How long should ignition components last?
Discussion
A couple of years ago I had replaced all of the ignition parts in the car, removed and cleaned the injectors and a year ago put a new dizzy (Distributor Doctor) and replaced the HT leads again with a Bosch set. The leads were replaced because of finding that no 7 plug on the spark was totally cooked even though it had been wrapped in heat sleeving and had a 'titanium' socks.
Fuel filter, I changed that 3 years ago but the fuel pump is old, although the wiring connections were recently upgraded by an auto electrician due to a faulty spade which left me stranded by the side of the road.
Recently, I'm getting what I would call 'hesitating' or slight misfire when accelerating hard from a slip road onto the motorway in 3rd or 4th above 4,000 rpm. It's the same on both maps 2 and 5 and am now about to start looking at the ignition system again, particularly the HT leads, again, or the Bosch coil I fitted.
What is a reasonable amount of time /mileage to expect out of these components due to the harsh amount of high heat in our engine bays?
Running standard leads without HT extenders has been challenging on those rear most spark plugs even though they have been tied away from the exhaust manifold. I wouldn't be surprised if another boot has been cooked again.
Fuel filter, I changed that 3 years ago but the fuel pump is old, although the wiring connections were recently upgraded by an auto electrician due to a faulty spade which left me stranded by the side of the road.
Recently, I'm getting what I would call 'hesitating' or slight misfire when accelerating hard from a slip road onto the motorway in 3rd or 4th above 4,000 rpm. It's the same on both maps 2 and 5 and am now about to start looking at the ignition system again, particularly the HT leads, again, or the Bosch coil I fitted.
What is a reasonable amount of time /mileage to expect out of these components due to the harsh amount of high heat in our engine bays?
Running standard leads without HT extenders has been challenging on those rear most spark plugs even though they have been tied away from the exhaust manifold. I wouldn't be surprised if another boot has been cooked again.
They won’t last long at all if they are in contact with the manifold.
The trick is to try and angle them away, this seller will make you a good quality set with angled boots or you can buy the stuff and make your own, it’s not difficult to do if you get a crimp tool.
Don’t rely on the provided link fitting your application, it’s just for an idea.
I had a set made and they seem good quality.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BLUE-8MM-PERFORMANCE-IG...
The trick is to try and angle them away, this seller will make you a good quality set with angled boots or you can buy the stuff and make your own, it’s not difficult to do if you get a crimp tool.
Don’t rely on the provided link fitting your application, it’s just for an idea.
I had a set made and they seem good quality.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BLUE-8MM-PERFORMANCE-IG...
Have you fitted these without any heat protection?
As I said, I have carefully cable tied the leads so that they are tight against the side of the rocker cover on each side so they are as far away as possible from the manifold.
I appreciate the straight boots probably stick out slightly more, even though they flex a little.
As I said, I have carefully cable tied the leads so that they are tight against the side of the rocker cover on each side so they are as far away as possible from the manifold.
I appreciate the straight boots probably stick out slightly more, even though they flex a little.
The symptom you describe does sound like either coil or ignition module breaking down under higher loads.
After the initial misfire does it then run upto limiter ok.
I use heat socks and they do bleach if anywhere near the manifolds but I’d rather have that than all the heat directly flowing over the plug caps and leads. It’s impossible to keep this heat away really so the socks just offer a buffer and for me they have worked really well.
Regardless of leads/ caps used tying them up so they can’t turn and rest on manifold is still the best advice if you ask me.
This is where having known good working spares can help for the diy mechanic.
Just try swapping one component at a time until you hopefully find the faulty part.
I did something like 20,000 miles in my car on old components and infact 10,000 miles the first year I owned it and never changed a single thing. All the usual culprits where there including plug extenders so maybe it’s just modern parts that are causing failures more readily
After the initial misfire does it then run upto limiter ok.
I use heat socks and they do bleach if anywhere near the manifolds but I’d rather have that than all the heat directly flowing over the plug caps and leads. It’s impossible to keep this heat away really so the socks just offer a buffer and for me they have worked really well.
Regardless of leads/ caps used tying them up so they can’t turn and rest on manifold is still the best advice if you ask me.
This is where having known good working spares can help for the diy mechanic.
Just try swapping one component at a time until you hopefully find the faulty part.
