New Potential Owner researching 2.0d versus 3.0d / 3.5d

[Corv99]

hi all
currently driving an A6 Ultra Black Edition company car.. but going to be coming out and getting my own in a few months
I do about 25k miles area a year.. most of it motorway , A1M , A66 , M6 so some cruising at constant, and some traffic..

So I'm looking at spending about £22k on 3 year personal contract, then chuck it in and do it again!


Cars I'm looking at are :

4 Series ( coupe / Vert / GS) ,
5 Series ( although thinking they maybe a little dated in my price range)
maybe 3 series .. again little dated in my bracket although good value for money and spec.. so not fully ruling out.

So head tells me I should go for the 2.0d for economy factor as its my expense now to a certain degree , but on my shoulder I have a voice saying
most of my long driving will be motorway, so smaller engine makes sense, but after a crap day, or weekends be nice to have some power to play with!!
so go for the 3.0d or even the 3.5d..


> What would you do?
> Is the bigger engine much worse on economy if you drive in on motorway in Eco mode? it doesn't look to be that much worse on economy considering... Obviously not when playing but that's fine..
> 4 series big / comfortable enough for a cruiser or up it to 5 Series

anyone had any of the above, switched around among them? got a view on what you would do / done


also seen a website with some nice looking cars 'Your next car Ltd' in Notts .. they seem to specialise in the above, and have them with nice upgrade body kits and wheels which look really nice.. would normally sway towards main dealer but these guys seem Ok looking at some of the independent feedback.. but you never know!

thanks..

[helix402]

3.0l will be a much better driving experience and may not even use much more fuel. 3.5l doesn’t exist. It’s just a more powerful 3.0.

In some circumstances the 3.0 can be more economical than the 2.0.

Lots of people are very happy with 2.0l diesels. Try both and see which you prefer.

[Corv99]

helix402 said:

3.0l will be a much better driving experience and may not even use much more fuel. 3.5l doesn’t exist. It’s just a more powerful 3.0.

In some circumstances the 3.0 can be more economical than the 2.0.

Lots of people are very happy with 2.0l diesels. Try both and see which you prefer.

thanks for the reply...
yes I think the 3.5 is a twin turbo version isn't it ?
I was thinking perhaps the 3.0d would be a good half way house.. and bigger engine might be not far off on a motorway ( I have a 5.7l corvette that does 30 mpg on motorways as its just ticking over!!)
my Audi is 2.0d and is OK to be fair .. I'm just a bit tempted with a bit more power for those odd occasions :-)

[aeropilot]

530d would be my choice in the circumstances.

Better comfort and build quality of the 5 series over the 3/4 series would win me over.

[rayyan171]

2.0d is the bog standard motorway cruiser engine. Reasonable performance, whilst cheap on fuel and running costs. However, I would be willing to trade in a few MPG and slightly higher tax for much more performance. Granted, the higher performance 35d engine is much more susceptible to lower fuel economy, but that is only due to the drivers right foot. A X5 can achieve 30mpg+ if treated very sensibly, but with all that power on tap it really depends on how the driver drives. However, I personally think, that in a standard 5 series, the MPG tradeoff is marginal between the 20d and 30d/35d engine, and the 35d engine is simply better with more power across the rev range. In my opinion, the 30d engine is good only if you want a 6 cylinder diesel but need the highest MPG possible. The 35d engine is much better for the motorway overall, that second turbocharger is what is needed.

[aeropilot]

rayyan171 said:

2.0d is the bog standard motorway cruiser engine. Reasonable performance, whilst cheap on fuel and running costs. However, I would be willing to trade in a few MPG and slightly higher tax for much more performance. Granted, the higher performance 35d engine is much more susceptible to lower fuel economy, but that is only due to the drivers right foot. A X5 can achieve 30mpg+ if treated very sensibly, but with all that power on tap it really depends on how the driver drives. However, I personally think, that in a standard 5 series, the MPG tradeoff is marginal between the 20d and 30d/35d engine, and the 35d engine is simply better with more power across the rev range. In my opinion, the 30d engine is good only if you want a 6 cylinder diesel but need the highest MPG possible. The 35d engine is much better for the motorway overall, that second turbocharger is what is needed.

The 35d/40d engine is much, much nicer to drive, the better throttle response plus the fact that the peak torque is 500rpm lower, which is a lot on a diesel with a narrow rev range. There's very little trade off in mpg between a 30d and 35d/40d as well.

