We criminal lot
Discussion
The Daily Telegraph said:
Middle class 'more likely to dodge car tax or TV licence'
By Sarah Womack, Social Affairs Correspondent
(Filed: 08/06/2004)
The middle classes are the biggest lawbreakers and the most likely to take part in dishonest behaviour, a survey said yesterday.
Almost two thirds of middle class people and high-earning professionals admitted offences such as not paying their road tax or televison licence and damaging items before returning them for a refund.
Among the population generally, the figure is 55 per cent and 43 per cent for those lower down the social scale, including unemployed people and casual workers.
TV Licensing, which conducted the survey, accused the middle classes of double standards.
More than 90 per cent of the population, including the middle classes, think that those who commit such offences are spongers and should "not be allowed to get away with it".
Researchers asked 2,000 people about committing seven offences such as parking in a disabled bay, fare-dodging, paying cash in hand to avoid tax and knowingly pocketing too much change.
Prof Suzanne Karstedt, of Keele University's department of criminology, said the results showed that "it is the professional middle classes and high-earners who commit most of these offences and are mostly involved in morally dubious practices.
"These are the people who see themselves as respectable but are part of a crime wave that costs the country about £14 billion every year."
In total, a third of people admitted knowingly to pocketing too much change; a fifth to paying cash to avoid tax; 14 per cent to fare-dodging; 12 per cent to parking in a disabled bay; nine per cent to damaging items and returning them to obtain a refund; five per cent to evading their television licence fee; and four per cent to failing to pay road tax.
Vanessa Wood, a spokesman for TV Licensing, said: "There is an element of double standards here. While nine out of 10 people demand action against those committing these offences, the majority actually admit to committing one of them."
The research showed that men were the bigger culprits, with 61 per cent admitting to one of the seven dishonest acts compared with 51 per cent of women.
People aged between 18 and 24 are twice as likely (71 per cent) as their grandparents to commit such offences.
The usual sweeping generalities and "complete ignoral" of what the individual figures actually indicate in pursuit of a headline.
Pah!
Do 90% of the population really want the accidental handing out of too much change to stop?
Do that same 90% really want all tradesmen and others to insist on cheque or card payment and provide an invoice?
I doubt it!
Nine out of 10 of us probably get annoyed at parkers in disabled bays and at non-payment of road fund licence (BBC TV is so poor that they should be paying us!), but the "Middle Class" non-payers totalled only 4% of the small sample. And exactly what was the question asked? If it was, "Have you ever not taxed your car on time?" - I'd believe that percentage and even a higher one.
Pah!
Streaky
how about
"have you every burgled a house"
"have you ever held someone at knifepoint and taken their wallet"
a slightly different slant on the results I expect..
SWEEEEPING: "biggest lawbreakers and the most likely to take part in dishonest behaviour,"
>> Edited by M@H on Tuesday 8th June 10:23
"have you every burgled a house"
"have you ever held someone at knifepoint and taken their wallet"
a slightly different slant on the results I expect..
SWEEEEPING: "biggest lawbreakers and the most likely to take part in dishonest behaviour,"
>> Edited by M@H on Tuesday 8th June 10:23
M@H said:
SWEEEEPING: "biggest lawbreakers and the most likely to take part in dishonest behaviour,"
I was about to make a comment about the size of the offence -- after all, not buying a TV licence is not quite up there with murder -- but then I realised that you can now be imprisoned for the smallest of transgressions so the distinction is now invalid.
There was a time years ago when I didn't have a TV althought the house had a TV aerial from the previous owner.
The licensing authorities just would not believe I didn't have a TV. They harrassed me continuallly by post. Sent people knocking on the door, actually asking to come in and look around to confirm I didn't have a TV. "No you can't come in, fkuc off"
When they started parking the detector van down the road I went down and knocked on the door, but they wouldn't open it so I shouted, "I live at XXXXX and I haven't got a TV so p!$$ off"
I do have a TV now but I don't have a licence. My TV room is specially lined to make it into a Faraday cage thus preventing the detector vans picking up the tell tale emissions that allow them to pin point TVs.
The licensing authorities just would not believe I didn't have a TV. They harrassed me continuallly by post. Sent people knocking on the door, actually asking to come in and look around to confirm I didn't have a TV. "No you can't come in, fkuc off"
When they started parking the detector van down the road I went down and knocked on the door, but they wouldn't open it so I shouted, "I live at XXXXX and I haven't got a TV so p!$$ off"
I do have a TV now but I don't have a licence. My TV room is specially lined to make it into a Faraday cage thus preventing the detector vans picking up the tell tale emissions that allow them to pin point TVs.
plotloss said:
Detector Vans dont exist!!
They may park a transit down the road, with detector van written on it but there is no way it can detect a telly.
