RE: Porsche 911 C4 vs Audi R8 V10

[Ian_UK1]

jamespink said:

Am I the only one that thinks over £9k is a big lump for a different ECU map?

If you bothered to read what the power kit consists of, you wouldn't end-up making such stupid statements.

From Porsche's web site:

"To develop the Powerkit, a number of sophisticated measures were needed . The cylinder head intake ports have been reworked and given a polished finish. The stroke of the intake camshaft has been increased and the electronic engine management adapted accordingly.

The highlight of the Carrera S Powerkit is the newly developed variable resonance intake manifold with six plus one switchable valves. This innovation enables the system to switch between power- and torque-optimised geometries and deliver a boost in power output, particularly in the upper speed range. The extra heat generated by power increase is dissipated by an additional centre radiator.

Other components include the Sport Chrono Package with dynamic engine mounts, the sports exhaust system with two specially designed twin tailpipes and the titanium-coloured engine cover featuring inlays in carbon".

Link: http://www.porsche.com/uk/powerkit-911-carrera-s/

[Dusty964]

Ian_UK1 said:

jamespink said:

Am I the only one that thinks over £9k is a big lump for a different ECU map?

If you bothered to read what the power kit consists of, you wouldn't end-up making such stupid statements.

From Porsche's web site:

"To develop the Powerkit, a number of sophisticated measures were needed . The cylinder head intake ports have been reworked and given a polished finish. The stroke of the intake camshaft has been increased and the electronic engine management adapted accordingly.

The highlight of the Carrera S Powerkit is the newly developed variable resonance intake manifold with six plus one switchable valves. This innovation enables the system to switch between power- and torque-optimised geometries and deliver a boost in power output, particularly in the upper speed range. The extra heat generated by power increase is dissipated by an additional centre radiator.

Other components include the Sport Chrono Package with dynamic engine mounts, the sports exhaust system with two specially designed twin tailpipes and the titanium-coloured engine cover featuring inlays in carbon".

Link: http://www.porsche.com/uk/powerkit-911-carrera-s/

Yeah, stop making stupid statements and read it off the Porsche web site- after all, they would never do anything but tell you how hard they work for their extra 9k, would they? The titanium coloured engine cover features inlays in carbon, how much 'sports' do you want for your 9k?

[Wills2]

Ian_UK1 said:

jamespink said:

Am I the only one that thinks over £9k is a big lump for a different ECU map?

If you bothered to read what the power kit consists of, you wouldn't end-up making such stupid statements.

From Porsche's web site:

"To develop the Powerkit, a number of sophisticated measures were needed . The cylinder head intake ports have been reworked and given a polished finish. The stroke of the intake camshaft has been increased and the electronic engine management adapted accordingly.

The highlight of the Carrera S Powerkit is the newly developed variable resonance intake manifold with six plus one switchable valves. This innovation enables the system to switch between power- and torque-optimised geometries and deliver a boost in power output, particularly in the upper speed range. The extra heat generated by power increase is dissipated by an additional centre radiator.

Other components include the Sport Chrono Package with dynamic engine mounts, the sports exhaust system with two specially designed twin tailpipes and the titanium-coloured engine cover featuring inlays in carbon".

Link: http://www.porsche.com/uk/powerkit-911-carrera-s/

It's still a crazy price and hence it's a very rare option.

[toppstuff]

It is pretty expensive.

By way of comparison, look at the very similar packages offered by Litchfield to upgrade the Nissan GTR. Here, they use upgraded components such as Garrett Turbo components, upgraded titanium exhausts, new injectors etc to get the extra HP. And the cost of this stuff, while high, is not as high as Porsche are charging.

No doubt the Porsche kit contains a lot of profit.

[pagani1]

R8 in 4 years time when depreciation has bitten it up the rear. Then it will have shown it's reliability, and Audi dealers are always around the corner for servicing etc. The pricing of extras that are considered essential by the buyer is a thorny issue for me-the manufacturers have a ******* cheek! Buying second hand doesn't bring that angst with it and as for paint charges-don't get me started. I reckon there's as much fun to be had in a classic come purchase time like the Ferrari 512TR (yesterday's was delicious) or even a Lamborghini/Aston Martin.
Me, I'm just a jealous guy.Love them all.

[nickfrog]

Ian_UK1 said:

jamespink said:

Am I the only one that thinks over £9k is a big lump for a different ECU map?

If you bothered to read what the power kit consists of, you wouldn't end-up making such stupid statements.

From Porsche's web site: (...) titanium-coloured engine cover featuring inlays in carbon".[/i]

Link: http://www.porsche.com/uk/powerkit-911-carrera-s/

Says it all really. Porsche assume that you either have stopped reading before the end of the article because you realised it was just marketing BS or that you're still reading and that you're naive enough to fall for it and in which case you might still be impressed by the fact that it has the colour of titanium (point of that being ?) and that there will be a measurable functional benefit to having carbon inlays on an engine cover. Carbon ? This is not 1995, is it ?

[chris123321]

I'd have the Audi R8 based solely on the advert they just released.

I'm not even ashamed to say I'd buy a car purely because of the ad, its bloody brilliant.

