Helping a neighbour with his 110 Defender
Discussion
Hi all,
New to the world of 4x4 and off road. A neighbour finds himself in a spot of bother with a 1986 110 ex military Defender with a 200TDI conversion. I’m trying to give him a hand.
To put my DIY mechanic abilities in context, I’ve done timing belts, clutches and gearbox swaps on small petrol 4-pots.
This post is mostly to say hi and find out if there are any regulars on here who do work on similar vehicles - or if there are any other sites / resources I should check out.
Cheers!
New to the world of 4x4 and off road. A neighbour finds himself in a spot of bother with a 1986 110 ex military Defender with a 200TDI conversion. I’m trying to give him a hand.
To put my DIY mechanic abilities in context, I’ve done timing belts, clutches and gearbox swaps on small petrol 4-pots.
This post is mostly to say hi and find out if there are any regulars on here who do work on similar vehicles - or if there are any other sites / resources I should check out.
Cheers!
There are a lot of Land Rover forums - both Internet and Facebook.
I particularly like the Defender2 forum:
https://www.defender2.net/forum/
I particularly like the Defender2 forum:
https://www.defender2.net/forum/
In the main Land Rovers of that age are basically Big Boy's Meccano kits without the complex electronics of later ones.
Conversions can be an issue esp if done badly by a bodger.
Factory workshop manual is a good idea, far better than Haynes.
The one for mine (Classic Range Rover 1986) is a big thick book which was expensive but has saved me a fortune over the years.
Landyzone is another LR website worth a look. Try & post in the appropriate section as it can sometimes be a bit brutal!
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/forum/
Conversions can be an issue esp if done badly by a bodger.
Factory workshop manual is a good idea, far better than Haynes.
The one for mine (Classic Range Rover 1986) is a big thick book which was expensive but has saved me a fortune over the years.
Landyzone is another LR website worth a look. Try & post in the appropriate section as it can sometimes be a bit brutal!
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/forum/
_Al_ said:
Thanks gents. Figuring out how bad it is remains one of the key challenges. The fuel lines have been heavily bodged, it has extensive corrosion, smokes just like an actual smoke machine and needs a lot of general TLC.
Quite a big project!
Ok, but does it broadly "work"?Quite a big project!
Because that all sounds pretty normal tbh.
Coming up to 40 years old, presumably with an eye on historic status and/or MOT exemption?
Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
LooneyTunes said:
Coming up to 40 years old, presumably with an eye on historic status and/or MOT exemption?
Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
I think an Land Rover engine is relatively "safe" in that it's a later engine that was also fitted to that same vehicle from the factory, so should come under both the "alternative original equipment" clause and the "changes of a type which can be demonstrated to have been made when vehicles of the type were in production or within 10 years of the end of production" clause.Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
The engine isn’t really a worry.
It’s been common for years to swap out a td engine for a tdi engine. Usually from a Discovery 1 that’s been scrapped due to rust.
The rest is pretty much straightforward nuts and bolts for brakes, axels etc.
The electrics will likely be a mess. I’ve several friends with defenders and the wiring on them is hopeless.
I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve seen lights not work, work, not work, on the same trip…
Autosparks will make up a brand new wiring harness that looks like the original but is fresh and works.
I’ve one for my 1950 80” and it’s lovely.
You mention corrosion…
How bad and where?
As a friends rebuilding a 110 V8 and a new galvanised chassis and bulkhead has just lifted 4 grand from his wallet.
Outriggers and back cross members and bulkhead foot wells are common areas, if it’s worse than that….
It’s been common for years to swap out a td engine for a tdi engine. Usually from a Discovery 1 that’s been scrapped due to rust.
The rest is pretty much straightforward nuts and bolts for brakes, axels etc.
The electrics will likely be a mess. I’ve several friends with defenders and the wiring on them is hopeless.
I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve seen lights not work, work, not work, on the same trip…
Autosparks will make up a brand new wiring harness that looks like the original but is fresh and works.
I’ve one for my 1950 80” and it’s lovely.
You mention corrosion…
How bad and where?
As a friends rebuilding a 110 V8 and a new galvanised chassis and bulkhead has just lifted 4 grand from his wallet.
Outriggers and back cross members and bulkhead foot wells are common areas, if it’s worse than that….
InitialDave said:
LooneyTunes said:
Coming up to 40 years old, presumably with an eye on historic status and/or MOT exemption?
Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
I think an Land Rover engine is relatively "safe" in that it's a later engine that was also fitted to that same vehicle from the factory, so should come under both the "alternative original equipment" clause and the "changes of a type which can be demonstrated to have been made when vehicles of the type were in production or within 10 years of the end of production" clause.Might be worth double checking what exactly has happened to the vehicle and whether it impacts these. An engine conversion might, as could broader modifications, have a negative impact.
Personally I’ve always stayed well clear of engine converted ones out of concern for how “straight” they might or might not be when it comes to registration details and implications of this.
That isn’t to say that all conversions are bad, just better to check the rules and whether the vehicle currently complies (or might cease to do depending on the scale of the project envisaged).
It could turn out to be no problem at all, but worth confirming before embarking on a project.
