Am I a nuisance?
Discussion
Longish post here, looking for some legal-ish advice. Although advice for petty revenge will also be appreciated 
!
One of my neighbours has complained about me being a nuisance.
I wanted to replace the handbrake cable and rear suspension struts on my car, and a couple of other bits a bobs. To do this I had to get right underneath the car. My drive is on a slope so I put the car on the road before raising it, as it's much safer to get under a car if it's raised on level ground.
The work took about a day, and I took a day off work to do it so it was mid week. I didn't finish until the evening. It was basically quiet work, using hand tools, except for about 20 minutes with an angle grinder in the late morning. The road is a cul de sac serving 7 houses, including mine. There was enough space for a bin lorry to get past with no problem - I asked the bin men if they wanted me to move the car, they said no.
One of our neighbours - don't know who but have a pretty good idea - has complained to our "feudal superior" (ancient medieval arrangement in Scotland, this person - in our case the property developer - has some limited authority around the terms of our title to the property) that I was causing a nuisance by doing this, complaining about the noise and the fact of doing it at all. If it's the person I think it is it's probably personal, or snobbery, or both, no idea why but she seems to have taken a dislike to us.
They didn't say anything to us at the time, or at all before writing to the developer.
The terms of our title say that we can't do anything deemed to be "a nuisance"; we got a letter from the developer saying that since someone has complained, it has been deemed to be a nuisance, so please refrain from doing it again.
So - after all that, and if you've read this far, thanks - I'm looking for a little advice:
Could what I have done be considered a public nuisance?
If I write back to the developer saying (politely), it's not a nuisance so poke it - could I have much of a problem? What could they actually do?
! One of my neighbours has complained about me being a nuisance.
I wanted to replace the handbrake cable and rear suspension struts on my car, and a couple of other bits a bobs. To do this I had to get right underneath the car. My drive is on a slope so I put the car on the road before raising it, as it's much safer to get under a car if it's raised on level ground.
The work took about a day, and I took a day off work to do it so it was mid week. I didn't finish until the evening. It was basically quiet work, using hand tools, except for about 20 minutes with an angle grinder in the late morning. The road is a cul de sac serving 7 houses, including mine. There was enough space for a bin lorry to get past with no problem - I asked the bin men if they wanted me to move the car, they said no.
One of our neighbours - don't know who but have a pretty good idea - has complained to our "feudal superior" (ancient medieval arrangement in Scotland, this person - in our case the property developer - has some limited authority around the terms of our title to the property) that I was causing a nuisance by doing this, complaining about the noise and the fact of doing it at all. If it's the person I think it is it's probably personal, or snobbery, or both, no idea why but she seems to have taken a dislike to us.
They didn't say anything to us at the time, or at all before writing to the developer.
The terms of our title say that we can't do anything deemed to be "a nuisance"; we got a letter from the developer saying that since someone has complained, it has been deemed to be a nuisance, so please refrain from doing it again.
So - after all that, and if you've read this far, thanks - I'm looking for a little advice:
Could what I have done be considered a public nuisance?
If I write back to the developer saying (politely), it's not a nuisance so poke it - could I have much of a problem? What could they actually do?
Anything in the 'Title' defining the term 'Nuisance'?
Does it apply to the whole of the development or just your individual plots as what you describe was done on the road?.
Best bet I would suggest, because of the quaintness of Scottish Law, to have a word with Citizen Advice Bureau. They generally provide a free session with a Legal Osprey or if your coat is dripping with gelt - a Solicitor.
DVD
Does it apply to the whole of the development or just your individual plots as what you describe was done on the road?.
Best bet I would suggest, because of the quaintness of Scottish Law, to have a word with Citizen Advice Bureau. They generally provide a free session with a Legal Osprey or if your coat is dripping with gelt - a Solicitor.
DVD
Yes - it lists a few things like keeping vans on the drive, using the garage for business purposes, running a business from home - plus a catch all that says "any other purpose deemed to be a nuisance" - and that's the one they referred to, saying that since someone's complained about it, they've deemed it a nuisance.
Which is crazy, any daft fool can complain about anything - I could complain that the person who complained is causing me a nuisance by complaining ...
