S Type R Model Year Differences.

[Benbay001]

I think im going to be looking to buy an S Type R at the end of next month.
There seems to be lots of '02 cars around but i remember reading somewhere that the 04+ ones are better and to hold out until you can afford one. Is it purely cosmetic changes? (which seems to be all i can find for the 04 refresh)
Thanks!

[fatboy b]

Laters ones had the 4.2 over the 4.0 in the early ones.

[Benbay001]

fatboy b said:

Laters ones had the 4.2 over the 4.0 in the early ones.

Seems as though only the XJRs had 4.0s, the S Type was 4.2 or 4.2.
Thanks though

[fatboy b]

4.2 came out with the X350 XJ in 2002. It also went in the XK & S, both of which had the 4.0 prior, as did the X308 XJ.

[Benbay001]

Were there any mechanical changes to the STR? Ones that would effect reliability, rather than performance?

[The Leaper]

I don't think there was ever a 4.0 STR, they were all 4.2s. Later versions had a revised supercharger pulley that gives a further 20bhp...not particularly important in my view when you've got 400bhp anyway.

The early STRs were the nicer looking whereas the later ones are outwardly less sporty in their appearance in my opinion. As the changes were cosmetic I doubt if there is any mechanical worries or significant differences between the two models.

I've had a S Type 4.2 V8 (non R)for tha past 8 1/2 years, done 113,000 miles and its going very well. Have you looked at the non R at all? Still has a very useful 300bhp and is a great car.

R.

[Benbay001]

The Leaper said:

I don't think there was ever a 4.0 STR, they were all 4.2s. Later versions had a revised supercharger pulley that gives a further 20bhp...not particularly important in my view when you've got 400bhp anyway.

The early STRs were the nicer looking whereas the later ones are outwardly less sporty in their appearance in my opinion. As the changes were cosmetic I doubt if there is any mechanical worries or significant differences between the two models.

I've had a S Type 4.2 V8 (non R)for tha past 8 1/2 years, done 113,000 miles and its going very well. Have you looked at the non R at all? Still has a very useful 300bhp and is a great car.

R.

I have looked at them, but would much rather the R as i can afford it, and to run it. The other car i was umming and aring over was a VX220, so i think the R will be required for the "special" factor.
Have you had any issues with your car? Are there many bad cars or are most well looked after?
Thanks

[The Leaper]

The car has been pretty good except I've had bad luck with the gearbox. It developed a whoosh noise on acceleration after about 20,000 miles. This was diagnosed as weakened aluminium seals enabling oil to move around in wrong places, so the box was replaced. The same happened at 40,000 so Jaguar UK called in the gearbox because it was the first time they had they had heared of a gearbox having problems after the aluminium seals upgrade had been done. I got another new box. I then had a similar issue at 60,000 miles and the box was stripped and all seals replaced by the JMD I use. There's been no problems at all during the 50,000 miles or so since then. All this work was done by Jaguar under warranty.

Aside from that the car has been reliable. I've had no real issues with brakes, suspension etc, although the car is heavy on both. I have had an issue with the heater actuators which is a common S-Type problem but that was fixed and hasn't re-occured.

I'm having an interesting experience with tyres. I have Pirelli P6000s. They have always given up at around 22,000 miles but for some reason the current fronts have done 40,000 and are still good for about 5,000 miles so I've been told...I've no idea whay this is so!

I have not changed the diff oil at all, although it is generally recommended to be done at 50,000 miles or so. It's something I've been thinking about recently. Neither have I changed the timing chain tensioners but it does have the latest metal version anyway.

I have two mates who have or have had 4.2s and done considerable mileage. They had no gearbox problems but both have had suspension wear issues, a frequent S-Type matter.

I could e-mail you a complete copy of my service/tyre records if you wish.

Just ask if you need more info.

R.

