E Scooters soon to be allowed on UK roads?
Discussion
PF62 said:
"Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe" - duh! Looking what was happing on before they introduced the rental scooters would have told them that.
And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
Not necessarily.And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
It’s only Voi that are introducing numberplates at the moment, so most rental scooters won’t have them.
Personally I think the Government have (surprise surprise) made a total arse of introducing e-scooters.
Making it ‘rental only’ has simply encouraged antisocial behaviour on a scale that wouldn’t be seen if private ownership and use was allowed.
The exact same thing happened with rental bikes around the UK. They mostly got thrown in rivers, trashed, stolen, ridden antisocially and left everywhere they shouldn’t be.
If you based the legality of bicycles on the results of bicycle rental, then we wouldn’t be allowed bicycles right now.
If they had said from day one that it was legal to use your own e-scooter but set high penalty fines and confiscation for riding them in the wrong places, then I doubt we would have many issues, the same as we have few issues with privately owned and ridden bicycles.
Unsurprisingly, Germany have got it right:
Private scooters are allowed to be used on roads and cycle lanes but they must be ‘type approved’, meaning a good quality £450 scooter with built in lights and brakes rather than a badly made £50 scooter.
You must have insurance at a cost of £15 per year which is indicated by an anti-tamper sticker you apply to the scooter.
There are a range of ‘on the spot‘ cash fines for using them in any manner other than what is legal.
Why do we always f
k things up in this country?techguyone said:
PF62 said:
Lord Marylebone said:
Scooter rental company Voi announced last night that all their scooters will be fitted with large 5-digit numberplates in an effort to make riders easily identifiable, in an attempt to end antisocial behaviour.
Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
"Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe" - duh! Looking what was happing on before they introduced the rental scooters would have told them that.Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
Just doesn’t surprise me. The company involved hasn’t seen any anti social behaviour involving their scooters in any of the other markets that they’re in. Just the U.K. or maybe the other countries don’t class the use of them on pavements as anti social?
I think it happened with some of the cycle schemes or the one in Manchester at least.
Just doesn’t surprise me. The company involved hasn’t seen any anti social behaviour involving their scooters in any of the other markets that they’re in. Just the U.K. or maybe the other countries don’t class the use of them on pavements as anti social?
I think it happened with some of the cycle schemes or the one in Manchester at least.
Lord Marylebone said:
Scooter rental company Voi announced last night that all their scooters will be fitted with large 5-digit numberplates in an effort to make riders easily identifiable, in an attempt to end antisocial behaviour.
Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
Too many people seem to have the idea that they should be allowed to do whatever they want irrespective of how it affects anyone else 'because rights'. Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
Edited by Lord Marylebone on Thursday 17th September 08:21
Of course speed limits are, erm, for other people if you are a petrol head and driving god obviously.
Fatball said:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
Just doesn’t surprise me. The company involved hasn’t seen any anti social behaviour involving their scooters in any of the other markets that they’re in. Just the U.K. or maybe the other countries don’t class the use of them on pavements as anti social?
I think it happened with some of the cycle schemes or the one in Manchester at least.
Where as Lime who also operate elsewhere has seen plenty of it and even ran ad campaigns in France about it. Just doesn’t surprise me. The company involved hasn’t seen any anti social behaviour involving their scooters in any of the other markets that they’re in. Just the U.K. or maybe the other countries don’t class the use of them on pavements as anti social?
I think it happened with some of the cycle schemes or the one in Manchester at least.
Not a surprise really is it, people can be a
holes, in other news, sky blue, water wet etc etc!Once the 12 year olds get over the novelty and the everyone has eventually had a go it will all calm down and become much more sensible I expect.
geeks said:
Where as Lime who also operate elsewhere has seen plenty of it and even ran ad campaigns in France about it.
Not a surprise really is it, people can be aholes, in other news, sky blue, water wet etc etc!
Once the 12 year olds get over the novelty and the everyone has eventually had a go it will all calm down and become much more sensible I expect.
Some of the cycle businesses moved out because of it so either way it’ll be reet. Not a surprise really is it, people can be a
holes, in other news, sky blue, water wet etc etc!Once the 12 year olds get over the novelty and the everyone has eventually had a go it will all calm down and become much more sensible I expect.
Lord Marylebone said:
Scooter rental company Voi announced last night that all their scooters will be fitted with large 5-digit numberplates in an effort to make riders easily identifiable, in an attempt to end antisocial behaviour.
Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
I do not understand this approach at all. Adding a number plate should not be necessary. Shirley the GPS information that allows you to find an available scooter can be used to track and even prevent the scooter from going anywhere that it is not allowed. If yo move on to a pavement the power is cut till you are back on track. The business case also requires you know who is hiring the scooter otherwise you would not be able to extract the money from the user. Alternatively you could even get the user to pay a deposit that you only get back after the analysis of your rout shows you obeyed the rules. SimplesVoi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
Edited by Lord Marylebone on Thursday 17th September 08:21
Abbott said:
I do not understand this approach at all. Adding a number plate should not be necessary. Shirley the GPS information that allows you to find an available scooter can be used to track and even prevent the scooter from going anywhere that it is not allowed. If yo move on to a pavement the power is cut till you are back on track. The business case also requires you know who is hiring the scooter otherwise you would not be able to extract the money from the user. Alternatively you could even get the user to pay a deposit that you only get back after the analysis of your rout shows you obeyed the rules. Simples
There is absolutely no way the GPS system on the scooters will be accurate enough to determine if someone was riding on a pavement or alongside a pavement while remaining on the road.Yes, I imagine you could geofence areas such as whole pedestrianised streets, but I suspect that would be a massively complex and expensive task to map out every single ‘no go’ area in every city where these are being used.