Which is crazy, any daft fool can complain about anything - I could complain that the person who complained is causing me a nuisance by complaining ...
John,
Quite simply your neighbour must occasionaly do something you consider a "nuisance". When they do, make your complaint. The block I live in has one of these sad people who have nothing better to do. I know it's childish, and a waste of everybodys time, but get your own complaint in (the more the merrier) preferably backed up by some of your other neighbours, then go and offer and offer to talk it over with the neighbour who is complaining. You might be able to come to some sort of agreement.
The best of luck to you, dealing with stupid people is VERY tiresome..........
Phil
if all else fails, wait til they go on summer holiday, then pour 5 pounds of fishing maggots through the letterbox.....they won't be maggots when they get back
........joke, DON'T do this
Quite simply your neighbour must occasionaly do something you consider a "nuisance". When they do, make your complaint. The block I live in has one of these sad people who have nothing better to do. I know it's childish, and a waste of everybodys time, but get your own complaint in (the more the merrier) preferably backed up by some of your other neighbours, then go and offer and offer to talk it over with the neighbour who is complaining. You might be able to come to some sort of agreement.
The best of luck to you, dealing with stupid people is VERY tiresome..........
Phil
if all else fails, wait til they go on summer holiday, then pour 5 pounds of fishing maggots through the letterbox.....they won't be maggots when they get back
........joke, DON'T do this
Is the road a public highway? Therefore would the property developer have any powers over you? Did the person complain to you at the time? Obviously couldn't have been that much of a nuisance. Is it going to be a regular occurrence? Hopefully you've fixed the problem.
I assume the developer has written to you. Reply politely and explain details in full with approx. timings of actions and where they were carried out. Explain that nothing was said to you at the time and that you don't intend to have to do said work again as it was a one off. In light of these facts ask the developer whether they consider your actions to be reasonable and whether the terms of your title extend to the cul-de-sac.
By their definition of a nuisance if someone writes to them... you could complain about anything... someone hoovering, using kitchen appliances, watching TV, farting... you name it! They would have to use some discretion over definition of nuisance.
Sounds like you've been considerate and reasonable and are using the property within the bounds of what could be reasonably expected.... either that or deny everything!!
MC
I assume the developer has written to you. Reply politely and explain details in full with approx. timings of actions and where they were carried out. Explain that nothing was said to you at the time and that you don't intend to have to do said work again as it was a one off. In light of these facts ask the developer whether they consider your actions to be reasonable and whether the terms of your title extend to the cul-de-sac.
By their definition of a nuisance if someone writes to them... you could complain about anything... someone hoovering, using kitchen appliances, watching TV, farting... you name it! They would have to use some discretion over definition of nuisance.
Sounds like you've been considerate and reasonable and are using the property within the bounds of what could be reasonably expected.... either that or deny everything!!
MC
MajorClanger said:
Is the road a public highway?
Therefore would the property developer have any powers over you?
No, it's provately owned between the 7 houses including me. So yes.
MajorClanger said:
Did the person complain to you at the time?
No.
MajorClanger said:
Is it going to be a regular occurrence? Hopefully you've fixed the problem.
Not unless I do it again deliberately to piss them off!
MajorClanger said:
I assume the developer has written to you. Reply politely and explain details in full with approx. timings of actions and where they were carried out. Explain that nothing was said to you at the time and that you don't intend to have to do said work again as it was a one off. In light of these facts ask the developer whether they consider your actions to be reasonable and whether the terms of your title extend to the cul-de-sac.
That's the general plan.
MajorClanger said:
Sounds like you've been considerate and reasonable and are using the property within the bounds of what could be reasonably expected....
That's what I thought! So did my wife, who's generally more sensitive to things like that than I am!
MajorClanger said:
By their definition of a nuisance if someone writes to them... you could complain about anything... someone hoovering, using kitchen appliances, watching TV, farting... you name it! They would have to use some discretion over definition of nuisance.
Exackly.
MajorClanger said:
either that or deny everything!!
Too many witnesses!
