Front Chassis/Body Mounting Bolt - Access Through The Grill?
Discussion
Hi all,
Has anyone managed to tighten their front chassis to body mounting bolt by going in through the grill appeture?
My Chimaera has the Mk2 grill with a fixed central horizontal spar that doesn't exactly help access!
To me it looks like the rad has to come out, but I'd be very happy to be corrected on this point
For the record the security of this bolt is absolutely critical to ensuring a number of electrical items are properly grounded, if this bolt is loose it does seem it'll generate all sorts of grounding issues
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Thanks in advance chaps
Has anyone managed to tighten their front chassis to body mounting bolt by going in through the grill appeture?
My Chimaera has the Mk2 grill with a fixed central horizontal spar that doesn't exactly help access!
To me it looks like the rad has to come out, but I'd be very happy to be corrected on this point
For the record the security of this bolt is absolutely critical to ensuring a number of electrical items are properly grounded, if this bolt is loose it does seem it'll generate all sorts of grounding issues
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Thanks in advance chaps
I have managed to remove and tighten that bolt without removing the rad. Its very fiddly and time consuming.I seem to remember using a 1/2" socket on the bolt, a flexible joint and then the ratchet on an extension. Seem to remember grazed knuckles and blue air. I added a fog light and used that bolt as the ground. Mine is 1998 chim.
Good luck.
Good luck.
Pink_Floyd said:
I have managed to remove and tighten that bolt without removing the rad. Its very fiddly and time consuming.I seem to remember using a 1/2" socket on the bolt, a flexible joint and then the ratchet on an extension. Seem to remember grazed knuckles and blue air. I added a fog light and used that bolt as the ground. Mine is 1998 chim.
Good luck.
Many thanks Chris, at least I know it's possible now.Good luck.
I've found the following image online that seems to show a cut out area moulded into the fiberglass panel under the rad, is this the path in you used with your extensions going through the grill aperture?
This photo appears to have been taken from above with the rad out, the grill aperture is on the left as you can clearly see the screen wash bottle there.
Yes. Looking at it I think with fans in place hell on Earth. I’d rather drain coolant and pull rad, it will be quicker in the longer run and you can clean up your Earth point better with access.
I remember Sheels Canams install having similar earth issues and as Steve says it was traced to trans tunnel chassis bolt. I’d start there Dave.
I remember Sheels Canams install having similar earth issues and as Steve says it was traced to trans tunnel chassis bolt. I’d start there Dave.
just to add, the connections at the front are to the bolt then the fibreglass which is then pinched back to chassis rail, so at no point do they connect direct to the chassis rail if my memory serves me! So indeed they Earth through the bolt. It’s a good job as my connections were sooo rusty but I still had a good through the bolt to chassis. The fibre of body is between bolt and chassis.
Edited by Classic Chim on Sunday 23 August 12:54
Classic Chim said:
Errr just to add, the connections are to the bolt then the fibreglass which is then pinched back to chassis rail, so at no point do they connect direct to the chassis rail if my memory serves me!
Correct, the earth rings rely on the bolt thread for the connection, as you say there is fibreglass against the chassis rail. When I removed the bolt I put a star washer between the bolt head and the first ring so that it bit in and made a good connection to the bolt. ChimpOnGas said:
I've found the following image online that seems to show a cut out area moulded into the fiberglass panel under the rad, is this the path in you used with your extensions going through the grill aperture?
No I did not use that cutout. I went between the rad fans and the chassis, So socket on bolt, swivel through 90deg to 12" extension coming straight up. That allowed me to slacken it and fully tighten it. But having slackend it I had to use fingers to undo and remove and put back in, due to the length of the bolt undoing it very far caused the socket and swivel to jam against the rad. So if your socket / swivel combination is to long you might not get it on at all. Classic Chim said:
Yes. Looking at it I think with fans in place hell on Earth. I’d rather drain coolant and pull rad, it will be quicker in the longer run and you can clean up your Earth point better with access.
I remember Sheels Canams install having similar earth issues and as Steve says it was traced to trans tunnel chassis bolt. I’d start there Dave.
Super valid and logical points well made, good advice Alun.I remember Sheels Canams install having similar earth issues and as Steve says it was traced to trans tunnel chassis bolt. I’d start there Dave.
Thanks mate
Pink_Floyd said:
Classic Chim said:
Errr just to add, the connections are to the bolt then the fibreglass which is then pinched back to chassis rail, so at no point do they connect direct to the chassis rail if my memory serves me!