I did something like 20,000 miles in my car on old components and infact 10,000 miles the first year I owned it and never changed a single thing. All the usual culprits where there including plug extenders so maybe it’s just modern parts that are causing failures more readily
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Belle427 said:
I didn’t use any heat protection as it’s difficult to fit it over the angled boot.
They feel and look like higher quality silicone boots rather than rubber.
Hard to see from pictures but the angle works well.
I like them. They feel and look like higher quality silicone boots rather than rubber.
Hard to see from pictures but the angle works well.
Edited by Belle427 on Sunday 17th November 09:33
Mine are silicone too.
If they are good enough for Powers Performance MBE upgrade they must be good enough for my needs and so far i’m very happy with them.
Classic Chim said:
The symptom you describe does sound like either coil or ignition module breaking down under higher loads.
After the initial misfire does it then run upto limiter ok.
I use heat socks and they do bleach if anywhere near the manifolds but I’d rather have that than all the heat directly flowing over the plug caps and leads. It’s impossible to keep this heat away really so the socks just offer a buffer and for me they have worked really well.
It does continue to the redline, it just hesitates and splutters slightly, without lurching or backfiring through a certain part of the rev range. After the initial misfire does it then run upto limiter ok.
I use heat socks and they do bleach if anywhere near the manifolds but I’d rather have that than all the heat directly flowing over the plug caps and leads. It’s impossible to keep this heat away really so the socks just offer a buffer and for me they have worked really well.
The heat socks have bleached but has anyone running these angled boots found that running them without heat protection works long term?
Had all these issues went through heat socks burnt HT leads etc , met a guy at local car show and he showed me his leads in his Chim , pretty much the same as pics above which were angled plug leads from Craddock 4x4 for a RR V8 old one the magnecor lead I had one were £100 and had burnt on manifold at rear and heat socks etc etc so here’s what I did ,
Junked the extenders , put in BPR6ES spark plugs , fitted my new angled plug leads from Craddock which were £25 they look and feel quality fit great and don’t sit anywhere near the manifolds I’ve done 6K miles in them they have not moved show no heat issues and it runs better than the magnecors which were simply a pain in the ass touching the manifolds and trying the tie them up etc , my leads don’t need any faffing fit good and don’t touch manifolds and we’re cheap but....it runs great ran them all year even in the summer heat etc no shunting and it runs smooth !
Btw , had a chim (not the one I have now) which had covered 47k and I had a weird misfire and hesitation on the upper rev range but yes would hit limiter , changed everything coil , amp , cap , rotor, plugs etc etc turned out to be the Camshaft was worn !
Junked the extenders , put in BPR6ES spark plugs , fitted my new angled plug leads from Craddock which were £25 they look and feel quality fit great and don’t sit anywhere near the manifolds I’ve done 6K miles in them they have not moved show no heat issues and it runs better than the magnecors which were simply a pain in the ass touching the manifolds and trying the tie them up etc , my leads don’t need any faffing fit good and don’t touch manifolds and we’re cheap but....it runs great ran them all year even in the summer heat etc no shunting and it runs smooth !
Btw , had a chim (not the one I have now) which had covered 47k and I had a weird misfire and hesitation on the upper rev range but yes would hit limiter , changed everything coil , amp , cap , rotor, plugs etc etc turned out to be the Camshaft was worn !
TVRSJW said:
Had all these issues went through heat socks burnt HT leads etc , met a guy at local car show and he showed me his leads in his Chim , pretty much the same as pics above which were angled plug leads from Craddock 4x4 for a RR V8 old one the magnecor lead I had one were £100 and had burnt on manifold at rear and heat socks etc etc so here’s what I did ,
Junked the extenders , put in BPR6ES spark plugs , fitted my new angled plug leads from Craddock which were £25 they look and feel quality fit great and don’t sit anywhere near the manifolds I’ve done 6K miles in them they have not moved show no heat issues and it runs better than the magnecors which were simply a pain in the ass touching the manifolds and trying the tie them up etc , my leads don’t need any faffing fit good and don’t touch manifolds and we’re cheap but....it runs great ran them all year even in the summer heat etc no shunting and it runs smooth !
Btw , had a chim (not the one I have now) which had covered 47k and I had a weird misfire and hesitation on the upper rev range but yes would hit limiter , changed everything coil , amp , cap , rotor, plugs etc etc turned out to be the Camshaft was worn !