[Corv99]

jflower said:

Does this mean you have c. £600 a month to spend on car.

If it does I think I'd be looking a new car offers from BMW - they do some really good deals (especially on big diesels).

Thanks Guy's ...

and using some of the on line calculators around £500 area ideally.. I'm trying not to get drawn too much into pushing it up, as I will end up with an M4 :-)
I know how weak I can be..
So between £20 to £22k , and using their on line tools, you seem to get for that per month > a decent car that's quite high spec'd up , with around 20k - 25k miles on the clock ..

[Corv99]

jflower said:

You only live once ...

https://www.marshall.co.uk/bmw/new-car-offers/m5/

If I wasn't 7 months into my current car I'd be all over this

Man Maths can justify it somehow I'm sure

there are some really good deals on the M140i out there just now - the 140 is a suprisingly "big" small car

ps I ran a 435d for a couple of years and they are fantastic cars !


Also worth considering a 640d - the interior of these is far superior to a 4/5 series - Coming from an Audi you could be dissappointed with a 4/5 series.

https://www.marshall.co.uk/bmw/used-cars/9760835-b...

Edited by jflower on Tuesday 12th March 15:01

I'm terrible with cars.. but trying to keep some mode of sense on this!! I do have another car in the garage for dry days, wouldn't get away with what I would really like to get lol

I did consider a 6 Series .. but bit out of my price range due to my mileage as well.. actually never realised to 4.0 litre has decent MPG

[aeropilot]

Corv99 said:

actually never realised to 4.0 litre has decent MPG

Its a 3.0 litre

The 30d, 35d, 40d and 50d are all the same basic engine, just different turbo and software configs

[cerb4.5lee]

I've had a E90 330d, a E61 520d and a F13 640d. My favourite engine of the three was the 40d(twin turbo) because it offered a brilliant performance/economy mix and it offered 40mpg overall.

The 520d was my least favourite because of its engine(only offered 42mpg overall but without any real performance) but I would consider that engine in a 320d/420d though.

I thought that the 330d was an excellent motorway cruiser and I did 41k miles in it one year(all motorway), so I'd happily recommend one. Either a 420d or 430d are in consideration as my next car and I can't make my mind up which way to go. The 430d offers much better performance and 40mpg, or I sacrifice performance and go 420d and 50mpg.

[Pica-Pica]

Take a BMW 6 pot anytime.
If you do not need the response of a twin scroll (= TwinPowerTurbo) get the 330d. Also get that if you do not need xdrive.
I have a 335d. A great engine and transmission.

[Corv99]

Again thanks for the input...

Are general running costs servicing pretty similar across the cars?

Funny I also been looking at some 6 Coupes now as one or two near my budget .... They do look nicely finished..
A mate of mine has a 740d .. Nice car but loads of problems, think it was an early car... Wasn't new couple of years old.. But 20k in parts so far!! Thanks god he got an extended warrenty ... It's had new suspension, new gearbox .. Allsorts of problems... Which worries me on the 6 as its in the same bracket I would think

[RegMolehusband]

You’ll be dead one day. Maybe sooner than you would like. If you have any interest at all in cars and driving, don’t go for a 2.0d.

[pattyg]

RegMolehusband said:

You’ll be dead one day. Maybe sooner than you would like. If you have any interest at all in cars and driving, don’t go for a 2.0d.

I don’t agree. I’ve had a 205 Gti, Lotus Elise and 6 pot 325i and my 320d is still fun to drive.

[RegMolehusband]

More fun than a 3.5d?

[Eddieslofart]

RegMolehusband said:

More fun than a 3.5d?

Indeed. Sewing machine v turbine.

[Eddieslofart]

jflower said:

You only live once ...

https://www.marshall.co.uk/bmw/new-car-offers/m5/

If I wasn't 7 months into my current car I'd be all over this

Man Maths can justify it somehow I'm sure

there are some really good deals on the M140i out there just now - the 140 is a suprisingly "big" small car

ps I ran a 435d for a couple of years and they are fantastic cars !


Also worth considering a 640d - the interior of these is far superior to a 4/5 series - Coming from an Audi you could be dissappointed with a 4/5 series.

https://www.marshall.co.uk/bmw/used-cars/9760835-b...

Edited by jflower on Tuesday 12th March 15:01

Contract mileage 32k on the M5 ? That’s got to be a misprint ?

[griffdude]

Eddieslofart said:

Contract mileage 32k on the M5 ? That’s got to be a misprint ?

Over 4 years....


I’ve just had the same choice to make as the OP, having come from an early Alpina D3, I concur the 4 cyl BMW diesels sound pretty poor although mine had a nice growl when on boost.

Have ended up with a late 330d Xdrive M-Sport Touring & really like getting back into a 6 cyl car. Just need to fit the ACS spring kit & it’ll be perfect.

[gizlaroc]

I was gobbing off about how little difference there is between owning a diesel or petrol on the "is diesel dead?" thread in General Gassing.

I have owned so many models with both the diesel and the petrol that I reckon for someone buy new or up to 3 years old, overall running costs by choosing petrol would be between 2-4%.
I stand by that.

I did however say that if you wanted to save money you need to buy a smaller car and a 4 pot diesel. Then overall savings for someone doing 15k a year might creep up to 10 even 15%?

I said I would put my money where my mouth was and buy a 2 litre 3 Series and see how much I saved over the the 530d Touring, which in turn only saved me around 10% compared to the Mercedes 3.5 V6 petrol with 306hp.

I did however decide that I couldn't live with the smaller 3 series for doing 25k a year, too harsh and too noisy. So I went out a couple of weeks ago and bought a 2015 520d Touring with the new B47 engine.
I have to say the engine itself is quite shocking, but shocking in a good way, I am amazed at just how refined it is in day to day use, and also amazed at how well it drives for 190hp, I can imagine that with a small tweak to 230hp it would be quite something. I had an F11 530d before and always noticed how much heavier it felt compared to my 535d E61 before that, sort of ruined that point and go feeling that I love so much with BMW, the way the car pivots on the rear wheels the nose eager to go where you point the wheel. The F10/11 must be heavier up front? Maybe they dropped the light allow frame they were so proud of with the E60? I don't know. But I found it too heavy to truly enjoy and ended up back in an E61 when I sold the E350.
The one area where the 2 litre diesel let's itself down, no, the two areas, is higher up the rev range, it starts to show it is a 4 pot, but I can live with that as I don't normally get passed 3500rpm where is starts, so really not an issue.
However, the second area is and issue, MPG.

Don't get me wrong, on a run it is hitting 50mpg, but round town it is 36/37mpg.
I know the newer B47 engine has to hit Euro 6 and so is not as good as the earlier N47, but still, 45 nipping around and 55mpg on a run would be much nicer.
Customer has the F11 528i, he is averaging 32mpg from it, and gets 40 on a run. That is even lighter and nicer to drive. He does 15k a year and so costs him what £5 a week more in fuel. Total saving around 1% of overall ownership costs?

My 2007 530d was averaging around 32mpg calculated (OBC said 36!) so I was hoping for more. I was hoping to prove myself wrong, the reality is, don't worry too much about MPG, unless you do 30k a year the real world difference won't be a huge cost imho. Buy the car you want, it will last longer before boredom sets in, and for me anyway, the cost of swapping is always the biggest expense.


Apparently the 20d in the new G30/31 is far more frugal, genuine 45mpg average from owners, I looked at a 520d Touring up at £24.5k, put a deposit down on it at an agreed £24k, decided that would be a better buy than a 2016/17 old shape at £18k. But got a call back to say a colleague had already sold it.
So they are out there in budget at BMW, and even if not at BMW, all still have two years warranty left on them anyway.

In the end I bought a 2015 520d Touring for £13k, with a few must haves on it that I wanted, like xenons, nav professional, DAB, light interior.
I bought it as a car I can run for 2-4 years and not really owe me anything, and I am actually really liking it.
If I was buying again though I would buy a 530d or if I could find one, a 528i.

Go and test them, I would happily take a G31 520d as well, and reckon you will find one with your budget, or a little man maths.

I will track my running costs with this car though, if only to help me relax when I swap for a petrol rather than looking at the MPG. Not sure what it is about seeing 34mpg on the OBC compared with 40mpg, it scares me for some stupid reason. Reality is bugger all.

[imuir]

I do a similar mileage and opted for a 428i convertible, MPG similar to my previous 3lt diesels but much prefer the petrol especially compared to any 4 pot diesels. 3000 miles in and I’m averaging 40 mpg. Worth a look.