Correct, the earth rings rely on the bolt thread for the connection, as you say there is fibreglass against the chassis rail. When I removed the bolt I put a star washer between the bolt head and the first ring so that it bit in and made a good connection to the bolt. Best I get off the laptop and go fix the begger now
I'll report back when it's sorted
Pink_Floyd said:
.......... as you say there is fibreglass against the chassis rail. ........
Not so. There is a brass bobbin moulded into the GF so the bolt clamps the earth terminals against against the brass.having said that you are still primarily depending on the underside of the bolt head and the bolt threads as your earth path.
Done properly it works fine. I suspect COGs problems are going to be that the bolts are not tight.
Steve
Dave/CoG,
Guess this is a continuation of the "earthing problems" post?
I'd confirm that the experience I had with a pal returning from the NEC show 6/7 years ago when he experienced everything you described previously - plus headlights getting progressively dimmer. This was following a wing repair at a well known TVR dealers in N Hampshire. Not what you want on the A34 on a November evening!
Think we pulled into a services, found a bit of dry tarmac and discovered the 17mm chassis earth bolt only finger tight. Steve got a spanner on the bolt and nipped it up. Normal service resumed!!
Steve was able to remove the bolt without removing radiator at home. He then wire brushed earth tags and re-assembled.
Nick
Guess this is a continuation of the "earthing problems" post?
I'd confirm that the experience I had with a pal returning from the NEC show 6/7 years ago when he experienced everything you described previously - plus headlights getting progressively dimmer. This was following a wing repair at a well known TVR dealers in N Hampshire. Not what you want on the A34 on a November evening!
Think we pulled into a services, found a bit of dry tarmac and discovered the 17mm chassis earth bolt only finger tight. Steve got a spanner on the bolt and nipped it up. Normal service resumed!!
Steve was able to remove the bolt without removing radiator at home. He then wire brushed earth tags and re-assembled.
Nick
Steve_D said:
Not so. There is a brass bobbin moulded into the GF so the bolt clamps the earth terminals against against the brass.
having said that you are still primarily depending on the underside of the bolt head and the bolt threads as your earth path.
having said that you are still primarily depending on the underside of the bolt head and the bolt threads as your earth path.
Belle427 said:
I can’t get my head around bolting the cable lugs against the fibreglass, just not a good way to ground especially with multiple lugs.
Not the best system, I can see the brass bobbin in the fibreglass, if I measure the resistance from the bobbin to chassis I get infinite resistance. As I cant see the back of the bobbin I assumed that there is a layer of gel coat over the surface I can't see, but maybe it is the powder coating on the chassis that is providing the insulation.As others have said it would have been better for TVR to run all earths back to the battery, but having said that, they only used cable size that was nearly large enough for the current carried.
nawarne said:
Dave/CoG, Guess this is a continuation of the "earthing problems" post?
Exactly Nick 
nawarne said:
I'd confirm that the experience I had with a pal returning from the NEC show 6/7 years ago when he experienced everything you described previously - plus headlights getting progressively dimmer. This was following a wing repair at a well known TVR dealers in N Hampshire. Not what you want on the A34 on a November evening.Think we pulled into a services, found a bit of dry tarmac and discovered the 17mm chassis earth bolt only finger tight. Steve got a spanner on the bolt and nipped it up. Normal service resumed!! Steve was able to remove the bolt without removing radiator at home. He then wire brushed earth tags and re-assembled. Nick
Thanks Nick, there now seems to be many cases of that O/S front chassis ground bolt causing the exact same issues I'm suffering, your tale just adds to all the supporting evidence that suggests I was right all along to suspect a loose chassis grounding bolt under the O/S corner of the rad.You're also now the second person who's confirmed its posable to tighten that bolt without removing the rad, unfortunately I have the additional access challenge of my LPG vaporiser that sits above it but I'm hopeful if I remove the expansion tank I can gain access that way, if not I have a friend coming over on Saturday and we'll whip the rad out them as these things are always way easier with two on the job.
Oh well, it looks like another Saturday down the pan correcting things that should never had occurred, yet again I'm picking up the pieces from a lack of attention to detail from the restorer. There really are no excuses for one of the key body to chassis bolts being left loose following a body off restoration, the thing is this is far from the only loose bolt, from day one after the car was delivered misfiring and heavily leaking oil it became quite clear the security and assembly of everything needed carefully checking.