[911p]

It costs a lot of money to get power out of an already highly strung NA engine, you're not in the same ballpark as you would be when tuning a turbocharged car. Granted, you'll pay a premium because it's coming from Porsche (the same reason you pay almost £1600 for cruise control) but it comes fully warranted with the same drivability etc as the normal engine.

To get the same performance gains from bolt ons you're probably looking at around £4k anyway, and then you have concerns about noise and reliability from different air filters, exhaust options and ECU maps.

ETA - dynamic engine mounts and PSE come standard with it anyway, which as additional options would be around £2.5k, leaving the internal engine upgrades for the X51 option at about £6.5k.

Edited by 911p on Tuesday 21st May 14:00

[anything fast]

125k for Audi and 87k for the Porker? Err the Porsche and a big wad of cash in me pocket please.

But that yellow is just plain nasty... no way suits the car!

[justa1972]

that advert is brilliant - what a noise - gives me goosebumps

[Carl_Docklands]

toppstuff said:

It is pretty expensive.

By way of comparison, look at the very similar packages offered by Litchfield to upgrade the Nissan GTR. Here, they use upgraded components such as Garrett Turbo components, upgraded titanium exhausts, new injectors etc to get the extra HP. And the cost of this stuff, while high, is not as high as Porsche are charging.

No doubt the Porsche kit contains a lot of profit.

None of that stuff works on an NA engine through and a Titanium 'zaust is about £7k on its own, without labour.

Porsche extract 430BHP out of a 6 cylinder 3.8L engine, Audi provides the same HP with an 8 cylinder 4.2L engine. Aston Martin extract 430BHP out of a 8 cylinder 4.8L engine.

It might be expensive but the engineering is first rate.

[NorthernBoy]

k-ink said:

This is exactly why Porsche are the most profitable car company around. They know their customers will pay £10k extra for £100 worth of product. Same with all the add on options lists.

If people are willing to pay £10k, then by what possible measure is it "worth" only £100?

[dvs_dave]

Carl_Docklands said:

I wonder what the MPG was for both cars on this run ?

One of the main marks against the V10 R8 is its thirst, the other is its lack of luggage space/options for touring although it appears you can get a roof box for the R8 coupe?

Yes, why they don't do a diesel estate version is beyond me? At least it's available in RHD which is some concellation, however the excessive fuel consumption and lack of practical boot space means that they've lost a potential sale here.

[Jellyman]

I remember Eoin Young justifying buying a 911 back in the 1970's - while it was twice the price of anything else, he would have it twice as long and enjoy driving it twice as much. Not much has changed, then.

[TREMAiNE]

toppstuff said:

Both lovely cars.

But I would not choose either of them.

I'd get a Nissan GTR and several years of awesome holidays with the change.

Or a 2nd hand 997 Turbo with enough left for a deposit for a house!

[S3Swiss]

SrMoreno said:

Shhhh! Lets keep the tourists on the A9.

agree - can't believe they gave away the location of my favourite drive (past Lochindorb into Forres). It is the B9007 if you are up this way - aaargggh, even I'm doing it now!

[Carl_Docklands]

dvs_dave said:

Carl_Docklands said:

I wonder what the MPG was for both cars on this run ?

One of the main marks against the V10 R8 is its thirst, the other is its lack of luggage space/options for touring although it appears you can get a roof box for the R8 coupe?

Yes, why they don't do a diesel estate version is beyond me? At least it's available in RHD which is some concellation, however the excessive fuel consumption and lack of practical boot space means that they've lost a potential sale here.

These things mean nothing to a singleton PH'er I grant you but after years of doing London to Cornwall runs at the weekend with a woman who does not understand how only to pack for 2 days and not 20, they are pretty high on my list now

Same with the fuel consumption, getting 18MPG out of a GT car is a pain in the neck, no matter how good the engine sounds.

[whytheory]

Yellow suits the 991 IMHO. As a GT car my money's on the Porsche and although 90% of the time I'd choose a manual I think the PDK suits the car more.

The Audi's never really appealed to me, and at the end of the day I'd probably have a Cayman S over both these cars.

[LordPetroleum]

tosh.brice said:

Gavlar83 said:

on a slightly different note, anyone else think the new audi r8 advert is the absolute nuts!!??

do you mean this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0gvqLZIQss

Have to admit, this does have me scrabbling for the tissues everytime

[wc98]

toppstuff said:

Both lovely cars.

But I would not choose either of them.

I'd get a Nissan GTR and several years of awesome holidays with the change.

as long as the brakes dont need replacing during your ownership.i dont know about the porsche and audi brake costs,but my brothers mate was just quoted 8k TRADE ! price for a set of discs and pads for a gtr,after picking himself off the ground he went direct to nissan who did him a deal as the wear was a bit higher than they would expect for the mileage (this is scotland where you can actually drive cars spiritedly as opposed to sitting in endless traffic jams at most times of the day)and ONLY charged him 4.5k !

i am hoping someone will now come on and say he is over egging it by a large margin,thats a helluve a lot of cash for a set of discs and pads ! i do not care who it is,i doubt even coulthard would notice the extra performance of carbon ceramic brakes on the road or even on a track in a production road car