[Benbay001]

The Leaper said:

The car has been pretty good except I've had bad luck with the gearbox. It developed a whoosh noise on acceleration after about 20,000 miles. This was diagnosed as weakened aluminium seals enabling oil to move around in wrong places, so the box was replaced. The same happened at 40,000 so Jaguar UK called in the gearbox because it was the first time they had they had heared of a gearbox having problems after the aluminium seals upgrade had been done. I got another new box. I then had a similar issue at 60,000 miles and the box was stripped and all seals replaced by the JMD I use. There's been no problems at all during the 50,000 miles or so since then. All this work was done by Jaguar under warranty.

Aside from that the car has been reliable. I've had no real issues with brakes, suspension etc, although the car is heavy on both. I have had an issue with the heater actuators which is a common S-Type problem but that was fixed and hasn't re-occured.

I'm having an interesting experience with tyres. I have Pirelli P6000s. They have always given up at around 22,000 miles but for some reason the current fronts have done 40,000 and are still good for about 5,000 miles so I've been told...I've no idea whay this is so!

I have not changed the diff oil at all, although it is generally recommended to be done at 50,000 miles or so. It's something I've been thinking about recently. Neither have I changed the timing chain tensioners but it does have the latest metal version anyway.

I have two mates who have or have had 4.2s and done considerable mileage. They had no gearbox problems but both have had suspension wear issues, a frequent S-Type matter.

I could e-mail you a complete copy of my service/tyre records if you wish.

Just ask if you need more info.

R.

Thank you very much! Out of interest, very roughly how much did the gearbox issues cost you to sort? (or how much did they cost Jag?) and the same question about your mate's suspension issues, how much did that cost?
I usually leave about £1000 in my account to cover eventualities, and would have no problem chucking that much money at an issue to get it fixed. Is £1000 enough to cover most S Type faults?

[The Leaper]

I've no idea about the cost of the gearbox issues. All the work was done without any hastle by the JMD I use and all paid under the Jaguar warranty.

Regarding front suspension costs, I seem to recall seeing somewhere that when the bushes fail it's not possible to simply replace them because the whole assembly is sold by Jaguar as a single unit costing around £500. I could be wrong about this..I await to be corrected by others.

R.

[Benbay001]

The Leaper said:

I've no idea about the cost of the gearbox issues. All the work was done without any hastle by the JMD I use and all paid under the Jaguar warranty.

Regarding front suspension costs, I seem to recall seeing somewhere that when the bushes fail it's not possible to simply replace them because the whole assembly is sold by Jaguar as a single unit costing around £500. I could be wrong about this..I await to be corrected by others.

R.

Thank you, you have been very helpful.
When i get one, hopefully within the next month, i will try and get some pics up in this thread, and possibly a video

[Jaged]

Hi Ben

I bought a 02 R last year and had to have the rear suspension arms replaced, as my local Jag specilist told me the bushes can't be replaced. Jaguar only supply the arm complete!
400BHP eats them!

Racing Green have actually had these special bushes made, and so replacing the arm is no longer required!
A lot cheaper!

My car had new disks fitted not long before I got the car, but must have been fitted by a blind monkey as they were not running true and a little steering wheel wobble got worse, so I replaced the disks and pads with top of their range EBC items.

But that wobble buggered up the front drag-link, so this year the front drag-links were replaced as a pair.
I asked for the old link arm back this tiem, as I have seen these being offered as an exchange with new bushes replaced.

In less than 6000 miles I have spent more on this R than I did in 3 years with a TVR Cerbera and that was all upgrades!

So get the suspension looked over by an MOT tester if you can, to get a view on bush wear and tear.

BUT!! My S-Type R is just an outstanding car to drive and I feel worth every penny I have spent on it.

One small problem I have is that is is so fast, it takes off like a rocket and I have to feather the throttle on initial take off.

My other car (Boxster S tiptronic) takes off in 2nd normally, which is a brilliant idea as it avoids that sudden jolt in the back and I know that if the gearbox could be re-programmed, it would cure my only slight dislike of the car. Apart from the samll boot and small petrol tank.