My list of assembly faults now exceeds over 30 points, everything from an incorrectly routed and so over stressed starter cable that caused a no start on day two....
To an oil pressure switch that was fitted on top of the old O ring causing a catastrophic oil leak that drained my entire sump in a 20 minute drive very nearly destroyed my engine.
Very early on this was drummed into me.... "If a new fitting comes with an O ring and you haven't found the old one, best you go looking for it, because the chances are its still down the hole!"
Of course as we all know one O ring on top of another does not create a seal, no wonder the bed of the beaver tail that delivered my sickly TVR was covered in oil, it had only been sat on the bed overnight so my car must have left a huge puddle of oil in the restorers workshop when he moved it to load it up, how can you let a car out the door with a shocking oil leak like that is beyond me
The above is nothing really compared to when the double O ring gaff finally gave way in catastrophic fashion as I was driving and oblivious to the terminal oil leak it had produced, 5 litres of oil was thrown down the road in just 20 minutes so I was super lucky to be close to home when the last litre left the sump, if i was bowling along at 70mph or for sure this restorer's double O ring school boy error would have destroyed my engine!
I could go on with the long list of assembly faults I've paid to correct with my own time and money, but its getting me nowhere as I have not been supported by the restorer despite all the clear photographic evidence of his mistakes. Instead he dropped me like a stone and left me holding the baby while at the same time suggesting he may instruct a solicitor, that was the last straw really!
What was he going to sue me for?...... Paying him in full for delivering a half finished car full of countless assembly mistakes
No wonder he didn't deliver it himself in the end as agreed and happily arranged for that beaver tail to get rid of his problem on the paying customer, that was a very cowardly way to run away from his responsibilities if you ask me
ChimpOnGas said:
Thanks Nick, there now seems to be many cases of that O/S front chassis ground bolt causing the exact same issues I'm suffering, your tale just adds to all the supporting evidence that suggests I was right all along to suspect a loose chassis grounding bolt under the O/S corner of the rad.
You're also now the second person who's confirmed its posable to tighten that bolt without removing the rad, unfortunately I have the additional access challenge of my LPG vaporiser that sits above it but I'm hopeful if I remove the expansion tank I can gain access that way, if not I have a friend coming over on Saturday and we'll whip the rad out them as these things are always way easier with two on the job.
Oh well, it looks like another Saturday down the pan correcting things that should never had occurred, yet again I'm picking up the pieces from a lack of attention to detail from the restorer. There really are no excuses for one of the key body to chassis bolts being left loose following a body off restoration, the thing is this is far from the only loose bolt, from day one after the car was delivered misfiring and heavily leaking oil it became quite clear the security and assembly of everything needed carefully checking.
My list of assembly faults now exceeds over 30 points, everything from an incorrectly routed and so over stressed starter cable that caused a no start on day two....
To an oil pressure switch that was fitted on top of the old O ring causing a catastrophic oil leak that drained my entire sump in a 20 minute drive very nearly destroyed my engine.
Very early on this was drummed into me.... "If a new fitting comes with an O ring and you haven't found the old one, best you go looking for it, because the chances are its still down the hole!"
Of course as we all know one O ring on top of another does not create a seal, no wonder the bed of the beaver tail that delivered my sickly TVR was covered in oil, it had only been sat on the bed overnight so my car must have left a huge puddle of oil in the restorers workshop when he moved it to load it up, how can you let a car out the door with a shocking oil leak like that is beyond me
The above is nothing really compared to when the double O ring gaff finally gave way in catastrophic fashion as I was driving and oblivious to the terminal oil leak it had produced, 5 litres of oil was thrown down the road in just 20 minutes so I was super lucky to be close to home when the last litre left the sump, if i was bowling along at 70mph or for sure this restorer's double O ring school boy error would have destroyed my engine!
I could go on with the long list of assembly faults I've paid to correct with my own time and money, but its getting me nowhere as I have not been supported by the restorer despite all the clear photographic evidence of his mistakes. Instead he dropped me like a stone and left me holding the baby while at the same time suggesting he may instruct a solicitor, that was the last straw really!