Camshaft was another thing that I thought of, although mine was changed at 90k miles and am at 118k so I would have thought there is some meat still left on it. Junked the extenders , put in BPR6ES spark plugs , fitted my new angled plug leads from Craddock which were £25 they look and feel quality fit great and don’t sit anywhere near the manifolds I’ve done 6K miles in them they have not moved show no heat issues and it runs better than the magnecors which were simply a pain in the ass touching the manifolds and trying the tie them up etc , my leads don’t need any faffing fit good and don’t touch manifolds and we’re cheap but....it runs great ran them all year even in the summer heat etc no shunting and it runs smooth !
Btw , had a chim (not the one I have now) which had covered 47k and I had a weird misfire and hesitation on the upper rev range but yes would hit limiter , changed everything coil , amp , cap , rotor, plugs etc etc turned out to be the Camshaft was worn !
Doubt it could be that then !! My current Chim is at 121k so nice to hear of another at similar mileage (mine had a cam at 100k too) so yes I’d be looking at other things but mine had odd misfires etc burnt HT leads etc , in the end did as above new plugs but the BPR6ES (better for road use) ditched Beru extenders which were arcking then angled leads and it was a different car instantly felt smooth and not had probs with leads etc since so no faffing with heat socks and towing leads up etc they just fit right and work ! Good luck !
Definitely ditch the extenders, this sort of thing is common and misfires are the result, I got rid of mine 8 years ago.
I did try expensive Magncor leads with disappointing results and poor customer service, the guarantee the owner offers is not worth the paper its written on
I switched to MSD Super Conductors which have plug ends you can individually bend to get the best angle, these are excellent HT leads but they are very expensive.
So I now use Mr Retro, he sells a good RV8 8mm set with the correct 45/135 degree spark plug boots for just £35.00.
However, as I run coil packs I buy his 8.5mm performance lead by the meter...
Ford coil pack ends....
And his perfectly angled 45/135 degree spark plug boots ...
Of course you can buy Mr Retro's pre-made sets which will be well made I'm sure, but even if you do still have the original distributor setup I'd encourage anyone to make up their own leads using his excellent quality parts, it's very rewarding to build your own lead sets and you can make up single replacement leads as required.
The secret to making up your own leads is quality crimps, and to do achieve this you need a set of proper HT lead crimping pliers which can be very expensive in the UK, but if you buy a set from Ali Express they will arrive from China in a week or so and you'll pay just £11.00 all in.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33024749566.html?s...
These proper HT lead crimping pliers have proved to be an invaluable addition to my tool kit, they work perfectly and for £11.00 delivered to my door were insanely good value for money.
For everything else Mr Retro Leads has it covered
https://mrretroleads.co.uk/
I did try expensive Magncor leads with disappointing results and poor customer service, the guarantee the owner offers is not worth the paper its written on
I switched to MSD Super Conductors which have plug ends you can individually bend to get the best angle, these are excellent HT leads but they are very expensive.
So I now use Mr Retro, he sells a good RV8 8mm set with the correct 45/135 degree spark plug boots for just £35.00.
However, as I run coil packs I buy his 8.5mm performance lead by the meter...
Ford coil pack ends....
And his perfectly angled 45/135 degree spark plug boots ...
Of course you can buy Mr Retro's pre-made sets which will be well made I'm sure, but even if you do still have the original distributor setup I'd encourage anyone to make up their own leads using his excellent quality parts, it's very rewarding to build your own lead sets and you can make up single replacement leads as required.
The secret to making up your own leads is quality crimps, and to do achieve this you need a set of proper HT lead crimping pliers which can be very expensive in the UK, but if you buy a set from Ali Express they will arrive from China in a week or so and you'll pay just £11.00 all in.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33024749566.html?s...
These proper HT lead crimping pliers have proved to be an invaluable addition to my tool kit, they work perfectly and for £11.00 delivered to my door were insanely good value for money.
For everything else Mr Retro Leads has it covered
https://mrretroleads.co.uk/
I did find it odd that after all these years of the RV8 and TVR that there’s so many issues around plug leads burning and the use of heat socks ? And the need to spending upwards of £30-£40 on these leads that still have the same issues even ceramic ones that cost ££££ and are difficult to remove when changing plugs on service and can crack , when a simple set of angled plug ends solve the issues
Not sure if Dave uses socks still ? But my angled plug leads costing £25 have been on all year without socks and have been fine and I’ve covered over 5K so for me theres simply no need for heat socks as they don’t sit near or on the manifolds like straight ones do and the ones Dave has linked look spot on
Not sure if Dave uses socks still ? But my angled plug leads costing £25 have been on all year without socks and have been fine and I’ve covered over 5K so for me theres simply no need for heat socks as they don’t sit near or on the manifolds like straight ones do and the ones Dave has linked look spot on
jazzdude said:
Do you still cover these Mr Retro leads with the heat insulator tubing and socks as you did with the MSDs, Dave?