I'd speak to each and every one of the other neighbours including the complainant and explain that you've had this letter and should any one of them use a powered lawn mower, hammer action drill, you WILL have to report them.
Explain to them all that you need to occasionally do repairs and as you can't afford to pay someone you prefer to do it yourself. Explain you are not running a business, so you feel fairly treated.
Then spell out in a letter to the 'Boss Man' that the noise was no worse that a petrol lawn mower, you don't make a habit of it, and that should you wish occasionally to carry out DIY on car, house or garden, in the middle of the day, you will do so.
Explain that had the complainant asked you to stop, you would have arranged a time when they were out or not on nights to carry out the task.
On a lighter note : I have had an allotment for just over a year and when I got it after 2 years waiting on a list, I found that it was 10 foot deep in weeds and 3 foot deep in water. 8 months on I had a 'Letter of Improvement' from council reminding me of my obligations about weeds etc.
I sent a lovely letter back explaining that despite the flooding (its a winter thing - drys out about easter) I had cleared 1/2 of it already and the grass was actually Italian Rye Grass ( a well known green manure) and the nettles were in fact required for soup. I pointed out that we could arrange a regular time for them to come and help out, when they have nothing better to do. I've had no response.
Explain to them all that you need to occasionally do repairs and as you can't afford to pay someone you prefer to do it yourself. Explain you are not running a business, so you feel fairly treated.
Then spell out in a letter to the 'Boss Man' that the noise was no worse that a petrol lawn mower, you don't make a habit of it, and that should you wish occasionally to carry out DIY on car, house or garden, in the middle of the day, you will do so.
Explain that had the complainant asked you to stop, you would have arranged a time when they were out or not on nights to carry out the task.
On a lighter note : I have had an allotment for just over a year and when I got it after 2 years waiting on a list, I found that it was 10 foot deep in weeds and 3 foot deep in water. 8 months on I had a 'Letter of Improvement' from council reminding me of my obligations about weeds etc.
I sent a lovely letter back explaining that despite the flooding (its a winter thing - drys out about easter) I had cleared 1/2 of it already and the grass was actually Italian Rye Grass ( a well known green manure) and the nettles were in fact required for soup. I pointed out that we could arrange a regular time for them to come and help out, when they have nothing better to do. I've had no response.
Bollocks.
It is not for the Developer or the mad-neighbour to deem what is a nuisance.
The law will do that, under the law of Tort (in England at least) or the equivalent in Scotland. Otherwise you would have every Tom, Dick and Angus complaining that their neighbours ugly face was a nuisance.
Secondly the fact that the neighbour did not approach you whilst you were working suggests this work was not so much of a nuisance, and would only work in your favour should you end up going to court.
The developer appears to be taking what they consider to be the easy-least time consuming route of settling the issue by just trasnferring the problem direct to you hoping you will comply.
Send the letter back with a big 'I disagree and here's why...' note attached.
It is not for the Developer or the mad-neighbour to deem what is a nuisance.
The law will do that, under the law of Tort (in England at least) or the equivalent in Scotland. Otherwise you would have every Tom, Dick and Angus complaining that their neighbours ugly face was a nuisance.
Secondly the fact that the neighbour did not approach you whilst you were working suggests this work was not so much of a nuisance, and would only work in your favour should you end up going to court.
The developer appears to be taking what they consider to be the easy-least time consuming route of settling the issue by just trasnferring the problem direct to you hoping you will comply.
Send the letter back with a big 'I disagree and here's why...' note attached.
I agree with whats being said. Write back to the developer and argue your case. Put up an explanation and full description of what you were doing and why. Explain the frequency, i.e. once. Day off work etc. Noise levels and anything else you can think of.
Tell the developer you believe the neighbour has a personal issue with you and that it should be dealt with in that manner and that they should stay out of it.
Turn the tables on the developer and tell them you deemed the letter to be a nuisance !
To be a total arse to the developer may not work in your favour so be very pleasant, perhaps even offer a meeting in the presence of the neighbour and the developer to resolve the grievance.
Tell the developer you believe the neighbour has a personal issue with you and that it should be dealt with in that manner and that they should stay out of it.