Its all done on television purchase details...
Besides, if they actually exist, then buy a plasma or LCD tv..apparently they cant be detected
So I've heard, anybody want to confirm/deny that?
The suggestion that the middle-classes are the worst lawbreakers is both ridiculous and insulting.
The vast majority of *all* people of all classes are decent and lawabiding...unless the laws are unfair and discriminatory.
I can see how the middle-classes feel discriminated against at the moment and may indeed be taking revenge in some way. But I am astonished at the PC bollocks that is being spouted...
The vast majority of *all* people of all classes are decent and lawabiding...unless the laws are unfair and discriminatory.
I can see how the middle-classes feel discriminated against at the moment and may indeed be taking revenge in some way. But I am astonished at the PC bollocks that is being spouted...
Don said:
The suggestion that the middle-classes are the worst lawbreakers is both ridiculous and insulting.
The vast majority of *all* people of all classes are decent and lawabiding...unless the laws are unfair and discriminatory.
I can see how the middle-classes feel discriminated against at the moment and may indeed be taking revenge in some way. But I am astonished at the PC bollocks that is being spouted...
It's the gypsies, isn't it Don? They're the worst
plotloss said:
Nothing can be detected, theres nothing inside the vans!
Its all a complete scam to make people pay the license money.
I nearly did some work for TV Licesing (boo hiss) and they swore that the vans DID work, and were capable of picking up UHF transmissions or something. They could tell if a TV (or microwave
) was on, but couldn't say the channel or which room it was in. Besides, you don't need to let the buggers in if they come for a poke around. They'll need a warrant for that.
Just as I understand it, as I thought the detector vans were b0llocks, but I changed my mind after their speil. I could just be a mug, of course
I had some fun and games with some twat from the TV licensing place last year. I was living in a shared student house on campus 5 seperate rooms each with a lock and its own contract. This means that all 5 of us had to pay 110 or whatever it was. But if one person had a licence TV's could be used in the comunal areas or in the guys room with the licence so just to piss of the twat only one guy bought it and we all chiped in and whenever he came round we chucked the tv's into the guys room or comunal areas i and the other 3 must have got about 10 very harrasing letters form them in the space of about 7 months
Define Middle Class please.
I have a BEng (Hons), am a Chartered Engineer and have a wife who trained as a nurse and now works for a charity (stroke association). Our parents were teachers and Computer Consulatants before they retired.
Both our cars were free, both are cavaliers, 12 and 19 years old. We live in a semi with a shared driveway and have high standards of dcecency and honesty that we will pass on to our children. We go on holiday in the UK (this year to a Youth Hostel with Family Room)
I assume we are Middle class.
I work in a factory with the working classes, who are individually nice enough, but most take home more than me, has newer cars, more expensive holidays, but most of them have a complete disregard for the laws of our country. If you want you could obtain knock off clothing, counterfeit CD's, fake Mots, your mother in law 'sorted out for good'. If you leave anything out and unlocked it disappears. They will swear black is white and white is low contrast grey. They lie about their shortcuts and mistakes, and you can bet their children have the same loose morals.
I believe that these people are the working classes.
Whoever did that survey must have got the result muddled up.
I have a BEng (Hons), am a Chartered Engineer and have a wife who trained as a nurse and now works for a charity (stroke association). Our parents were teachers and Computer Consulatants before they retired.
Both our cars were free, both are cavaliers, 12 and 19 years old. We live in a semi with a shared driveway and have high standards of dcecency and honesty that we will pass on to our children. We go on holiday in the UK (this year to a Youth Hostel with Family Room)
I assume we are Middle class.
I work in a factory with the working classes, who are individually nice enough, but most take home more than me, has newer cars, more expensive holidays, but most of them have a complete disregard for the laws of our country. If you want you could obtain knock off clothing, counterfeit CD's, fake Mots, your mother in law 'sorted out for good'. If you leave anything out and unlocked it disappears. They will swear black is white and white is low contrast grey. They lie about their shortcuts and mistakes, and you can bet their children have the same loose morals.
I believe that these people are the working classes.
Whoever did that survey must have got the result muddled up.
plotloss said:
I wrote the extract for the TV licensing database to work off.
People buy a telly, we get the data, then forward it on.
Its JUST a mismatch run over this data and the property register.
Yeah, I know that (I was going to be the one writing the letters
) but they have the vans as well, and apparently they can be used to give evidence of TV use at a certain address. So maybe it's not complete BS like we all thought it was. Sorry to hijack the thread, but the other wonderful thing about TV licensing is that it's just the sodding BBC! They are really worried that 1) people will think badly of the beeb because of it and 2) people will simply think they lack authority despite their officious looking letters and bills. Hehe.
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