Plus it wouldn’t stop things like them being ridden in an antisocial or dangerous fashion whilst on the road, or being ridden down one way streets the wrong way or through red lights etc.
Lord Marylebone said:
Yes, I imagine you could geofence areas such as whole pedestrianised streets, but I suspect that would be a massively complex and expensive task to map out every single ‘no go’ area in every city where these are being used.
This is what they do in Malaga. Unless you get a Lime one, which I made sure to, as 5mph is slow as fk, and they had no restrictions.Abbott said:
Lord Marylebone said:
Scooter rental company Voi announced last night that all their scooters will be fitted with large 5-digit numberplates in an effort to make riders easily identifiable, in an attempt to end antisocial behaviour.
Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
I do not understand this approach at all. Adding a number plate should not be necessary. Shirley the GPS information that allows you to find an available scooter can be used to track and even prevent the scooter from going anywhere that it is not allowed. If yo move on to a pavement the power is cut till you are back on track. The business case also requires you know who is hiring the scooter otherwise you would not be able to extract the money from the user. Alternatively you could even get the user to pay a deposit that you only get back after the analysis of your rout shows you obeyed the rules. SimplesVoi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe.
“We haven’t seen this level of antisocial behaviour in any other market. We have had great experience of it but the volume of it in the UK was quite surprising.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/numbers-up...
I said on a different thread yesterday that I am embarrassed to be British these days, and this is yet another small piece of evidence that I’m right to be embarrassed.
Edited by Lord Marylebone on Thursday 17th September 08:21
Abbott said:
I do not understand this approach at all. Adding a number plate should not be necessary. Shirley the GPS information that allows you to find an available scooter can be used to track and even prevent the scooter from going anywhere that it is not allowed. If yo move on to a pavement the power is cut till you are back on track. The business case also requires you know who is hiring the scooter otherwise you would not be able to extract the money from the user. Alternatively you could even get the user to pay a deposit that you only get back after the analysis of your rout shows you obeyed the rules. Simples
Stop keep calling me Shirley 
vaud said:
Lord Marylebone said:
Why do we always fk things up in this country?
We don't.k things up in this country?Take road deaths for example.
OECD data. Deaths per 1,000,000 people (2017 being latest data)
UK 28.1
Germany 38.5
UK is lowest in Europe aside from Sweden.
It's not all bad
But why over complicate something as simple as saying yes to using electric scooters?
Just look at the rest of Europe and think “They are reasonably similar to us, they’ve legalised scooters and things seem fine”
I think because I run a business I always look at the most efficient way of getting something going. I’m guessing I’m not cut out for politics...
RizzoTheRat said:
eldar said:
6 foot accuracy is pretty standard, 6 inch possible if cost justified.
Don't you need either differential GPS or a licensed access to the military dual band stuff for that kind of accuracy?It's not going to happen for a poxy scooter because someone's got a hard-on for people maybe riding on the pavement.
eldar said:
techguyone said:
GPS doesn't go to that level of granularity. Might get to 30 foot or so, not much more.
6 foot accuracy is pretty standard, 6 inch possible if cost justified.I would say most of the time my Garmin 64 is slightly more accurate than 6ft, although I must admit it doesn't like trees, buildings, etc. and does need 'line of sight' to at least 4 satellites.
Lord Marylebone said:
PF62 said:
"Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe" - duh! Looking what was happing on before they introduced the rental scooters would have told them that.
And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
Not necessarily.And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
It’s only Voi that are introducing numberplates at the moment, so most rental scooters won’t have them.
So now they have proved electric scooters without number plates are ridden anti-socially, if they are ridden less anti-socially after the number plates are installed, then there the government has the evidence to require them.
PF62 said:
Lord Marylebone said:
PF62 said:
"Voi says that the level of antisocial behaviour on rental scooters is worse in England than anywhere else in Europe" - duh! Looking what was happing on before they introduced the rental scooters would have told them that.
And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
Not necessarily.And of course now anyone riding a scooter without a licence plate is going to be obviously riding an illegal scooter.
It’s only Voi that are introducing numberplates at the moment, so most rental scooters won’t have them.
So now they have proved electric scooters without number plates are ridden anti-socially, if they are ridden less anti-socially after the number plates are installed, then there the government has the evidence to require them.
It does not necessarily mean that they will insist on number plates for privately owned scooters.
My best guess is that the Government won't bother insisting on number plates for either rental or privately owned, and they will leave it up to the rental companies to fit them (or not) if they see fit. I doubt the Government will want the hassle or the administration associated with number plates.
I could well be wrong, but we will see.
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