Turn the tables on the developer and tell them you deemed the letter to be a nuisance !
To be a total arse to the developer may not work in your favour so be very pleasant, perhaps even offer a meeting in the presence of the neighbour and the developer to resolve the grievance.
I'd just rise above the whole thing personally, chill out and enjoy the fact that I was clearly a rung above some of my neighbours on the evolutionary scale. Afterall its not like anyone's threatening to evict you or anything is it.. its only a meaningless beaurocratic letter from a jobsworth 
Cheers
Matt.
>> Edited by M@H on Thursday 24th June 15:36
Cheers
Matt.
>> Edited by M@H on Thursday 24th June 15:36
Unfortunately, if you let things lie and make no response, should the situation ever escalate and you end up in the court, the developer or the mad-neighbour will be able to produce a wedge of papers and letters of complaint about your "unruly and antisocial behaviour" yet you will have nothing and appear to not take the situation seriously.
Any court would look unfavourably on you for this, and assume to a certain degree that your lack of response was an acceptance of the accusations made.
Any court would look unfavourably on you for this, and assume to a certain degree that your lack of response was an acceptance of the accusations made.
Similar thing happened to me - some moaning old git complained to the Council that my 4-year-old son had damaged a wee tree (he picked a leaf off it). The Council were our feu superiors so wrote to me and said that this vandalism wouldn't be tolerated.
I laughed. Then I waited.
About 3 years later the Council whacked down about 7 trees behind my front garden. I wrote back with this: www.haggishead.myby.co.uk/complain/trees.html
I copied it to my neighbour. Then I laughed a lot more... so did the council, to be fair. My neighbour moved away.
I laughed. Then I waited.
About 3 years later the Council whacked down about 7 trees behind my front garden. I wrote back with this: www.haggishead.myby.co.uk/complain/trees.html
I copied it to my neighbour. Then I laughed a lot more... so did the council, to be fair. My neighbour moved away.
swilly said:
Unfortunately, if you let things lie and make no response, should the situation ever escalate and you end up in the court.
Oh c'mon.. a bit of perspective here:
"got a letter from the developer saying that since someone has complained, it has been deemed to be a nuisance, so please refrain from doing it again."
This isn't a court summons.. just a bit of pedantic paperwork... its not even from anyone with any legal standing..
Cheers,
Matt
>> Edited by M@H on Thursday 24th June 16:52
tvrgit said:
Similar thing happened to me - some moaning old git complained to the Council that my 4-year-old son had damaged a wee tree (he picked a leaf off it). The Council were our feu superiors so wrote to me and said that this vandalism wouldn't be tolerated.
I laughed. Then I waited.
About 3 years later the Council whacked down about 7 trees behind my front garden. I wrote back with this: www.haggishead.myby.co.uk/complain/trees.html
I copied it to my neighbour. Then I laughed a lot more... so did the council, to be fair. My neighbour moved away.
M@H that's a good part of my natural inclination.
However - assuming our guess as to the writer is correct - it's not the first time she's moaned about us, the previous time was to do with not weeding a flowerbed properly
and the developer said "these people (ie the ones complaining) are pains in my @rse" when calling to say, apologetically, that he "had to" send out the letter.
So I think some response is in order this time. Which will be along the lines of, this isn't a "nuisance", (I discussed this with our local plod, who agreed), I took these precautions to minimise the disturbance, just because one person moaned doesn't make it a disturbance, it's not going to be a regular or frequent occurrence but should the necessity arise again then I may do so ... and hopefully they won't bother replying and we can then forget about it.
However - assuming our guess as to the writer is correct - it's not the first time she's moaned about us, the previous time was to do with not weeding a flowerbed properly
and the developer said "these people (ie the ones complaining) are pains in my @rse" when calling to say, apologetically, that he "had to" send out the letter. So I think some response is in order this time. Which will be along the lines of, this isn't a "nuisance", (I discussed this with our local plod, who agreed), I took these precautions to minimise the disturbance, just because one person moaned doesn't make it a disturbance, it's not going to be a regular or frequent occurrence but should the necessity arise again then I may do so ... and hopefully they won't bother replying and we can then forget about it.
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