Sad I know saying the car takes off too fast, but in normal driving it can be a it of a pain just trying to be smooth in traffic. After all Rolls Royce also take off in 2nd unless you boot it!

Good luck in getting a good one!

[Benbay001]

Jaged said:

Hi Ben

I bought a 02 R last year and had to have the rear suspension arms replaced, as my local Jag specilist told me the bushes can't be replaced. Jaguar only supply the arm complete!
400BHP eats them!

Racing Green have actually had these special bushes made, and so replacing the arm is no longer required!
A lot cheaper!

My car had new disks fitted not long before I got the car, but must have been fitted by a blind monkey as they were not running true and a little steering wheel wobble got worse, so I replaced the disks and pads with top of their range EBC items.

But that wobble buggered up the front drag-link, so this year the front drag-links were replaced as a pair.
I asked for the old link arm back this tiem, as I have seen these being offered as an exchange with new bushes replaced.

In less than 6000 miles I have spent more on this R than I did in 3 years with a TVR Cerbera and that was all upgrades!

So get the suspension looked over by an MOT tester if you can, to get a view on bush wear and tear.

BUT!! My S-Type R is just an outstanding car to drive and I feel worth every penny I have spent on it.

One small problem I have is that is is so fast, it takes off like a rocket and I have to feather the throttle on initial take off.

My other car (Boxster S tiptronic) takes off in 2nd normally, which is a brilliant idea as it avoids that sudden jolt in the back and I know that if the gearbox could be re-programmed, it would cure my only slight dislike of the car. Apart from the samll boot and small petrol tank.

Sad I know saying the car takes off too fast, but in normal driving it can be a it of a pain just trying to be smooth in traffic. After all Rolls Royce also take off in 2nd unless you boot it!

Good luck in getting a good one!

Thank you very much.
How much would you say your suspension woes have cost?

[The Leaper]

I thought all S-Type autos took off in 2nd unless the sport button was engaged.

R.

[Jaged]

The Leaper said:

I thought all S-Type autos took off in 2nd unless the sport button was engaged.

R.

I have been told that when I asked on here, but I have done some testing and mine takes off in 1st in both modes.
It changes up to 2nd very-very quickly, within the lenght of the car in eco mode as I move off slowly.

I did wonder if the early problems with this design of box (that both BMW and Jag had), which I read was cured with a re-program have caused mine to use 1st all the time?

I might go over to the Jaguar forum and ask.
It might need a filter and fluid change???

I now hold on left foot braking, which allows me to better control the throttle.
But if I move my right foot from the brake to the throttle, that little bit of gas sometimes spins the rears if it is wet.

But apart from that, what a car!
And don't forget, I went from the Cerbera (drove it to dealer to do a swap) to this STR and drove it home!

[Jaged]

Benbay001 said:

Thank you very much.
How much would you say your suspension woes have cost?

From memory (at work today- I'll edit if I can find the bills)

I got the rear nearside lower are replaced along with the drop links on the ARB, at the same time as a service.
It was just over £1000 in total at a local Jaguar specialist. The arm was £300 from Jaguar.

Recent fronts drag links were changed, along with one lambda sensor for just over £800.
I have seen those front arms on eBay offered on exchange basis for £185.
I used my MOT garage to do this last work, they said you can't replace these bushes either, so fitted new items. I have the old arms and was going to see if I can get the bushes replaced and sell them on or keep for future use?

I do advise getting the wheels balanced regularly, because the suspension will absorb a lot of imbalance and you won't even notice it!

With such a powerful heavy car with such sophisticated suspension to give that Jaguar ride, I do expect further work will be needed in years to come. And I intend to keep this car for some time, it is that good!

If fact it is so good, a friend of mine, who has only been in it a couple of times when I picked him up from the airport intends to get one himself now!

WhenI replaced the front brakes, I decided to get uprated EBC Ultimax Sport Slotted Brake Discs and red-stuff pads. £400 ish!
Not a cheap car to run!