There's tonnes of online info for Land Rovers and specialist forums and youtube videos will give you most of what you need, I'd say a good starting point is:
- Google and download PDF copies of workshop and repair manuals, you should also be able to find wiring diagrams etc
- LR 4x4 forum is full of useful info but there are lots of other websites too
- There are loads of great parts suppliers and almost every part will still be available and they're mostly very cheap, a good starting point is Paddocks Spares and the Land Rover Classic parts website for online parts catalogues
- Once you have you part numbers, google them or stick them into eBay to find the best prices
- With it being an engine swap truck, watch out for other swapped parts around axles and brakes, most of the battle will be finding the right part to match if its a total bits-er
- Land Rover shows are great for accessories, people and autojumble, get there early as people take autojumbles seriously in these circles
- Google and download PDF copies of workshop and repair manuals, you should also be able to find wiring diagrams etc
- LR 4x4 forum is full of useful info but there are lots of other websites too
- There are loads of great parts suppliers and almost every part will still be available and they're mostly very cheap, a good starting point is Paddocks Spares and the Land Rover Classic parts website for online parts catalogues
- Once you have you part numbers, google them or stick them into eBay to find the best prices
- With it being an engine swap truck, watch out for other swapped parts around axles and brakes, most of the battle will be finding the right part to match if its a total bits-er
- Land Rover shows are great for accessories, people and autojumble, get there early as people take autojumbles seriously in these circles
Thanks all! Really useful input. Taking the questions in no particular order:
It does broadly work, yes. It hauled itself 70 miles back from the point of sale, albeit with diesel pouring all over the road from a leak around the fuel level sender (got a replacement, not yet fitted, wondering if it is possible without dropping the tank). He said it ran “very hot” all the way back but couldn’t recall how hot. It will often start and sometimes run now but it doesn’t like doing it and smokes like mad.
Noting TADTS - not to this extent. It will literally disappear in a military grade smoke screen such that you can’t even see its outline from across the road in a minute or so. Fitting, as it’s an ex military vehicle. Some drawbacks for civilian use.
Yes it’s a 200TDI (albeit he was sold it as a 300)
By eye it appears straight, but there are A Lot of bodges. Plastic drainage pipe is used in places alongside garden hose. The front grille looks OEM but doesn’t sit on the chassis brackets for it. The list goes on.
The electrics are indeed a mess. I don’t know who did it, but I’m pretty confident my kids could do better in a craft session at nursery.
I haven’t identified any lethal looking corrosion yet. I’m not sure of the terms but there’s a spur off the chassis which a relies a lot on thin air for its rigidity and I can pull thick chunks of metal off parts of the chassis - but what’s left still seems “solid” against human hands. Not sure how it’d face off to a small hammer though.
I am really worried about the degree of “bits-ing”. I don’t mind spanner work but I’m “time poor” (as you can tell from my tardy responses to my own thread) and this will take forever if I have to trawl the net and the real world for parts identification purposes.
Thanks again all! Hoping to get the fuel sender replaced this weekend as a minimum, ideally the return house replaced as well. Hoping that having fuel circulating properly might just help it run. The diesel in the tanks has been there for over a year Now and with all the leaks I imagine it’s taken on a lot of water. Thinking I should probably drain It and dispose of it?
It does broadly work, yes. It hauled itself 70 miles back from the point of sale, albeit with diesel pouring all over the road from a leak around the fuel level sender (got a replacement, not yet fitted, wondering if it is possible without dropping the tank). He said it ran “very hot” all the way back but couldn’t recall how hot. It will often start and sometimes run now but it doesn’t like doing it and smokes like mad.
Noting TADTS - not to this extent. It will literally disappear in a military grade smoke screen such that you can’t even see its outline from across the road in a minute or so. Fitting, as it’s an ex military vehicle. Some drawbacks for civilian use.
Yes it’s a 200TDI (albeit he was sold it as a 300)
By eye it appears straight, but there are A Lot of bodges. Plastic drainage pipe is used in places alongside garden hose. The front grille looks OEM but doesn’t sit on the chassis brackets for it. The list goes on.
The electrics are indeed a mess. I don’t know who did it, but I’m pretty confident my kids could do better in a craft session at nursery.
I haven’t identified any lethal looking corrosion yet. I’m not sure of the terms but there’s a spur off the chassis which a relies a lot on thin air for its rigidity and I can pull thick chunks of metal off parts of the chassis - but what’s left still seems “solid” against human hands. Not sure how it’d face off to a small hammer though.
I am really worried about the degree of “bits-ing”. I don’t mind spanner work but I’m “time poor” (as you can tell from my tardy responses to my own thread) and this will take forever if I have to trawl the net and the real world for parts identification purposes.
Thanks again all! Hoping to get the fuel sender replaced this weekend as a minimum, ideally the return house replaced as well. Hoping that having fuel circulating properly might just help it run. The diesel in the tanks has been there for over a year Now and with all the leaks I imagine it’s taken on a lot of water. Thinking I should probably drain It and dispose of it?
Edited by _Al_ on Saturday 21st December 08:18
Yours might be a tad early & the mods may not be covered but Lrcat has its uses.
Look in the Defender & Disco 1 sections.
https://lrcat.com/
Look in the Defender & Disco 1 sections.
https://lrcat.com/
Edited by paintman on Sunday 29th December 12:25
This is the issue with land rovers.
Yes they are easy to work on, which does encourage home mechanics.
The downside is not everyone is a competent mechanic so lots get all sorts of bodges etc done to them.
It can be expensive to rip it all out and start afresh, but, you then know the baseline for what’s been done, what parts used etc.
Yes they are easy to work on, which does encourage home mechanics.
The downside is not everyone is a competent mechanic so lots get all sorts of bodges etc done to them.
It can be expensive to rip it all out and start afresh, but, you then know the baseline for what’s been done, what parts used etc.
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