Root cause analysis
Discussion
Incident on way home coming home down the A6144 the road between Sale and Partington, rush hour traffic at about 16:30ish to the people who know the route it has 3 cameras in about 2 miles and the limit varies from 40 – 30 - 40mph.
I am sat behind an Alfa that is rigorously sticking to 30mph even though he is now out of the built-up area and the queue of traffic behind is therefore getting ‘sort of pent up’ driving too close looking for chances to overtake. When one clown decides to go for it underestimates the acceleration of a Fiat Brava and fails to overtake all 5 cars entering a blind bend on the wrong side of the road very narrowly missing an oncoming car.
Reason why I am telling you lovely lot about it is that I would like to gauge the opinion of what you would consider to have caused the incident?
Obviously the suicidal clown in the Fiat was the one to ‘blame’
But what was the root cause?
I am sat behind an Alfa that is rigorously sticking to 30mph even though he is now out of the built-up area and the queue of traffic behind is therefore getting ‘sort of pent up’ driving too close looking for chances to overtake. When one clown decides to go for it underestimates the acceleration of a Fiat Brava and fails to overtake all 5 cars entering a blind bend on the wrong side of the road very narrowly missing an oncoming car.
Reason why I am telling you lovely lot about it is that I would like to gauge the opinion of what you would consider to have caused the incident?
Obviously the suicidal clown in the Fiat was the one to ‘blame’
But what was the root cause?
gfun said:
Incident on way home coming home down the A6144 the road between Sale and Partington, rush hour traffic at about 16:30ish to the people who know the route it has 3 cameras in about 2 miles and the limit varies from 40 – 30 - 40mph.
I am sat behind an Alfa that is rigorously sticking to 30mph even though he is now out of the built-up area and the queue of traffic behind is therefore getting ‘sort of pent up’ driving too close looking for chances to overtake. When one clown decides to go for it underestimates the acceleration of a Fiat Brava and fails to overtake all 5 cars entering a blind bend on the wrong side of the road very narrowly missing an oncoming car.
Reason why I am telling you lovely lot about it is that I would like to gauge the opinion of what you would consider to have caused the incident?
Obviously the suicidal clown in the Fiat was the one to ‘blame’
But what was the root cause?
How "root" do you want to go? Can we blame the government for not ensuring a higher standard of training? Or perhaps we can blame the government for making the alfa driver paranoid? Or the camera partnership for the same thing?
It's very hard to properly evaluate the effects of frustration...
At the moment re-reading some stuff about the development of the Polaris submarine and missile systems during the Cold War.
Came across the words of Admiral Rickover who defined what a deterrance system should do which is "strike fear and terror into the heart of the enemy."
Seems to me that the intention is to do exactly the same to motorists, only that the "false alarm rate" was properly established for Polaris and Trident.
Sorry off topic, but relevant I feel.
Came across the words of Admiral Rickover who defined what a deterrance system should do which is "strike fear and terror into the heart of the enemy."
Seems to me that the intention is to do exactly the same to motorists, only that the "false alarm rate" was properly established for Polaris and Trident.
Sorry off topic, but relevant I feel.
gfun said:
Obviously the suicidal clown in the Fiat was the one to ‘blame’
But what was the root cause?
The five cars following the 30mph car for not following the highway code and slowing down whilst being overtaken.
In the event of a crash their failure to adhere to the highway code can be used by the fiat driver to apportion blame onto them.
The 30mph car also is in breach of the highway code for not moving over when a queue of traffic has built behind them so that could also attract some blame.
bluepolarbear said:
Obviously the suicidal clown in the Fiat was the one to ‘blame’
But what was the root cause?
The five cars following the 30mph car for not following the highway code and slowing down whilst being overtaken.
In the event of a crash their failure to adhere to the highway code can be used by the fiat driver to apportion blame onto them.
The 30mph car also is in breach of the highway code for not moving over when a queue of traffic has built behind them so that could also attract some blame.
You have to be careful here blue, everything in the Highway Code isn't RT law. But I have said for years that there should be legislation in place to compell drivers to allow others to overtake, or to have to pull in after there are more than a set number of vehicles behind them.
If you drive in the Highlands in summertime you would realise just how bad this gets; it's a nightmare, and so many of these people don't give a toss about anyone.
Read my post SPEED KILLS-SLOWLY and you'll see what it's like from that.
Can't understand the frustration to be honest.
The near miss is teh responsibility of the overtaking driver as would have bee the collision.
Why get worked up, you'll get there, just a few mins later that's all. Is the risk to you and others really worth it? The answer, when the consequences are considerd, has got to be no.
The near miss is teh responsibility of the overtaking driver as would have bee the collision.
Why get worked up, you'll get there, just a few mins later that's all. Is the risk to you and others really worth it? The answer, when the consequences are considerd, has got to be no.
destroyer said:
Can't understand the frustration to be honest.....
....Why get worked up, you'll get there, just a few mins later that's all.
Following someone/a succession of people doing 25mph, to be on the "safe" side, on 60mph roads all day means you get there around sunrise. If you haven't fallen asleep at the wheel. Most people would find that frustrating!
destroyer said:What is the risk to the nation of everyone falling asleep at the wheel? What is the risk to the economy of it running at half speed? And what effect does that have on, say, funding of the NHS (where more people die accidentally than on the roads)?
Is the risk to you and others really worth it? The answer, when the consequences are considerd, has got to be no.
IOLAIRE said:
[You have to be careful here blue, everything in the Highway Code isn't RT law.
Yes I am aware of that only entries marked MUST relate to a specific law. However failure to follow the code while not illegal in itself can in the event of an accident be used to determine liability and that is in the law. Hence why I commented that if the overtaking driver crashed they could through crinimal or civil procedures make a claim againist all the other drivers as each of them failed to observe the code.
RT
"A failure on the part of a person to observe a provision of the Highway Code shall not of itself render that person liable to criminal proceedings of any kind but any such failure may in any proceedings (whether civil or criminal, and including proceedings for an offence under the Traffic Acts, the [1981 c. 14.] Public Passenger Vehicles Act 1981 or sections 18 to 23 of the [1985 c. 67.] Transport Act 1985) be relied upon by any party to the proceedings as tending to establish or negative any liability which is in question in those proceedings"
bluepolarbear said:
[You have to be careful here blue, everything in the Highway Code isn't RT law.
Yes I am aware of that only entries marked MUST relate to a specific law. However failure to follow the code while not illegal in itself can in the event of an accident be used to determine liability and that is in the law. Hence why I commented that if the overtaking driver crashed they could through crinimal or civil procedures make a claim againist all the other drivers as each of them failed to observe the code.
RT
"A failure on the part of a person to observe a provision of the Highway Code shall not of itself render that person liable to criminal proceedings of any kind but any such failure may in any proceedings (whether civil or criminal, and including proceedings for an offence under the Traffic Acts, the [1981 c. 14.] Public Passenger Vehicles Act 1981 or sections 18 to 23 of the [1985 c. 67.] Transport Act 1985) be relied upon by any party to the proceedings as tending to establish or negative any liability which is in question in those proceedings"
Just to add a little clarity all drivers in the queue hit the brakes hard to allow the clown space to recover.
However I think your argument may be at risk 'well mi lud when I pulled out to overtake the queue of 5 cars I knew that there was a blind bend comming and no gaps between the cars I was overtaking, but thought they all would know the highway code and make some space for me to pull in' Mmmm....
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