So again, look at the brake discs and avoid a costly early hit if you can.
Some people will be selling these car because they need money spent on them, some because they just want something newer.

I recently paid for a Porsche specilist to inspect the Boxster I eventually bought.
Believe it or not, but they have a terrible reputation for blowing up engines and I wanted the specilist to check to see if there was any sign of the early bearing failure that causes it.
Well worth the £270 I paid for the inspection, as the previous owner himslef knocked £500 off the already low asking price as a result of that inspection.

So if you have a particular car in mind, are friendly with your trusted MOT man, the price of an MOT at your expense, could well be worth it if he is willing to give you an honest opinion of the state of the car.
My personal opinion is that people who buy a car because the dealer has stamped the service book are idiots!
it is the things that are not service items that are as if not more important!

Make sure you buy the right car!
Oh and enjoy!

[Benbay001]

Jaged said:

From memory (at work today- I'll edit if I can find the bills)

I got the rear nearside lower are replaced along with the drop links on the ARB, at the same time as a service.
It was just over £1000 in total at a local Jaguar specialist. The arm was £300 from Jaguar.

Recent fronts drag links were changed, along with one lambda sensor for just over £800.
I have seen those front arms on eBay offered on exchange basis for £185.
I used my MOT garage to do this last work, they said you can't replace these bushes either, so fitted new items. I have the old arms and was going to see if I can get the bushes replaced and sell them on or keep for future use?

I do advise getting the wheels balanced regularly, because the suspension will absorb a lot of imbalance and you won't even notice it!

With such a powerful heavy car with such sophisticated suspension to give that Jaguar ride, I do expect further work will be needed in years to come. And I intend to keep this car for some time, it is that good!

If fact it is so good, a friend of mine, who has only been in it a couple of times when I picked him up from the airport intends to get one himself now!

WhenI replaced the front brakes, I decided to get uprated EBC Ultimax Sport Slotted Brake Discs and red-stuff pads. £400 ish!
Not a cheap car to run!

So again, look at the brake discs and avoid a costly early hit if you can.
Some people will be selling these car because they need money spent on them, some because they just want something newer.

I recently paid for a Porsche specilist to inspect the Boxster I eventually bought.
Believe it or not, but they have a terrible reputation for blowing up engines and I wanted the specilist to check to see if there was any sign of the early bearing failure that causes it.
Well worth the £270 I paid for the inspection, as the previous owner himslef knocked £500 off the already low asking price as a result of that inspection.

So if you have a particular car in mind, are friendly with your trusted MOT man, the price of an MOT at your expense, could well be worth it if he is willing to give you an honest opinion of the state of the car.
My personal opinion is that people who buy a car because the dealer has stamped the service book are idiots!
it is the things that are not service items that are as if not more important!

Make sure you buy the right car!
Oh and enjoy!

Thank you! Cerb vs STR, which do you prefer?

[V40TC]

Very important to have the geometry set correctly to avoid ruining tyres
the Jag specs have been amended and a TSB released
I have them in PDF here
after having had it set correctly the front tyres are lasting well.

[Jaged]

Benbay001 said:

Thank you! Cerb vs STR, which do you prefer?

To be honest I can't answer that.
Just two totally different cars.

The Cerbera is such a raw monster of a car.
No driver aids or protection!
Just you and 415BHP 8000rpm of screaming TVR at it's best!
I did manage 4 laps of Le Mans full circuit during the Classic in 2010.
I'll never forget four wheel drifiting through Tertre Rouge and dicing with other cars!
Loved it for 3 years.

BUT I love the STR now! VERY fast, very comfortable, very quite and very relaxed.
To drive a TVR you have to have a bit of a hooligan in you, to drive a Jaguar you have to be a bit of a Gentleman!
To drive an STR you have to be a bit of both!

[Jaged]

V40TC said:

Very important to have the geometry set correctly to avoid ruining tyres
the Jag specs have been amended and a TSB released
I have them in PDF here
after having had it set correctly the front tyres are lasting well.

Can you post up those specs please?