Yes, I still use socks, DEI Titanium Protect-A-Boots to be precise, these are way better than the cheap fibreglass socks I had before.
I still use them more because I had them already, TBH they're not essential now I'm using Mr Retro's 45/135 degree spark plug boots.
The DEI Titanium Protect-A-Boots are just a belt & braces last line of defence.
I also use Mr Retro's 8.5mm V8 HT lead separator set which ensures the leads are neatly and safely routed away from the alternator, engine sensors & injectors (EMI)....... and obviously the hot exhausts manifolds.
Well worth £11.00
The lead spacers, I already use, great for tidying things up and stopping any cables from touching another.
One thing I found with the standard Bosch leads, even though they are for a distributor, there is a lot of slack in the leads and thus a lot of wire bulging out around the distributor.
What are the lengths like on the 'custom made' Retro leads like for those with distributors? I too would be tempted to make my own but I feel that knowing my luck, it just adds another layer of something not being 100% right.
Would it be reasonable to assume that my 3-year-old Bosch coil with about 7,000 miles on it is also due for a replacement? Driving the car this morning, the slight hesitancy at between 4-5k rpm is definitely there, even to the point where I would say it feels like a misfire.
One thing I found with the standard Bosch leads, even though they are for a distributor, there is a lot of slack in the leads and thus a lot of wire bulging out around the distributor.
What are the lengths like on the 'custom made' Retro leads like for those with distributors? I too would be tempted to make my own but I feel that knowing my luck, it just adds another layer of something not being 100% right.
Would it be reasonable to assume that my 3-year-old Bosch coil with about 7,000 miles on it is also due for a replacement? Driving the car this morning, the slight hesitancy at between 4-5k rpm is definitely there, even to the point where I would say it feels like a misfire.
Heat being the main enemy and living in a very very warm country there’s always a possibility of either coil or ign amp being prematurely effected.
Does this happen before engine is warmed up. These coil failures are usually shown up when it gets very warm. Try a cold morning or late at night and try it before anything gets too hot. If it works fine a good chance one of these components are duff, it could be a dodgy plug lead or anything though.
If it’s severe I’d pull plugs out to see if any one plug is off coloured or looks like it’s running lean etc.
Does this happen before engine is warmed up. These coil failures are usually shown up when it gets very warm. Try a cold morning or late at night and try it before anything gets too hot. If it works fine a good chance one of these components are duff, it could be a dodgy plug lead or anything though.
If it’s severe I’d pull plugs out to see if any one plug is off coloured or looks like it’s running lean etc.
I'm keen to move to these angled leads as it is, and for not much outlay, I will swap them over.
As the current leads have heat insulation (what looks like a sushi roll with white fibreglass matting internally) and 'titanium' heat socks, I would be surprised it I will see anything in the dark through that lot unless of course, it is happening at the distributor end.
The ignition amp is only a few months old, although I have a couple of old spares. For the coil though, I will just get another one on there for peace of mind.
As the current leads have heat insulation (what looks like a sushi roll with white fibreglass matting internally) and 'titanium' heat socks, I would be surprised it I will see anything in the dark through that lot unless of course, it is happening at the distributor end.
The ignition amp is only a few months old, although I have a couple of old spares. For the coil though, I will just get another one on there for peace of mind.
jazzdude said:
One thing I found with the standard Bosch leads, even though they are for a distributor, there is a lot of slack in the leads and thus a lot of wire bulging out around the distributor. I too would be tempted to make my own but I feel that knowing my luck, it just adds another layer of something not being 100% right.
Honestly mate, buy a set of proper HT lead crimping pliers for £11.00 off Ali Express and start making up your own custom length leads using the quality components I've presented above from Mr Retro Leads.You will never look back
ChimpOnGas said:
Honestly mate, buy a set of proper HT lead crimping pliers for £11.00 of Ali Express and start making up your own custom length leads using the quality components I've presented above from Mr Retro Leads.
You will never look back
I must admit, I am tempted to try it, especially if it comes in blue. You will never look back
How many metres of lead are needed?
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