £25k+ and the tenuous maths gets even more tenuous. Anyway moot point now as the idea is on ice for the time being. I can see me revisiting this idea at some point though. heisthegaffer said:
Ive been looking into getting a 330e/530e and have read there are different versions of the B48
The 30e has a weaker version of the B48 than the one found in the 530i. The 30e share their engines with the Mini Cooper S's and the like of the same era. I considered a 520i and 530e before I bought my 530i, but the 184bhp of the 20i, with the weaker engine and generally lower specs put me off. I struggled to find a 530e with harmon kardon for instance. I was also concerned about battery life on an 8 or year old hybrid. Shame as I'd have liked to have been able to go to work on petrol and home on electric (coming home is more traffic and a bit more uphill, so electric would have been better for that part of the journey) plus around town would have been great. Forums | BMW General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff