'Auto' bikes

[flushedmonkey]

I'm finding it more difficult to ride a manual bike after many years of riding due to arthritis in my left hand. I bought a 10 year old vfr1200f dct a couple of years back and that's pretty good. The early dct is a little bit janky and I only ever ride it in manual mode. Has the system development much in the last decade.

I didn't originally buy the vfr to alleviate the pain in my hand. I bought it to replace the 1190adv I had that got pretty uncomfortable on a weekend trip to the south of france. The vfr solved all the comfort issues... and just happened to be dct which I thought was a neat idea. I really like it but wonder wether the technology has improved.

Thanks.

[quigonjay]

Hi, autos have moved on since the early dct systems, here is a video looking at the pros and cons of some of the different systems, plus you have the likes of the Yamaha y-amt, Honda e-clutch etc lots of options these days

[H40405J]

flushedmonkey said:

I'm finding it more difficult to ride a manual bike after many years of riding due to arthritis in my left hand. I bought a 10 year old vfr1200f dct a couple of years back and that's pretty good. The early dct is a little bit janky and I only ever ride it in manual mode. Has the system development much in the last decade.

I didn't originally buy the vfr to alleviate the pain in my hand. I bought it to replace the 1190adv I had that got pretty uncomfortable on a weekend trip to the south of france. The vfr solved all the comfort issues... and just happened to be dct which I thought was a neat idea. I really like it but wonder wether the technology has improved.

Thanks.

Judging by the R1300GS ASA I test rode a couple of months ago, there’s still a long way to go.

It was pretty dire, changing up to 6th gear by 45mph, shifting from 2nd to 3rd at lean on roundabouts, jarring shifting mid corner that would quite noticeably unsettle the bike. Not being able to slip the clutch made tight, off camber mini-roundabouts very unpleasant as the bike feels like the idle is too high to prevent it stalling. Very poor.

I suspect the Honda application of DCT is probably now very good, but I was staggered BMW signed off on the ASA.

[hiccy18]

Mine was in for a service a few weeks ago and I asked them for something sporty as a courtesy bike so they gave me a twist'n'go... ok, it was an R1300RS, so at least it gave me a chance to try it.

My biggest concern (low speed maneouvering) turned out to be a non-issue, I was impressed at how easy it was to ride at low speed, even in heavy rush-hours traffic. Accuracy was not affected and I only reached for the non-existant clutch once.

The autoshifting was another story, and I found it interesting that the system defaulted to manual shifting anyway. Perhaps if it suits how you ride you'll feel differently but for me, being sat on the motorway at 50MPH in fifth gear was unnatural, I'm usually in third on my 1250. A car indicated to pull in so I dropped two gears in anticipation, started to roll on and it went back to fifth.

Eventually I settled in to using it in manual mode, where it made sense as an effective quickshifter unlike the normal boxer clunky 50/50 affair. At that, I could live with it. But I wouldn't buy it.

[flushedmonkey]

In manual mode the vfr will have me in 6th by the end of the driveway. Sport mode is a little better but lacks any kind of sense. The manual mode is a lot better but you have to almost signal to the bike what your intentions are before you change gear. So if you're accelerating it'll guess correctly that the next gear is likely going to be one up and if you're braking then it correctly guesses that the next gear will be one down. If you're just rolling in to a corner and want to change down then it'll have the right gear ready about half the time and it'll be smooth and the other half will be a bit clunky. What I've found is that if you 'signal' that you're slowing down going in to a corner by applying a little bit of brake then it gets the intent nearly all the time and then next gear ready will be the next gear down.

I'd be interested in trying the yamaha system out but I had heard that the bmw one was not great.

[nordboy]

I have a 2025 Honda X-ADV, the DCT is superb, it rarely gives me a wrong gear and learns my riding style so seems to have got better over time.

And mine has the manual function with gear up/ down buttons on the left switchgear if I want it.

So they've definitely got better.

[flushedmonkey]

Thanks, I'll have to give a later honda a go.

[Biker 1]

I read an article on this subject - I think it was Ride magazine. They tested the latest 1300 GS automatic - apparently very clunky at low speed & took a while to get used to.
Whilst I totally understand where the OP is coming from, I really don't see the point of auto for the vast majority of riders. For me, the whole point is to get the perfect gear change & control the clutch correctly. I also can't see the point in cruise control or playing music over Bluetooth. However, I have been really impressed by modern 6 axis IMU & ABS stuff. I'm a ham fisted amateur & traction control has saved my bacon too many times!

[Jazoli]

There's lots of stuff out there now, Yamaha do their version of autos as do Honda and they all get positive reviews.

[flushedmonkey]

Biker 1 said:

I read an article on this subject - I think it was Ride magazine. They tested the latest 1300 GS automatic - apparently very clunky at low speed & took a while to get used to.
Whilst I totally understand where the OP is coming from, I really don't see the point of auto for the vast majority of riders. For me, the whole point is to get the perfect gear change & control the clutch correctly. I also can't see the point in cruise control or playing music over Bluetooth. However, I have been really impressed by modern 6 axis IMU & ABS stuff. I'm a ham fisted amateur & traction control has saved my bacon too many times!

I completely agree with you on all points but unfortunately needs must. At least I can still keep riding

[s p a c e m a n]

I think it was a hornet that I rode that had a clutch less mode that I thought was awesome. Clutch lever and foot controls were there like normal but you could choose e clutch in the menu and then you didn't need to pull the clutch for anything if you didn't want to. Even the slow maneuvering around a carpark felt spot on.

https://www.honda.co.uk/motorcycles/experience-hon...

[Bob_Defly]

I was just chatting with someone yesterday who has the DCT Africa Twin, he loves it. Said that sport mode is very good.

[TimmyWimmyWoo]

BMW's ASA is the best of the bunch in my opinion - so long as you don't let it go into auto mode. Leave it in manual mode and it's just like having a very good quickshifter, and no clutch to pull in at the lights. In auto mode it's clunky and makes some odd decisions. I'd probably buy an ASA one if I were in the market (and never use auto mode!).

The Yamaha system is also good, but I'd rather change gear using a foot lever rather than handlebar buttons.

[andymach23]

I had a demo ride on the Tracer 7 AMT auto at the ABR festival. I thought it was excellent. I then had a demo ride on the X-ADV with the DCT. For me, It was a better system and i would defiinitely consider the NC 750X due to the lower cost. Veridian do cruise control for it as well.

[flushedmonkey]

TimmyWimmyWoo said:

BMW's ASA is the best of the bunch in my opinion - so long as you don't let it go into auto mode. Leave it in manual mode and it's just like having a very good quickshifter, and no clutch to pull in at the lights. In auto mode it's clunky and makes some odd decisions. I'd probably buy an ASA one if I were in the market (and never use auto mode!).

The Yamaha system is also good, but I'd rather change gear using a foot lever rather than handlebar buttons.

My 2012 vfr dct has the foot lever option installed. It feels like you're operating buttons instead of something mechanical though so it's very unsatisfying. I'm guessing that it might be possible to make it feel more like a real gear lever with springs and detents but as it is it what it is, I never use it.