What was he going to sue me for?...... Paying him in full for delivering a half finished car full of countless assembly mistakes
No wonder he didn't deliver it himself in the end as agreed and happily arranged for that beaver tail to get rid of his problem on the paying customer, that was a very cowardly way to run away from his responsibilities if you ask me
Dave. I have refrained from correcting you on your version of the truth as portrayed on social media as it never reflects well on either party. You're also now the second person who's confirmed its posable to tighten that bolt without removing the rad, unfortunately I have the additional access challenge of my LPG vaporiser that sits above it but I'm hopeful if I remove the expansion tank I can gain access that way, if not I have a friend coming over on Saturday and we'll whip the rad out them as these things are always way easier with two on the job.
Oh well, it looks like another Saturday down the pan correcting things that should never had occurred, yet again I'm picking up the pieces from a lack of attention to detail from the restorer. There really are no excuses for one of the key body to chassis bolts being left loose following a body off restoration, the thing is this is far from the only loose bolt, from day one after the car was delivered misfiring and heavily leaking oil it became quite clear the security and assembly of everything needed carefully checking.
My list of assembly faults now exceeds over 30 points, everything from an incorrectly routed and so over stressed starter cable that caused a no start on day two....
To an oil pressure switch that was fitted on top of the old O ring causing a catastrophic oil leak that drained my entire sump in a 20 minute drive very nearly destroyed my engine.
Very early on this was drummed into me.... "If a new fitting comes with an O ring and you haven't found the old one, best you go looking for it, because the chances are its still down the hole!"
Of course as we all know one O ring on top of another does not create a seal, no wonder the bed of the beaver tail that delivered my sickly TVR was covered in oil, it had only been sat on the bed overnight so my car must have left a huge puddle of oil in the restorers workshop when he moved it to load it up, how can you let a car out the door with a shocking oil leak like that is beyond me
The above is nothing really compared to when the double O ring gaff finally gave way in catastrophic fashion as I was driving and oblivious to the terminal oil leak it had produced, 5 litres of oil was thrown down the road in just 20 minutes so I was super lucky to be close to home when the last litre left the sump, if i was bowling along at 70mph or for sure this restorer's double O ring school boy error would have destroyed my engine!
I could go on with the long list of assembly faults I've paid to correct with my own time and money, but its getting me nowhere as I have not been supported by the restorer despite all the clear photographic evidence of his mistakes. Instead he dropped me like a stone and left me holding the baby while at the same time suggesting he may instruct a solicitor, that was the last straw really!
What was he going to sue me for?...... Paying him in full for delivering a half finished car full of countless assembly mistakes
No wonder he didn't deliver it himself in the end as agreed and happily arranged for that beaver tail to get rid of his problem on the paying customer, that was a very cowardly way to run away from his responsibilities if you ask me
I also have documentary evidence that some of the claims you have made since are also untrue.
However, this is getting quite ridiculous now. I suggest if you are going to post untrue claims of my workmanship and behaviour and social media, you share our entire email communications regarding this.
If you (understandably) do not agree with this suggestion, I'll cover the essential points:
-it was only a month before arrival that you indicated the car was heavily modified. Even then you downplayed it. We had already spoken at length on the phone on occasions prior.
-The car was happily driven to me with the most dangerous bodge I've ever witnessed on a car.
-There was running issues upon delivery. (The car did not run as perfectly as you love expressing on ph)
-There where a couple of issues, which you agreed to take the car back with, some present prior.
-the car was transported to you because you kept bleating about being able to visit your 84 year old mother in Norfolk (this was at the height of lockdown hysteria)
-The entire Easter weekend you called and WhatsAppd constantly. Not only finding issues (in your opinion), but causing issues by tearing through the car hamfistedly.
-At first I was mortified, how could a car go back like that. How can I put it right etc...
Then I went through your list and realised your story kept changing. Many items where your engineering judgement and untrue, yet my fault.
Despite all this, you insisted on rectifying this yourself, at the same time teeing me up for open wallet surgery using mates and specialists of your choice cart? blanche. It was like some sort of manipulative intellectual one upmanship/torture. A theme throughout.
After realising that, through our communication- every specialist you seem to have dealt with was awful and you wont deal with them again - I spoke to these specialists and it seems this was a distinct pattern of behaviour. It's a small world, the tvr one. The truth was none of them ever wanted to deal with you again.
I consulted a solicitor to ask the best course of action, if there was genuine issues with the car - they needed rectifying. But your behaviour had made it extremely difficult to determine the genuine from the non genuine.
Upon their suggestion, I suggested an independent inspection. You rejected this. After more communication you rejected an inspection the second time.
You also said that you no longer wanted to communicate regarding this.
