Starter Motor issue (not solenoid)

[izthewiz]

Dear PH,

I have a grumpy starter motor, ie: it doesn't always crank. Sometimes it does on the first try, sometimes it decides to make me wait a few, or ten, twenty attempts.

Frustrating, and a little embarrassing sitting there clicking away if there are witnesses....

I did search, but haven't come across these specific symptoms:

The solenoid always clicks solidly.
The fuel pump always primes.
BUT.....sometimes it cranks, sometimes it doesn't.
When it does crank, it does so at full speed, so not a weak battery...? (It behaves the same with a freshly charged battery)
When it cranks, there's never an issue starting, it fires and runs perfectly straight away.
There doesn't seem to be any consistency at all, and removing the key, or switching back to the zero key position then trying again, clutch up or down (or any combination/variation of the above) makes no repeatable difference.

I'm pretty sure it's not an immobiliser issue (various Meta upgrades, including remote boot release), but happy to be proven wrong.

In my tiny, sawdust-filled mind, it seems like the solenoid doesn't always complete the contacts across the heavy current cranking circuit for some reason.
If that's the case, what would be the cause and corrective action? If not, all suggestions gratefully received.

I await the bestowal of the collective PH wisdom.

Iz.

[Sardonicus]

It may be the starter solenoid like you suggested when the solenoid/shunt gets energised the contacts for the motor are closed these can burn/erode away over time causing the very issue you have , I have personally had my own starter fail in this very way you describe years back didnt have any luck just locating a sensible brand solenoid (I like to repair stuff) so grabbed a clean S/H Bosch P38 range rover starter (same pt no) off Ebay for £25 and been going strong for the last 10 years

[izthewiz]

Thanks Sardonicus.

I'll have an eBay peruse and report back.

Iz.

[magpie215]

I'd suggest if you can hear the solenoid click its not an immobiliser fault.

Had similar on a Nippon Denso starter.

High voltage contacts in the solenoid had failed ...replacement of the contacts fixed the fault.

[Zeb74]

Try to hit the starter motor (gently) with a hard wood piece or a hammer (very gently) when it happens, it should make it works until the next failure. If it's the case, you can try to service it or just replace it.

[Sardonicus]

magpie215 said:

I'd suggest if you can hear the solenoid click its not an immobiliser fault.

Had similar on a Nippon Denso starter.

High voltage contacts in the solenoid had failed ...replacement of the contacts fixed the fault.

Now your talking decent quality starters takes me back to my Honda tech days doing just that sadly you cant change those contacts on a RV8 Bosch starter they are integral with the solenoid

[jj.]

Are you sure it's not the battery...?

I've had similar, this weekend in fact I replaced my starter (bloody hot under the car on Saturday.!), as it was clicking again and intermittently not starting, as you have described. Thought it was starter, but I replaced this one only 2 years ago, so surprised it had gone so quick.

After replacement started 5/6 times, perfect! all back to normal. Went for a 1 hour drive, stopped for fuel. Nothing, just clicking again.. Oh No...!!! Had to get bump started to get home. Tried it about 8 times in the garage once home nothing, just clicking.

Battery reading 12.54v. Cranking or trying to start the battery read 9.7v - (www) seems to suggest the cranking volts to be more than 9.6v - so my battery was border line the minimum.

As the battery was over 5 years old (always sat on a ctek trickle when not used), I decided to replace with new, Halfords guy tested old one and said it was showing 90% health, but new battery has now solved my issue. Been fine over the past few days...

Stick a meter on the battery when the starter is clicking, if you're getting under 10v I'd suggest a new battery first (especially if like my car it seems to want a battery every 5/6 years).
jj

[jj.]

Oh, I also should just add, these cars do require a lot of power to start. Once about 6 years ago before the last battery change, car had been stored elsewhere for the winter, and battery had gone flat.

I borrowed a friends Noco Boost pack (GB50) - meant to start a 7 L Petrol engine with no issue's.

With a full charge in boost pack and connected to the car, it was still clicking (as we have both experienced). Only when I but the pack into Boost mode, did it start the car.
jj