Despite this, you couldn't resist your insatiable need for social media points and started posting untruths about me and my work (in all but name, but enough know where the work was done).
To make things worse, you even contact my current customers, whilst the work was being carried out. Can you imagine if I did that with yours?
At no point did I threaten legal action. I merely said I'd consulted a solicitor and you bau?ked. However, If you continue to make up things about suppliers then I wouldn't be surprised if one day one of them did take action. Its people's livelihoods and it's not fair.
I was ready to fully refund you for all the works that Easter weekend - So profoundly unpleasant it was dealing with you. But you messed that one up - I knew there would come a time (now) when you would stick the knife in anyway. So what would be the point?
Anyone reading this may wonder 'why is alex engaging in this'?! - you're right, it's never a good idea to air your dirty laundry on social media. However bookings have notably been affected by your story telling. So unpleasant was my experience with you and your tvr that I no longer want to operate in the tvr community for the foreseeable future if you're going to pop up every time you feel a bit insecure or your car has an issue for the next few years and blame me.
You could have had the car inspected. You could have had any issues rectified, I would have happily paid. Mistakes do happen, although not often.
To anyone reading this, it's the tip of the iceberg.
You missed your chance.
Stop lying to pistonheads.
No doubt you'll post a manipulative and sarcastic reply. I will not be engaging any further.
Edited by crosseyedlion on Monday 24th August 12:53
Edited by crosseyedlion on Monday 24th August 14:21
For what it's worth (as I quietly follow the progress of most TVR resto threads, especially if they're being conducted by other traders, to make sure we're (Southways) not being left behind), this is a sorry scene and I can imagine the kind of stress this is causing the repairer.
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this. However, I have done this job MANY times, on all manner of TVRs in all manner of conditions, and like all outfits, we've had one or two jobs where mistakes were made (hence why I've given up employing other people!) We didn't get an opportunity to rectify those ourselves, which upset me at the time, and still irks now.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this. However, I have done this job MANY times, on all manner of TVRs in all manner of conditions, and like all outfits, we've had one or two jobs where mistakes were made (hence why I've given up employing other people!) We didn't get an opportunity to rectify those ourselves, which upset me at the time, and still irks now.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
Kitchski said:
For what it's worth (as I quietly follow the progress of most TVR resto threads, especially if they're being conducted by other traders, to make sure we're (Southways) not being left behind), this is a sorry scene and I can imagine the kind of stress this is causing the repairer.
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this. However, I have done this job MANY times, on all manner of TVRs in all manner of conditions, and like all outfits, we've had one or two jobs where mistakes were made (hence why I've given up employing other people!) We didn't get an opportunity to rectify those ourselves, which upset me at the time, and still irks now.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this. However, I have done this job MANY times, on all manner of TVRs in all manner of conditions, and like all outfits, we've had one or two jobs where mistakes were made (hence why I've given up employing other people!) We didn't get an opportunity to rectify those ourselves, which upset me at the time, and still irks now.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
Kitchski said:
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
+1Surely this must be some sort of blatant attempt to get on to the Queen's Honours list
Sorry to read this thread and sorry that an honest decent specialist has had to revert to social media to defend his reputation.
- * has a reputation and a track record. Sorry Alex that it stung you so hard. - you are a skilled engineer. You are honest, fair, decent etc - dare I say it, you are a nice bloke. Don’t let them drag you down.
Ribol said:
Kitchski said:
Because I'm actually a TVR enthusiast (and long time owner) first, and businessman (lol) second, I'm happy to inspect this car in an evening or on a Saturday (assuming I find one that my kids don't have a football match on...there aren't many).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
No charge, I'd just like to help everybody find a bit of closure with the subject. I'll be brutally honest either way (standard of work/condition either by repairer, or as a non-standard setup) as I have no professional or monetary link to this.
Offer's there. We're in Hampshire (south).
+1Surely this must be some sort of blatant attempt to get on to the Queen's Honours list
Conversely, if I got under it and it was clear that it was just 'one of those cars' (and believe me, they exist) then again, I would say. We're all human, but I know the kind of stresses and anxieties going through this kind of thing can put you through. Luckily I've not really been on the end of anything as bad, though we have had a couple of less satisfactory encounters, as all businesses have.
Just completely off-topic, I saw the worst case we've had absolutely thrapping the arse off his Chim in a 40mph littered with junctions zone this morning. He's old enough to know better.
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