Another "problem garage" thread
Discussion
Hello gents, looking for a spot of advice.
I bought a car on January 11th from a small dealer, he advertises on pistonheads, it is an Audi A4 Avant 3.0tdi Quattro.
Within a few days I noticed a problem with the rear wiper, he was informed of this over the phone. He told me to get a price and we will sort something out.
I then emailed him on the 21st stating again the issue with the wiper and how much I had spent as he had requested, I also stated there was a problem with the brakes, the problem was them being quite badly warped and there was quite a bit of juddering under braking. By this point I had only done 400 miles since picking the car up!
I have pasted his reply below:
Hello Ray, sorry to hear of the problems.
Never noticed the brakes, however you have driven it more than me now.
No worries, price it up, and we sort something up.
Obviously, I then replied with prices of a few different options for discs and pads from OE to some middle of the road stuff. A week later there was no reply so I sent him another email, another week went by so I gave him a call, he didn't answer.
In the mean time I bought discs and pads and have had them fitted today. Everything went well... until... " hello sir, that will be £??? this much, o, by the way, did you know you had a broken rear spring, looks like it has been like that for a few months"
Now, I have had a broken spring before and noticed it straight away but I never noticed this at all so was quite shocked.
So, got home and tried phoning said dealer. He answered, well until I said who I was and he then hung up! Have tried calling a few times again tonight but it is just ringing out.
Anybody got any bright ideas on what to do next?
PS, hopefully the above will make sense!
I bought a car on January 11th from a small dealer, he advertises on pistonheads, it is an Audi A4 Avant 3.0tdi Quattro.
Within a few days I noticed a problem with the rear wiper, he was informed of this over the phone. He told me to get a price and we will sort something out.
I then emailed him on the 21st stating again the issue with the wiper and how much I had spent as he had requested, I also stated there was a problem with the brakes, the problem was them being quite badly warped and there was quite a bit of juddering under braking. By this point I had only done 400 miles since picking the car up!
I have pasted his reply below:
Hello Ray, sorry to hear of the problems.
Never noticed the brakes, however you have driven it more than me now.
No worries, price it up, and we sort something up.
Obviously, I then replied with prices of a few different options for discs and pads from OE to some middle of the road stuff. A week later there was no reply so I sent him another email, another week went by so I gave him a call, he didn't answer.
In the mean time I bought discs and pads and have had them fitted today. Everything went well... until... " hello sir, that will be £??? this much, o, by the way, did you know you had a broken rear spring, looks like it has been like that for a few months"
Now, I have had a broken spring before and noticed it straight away but I never noticed this at all so was quite shocked.So, got home and tried phoning said dealer. He answered, well until I said who I was and he then hung up! Have tried calling a few times again tonight but it is just ringing out.
Anybody got any bright ideas on what to do next?
PS, hopefully the above will make sense!
Vaud said:
Let's start with:
Price / condition / age / how was it described?
Price was £7500, 55 plate. Was described as very well looked after example, had 9 service stamps with receipts to back this up.Price / condition / age / how was it described?
Advert came with a link to 55 high definition photos.
When I asked on the phone before buying he said all his cars are given a very thorough check over with everything being checked. (don't have this in writing though)
Do, you think pistonheads can pull up old adds? as the add for this car is not there any more.
It's a shame. Second hand dealer, must accept that things go wrong, and should price accordingly. No point in paying the extra if they are going to fail to sort out clear issues. Sale of goods act would suggest that the brakes should last a reasonable time, before needing attention, and the broken spring is not a reasonable failure, so once he starts ignoring your calls, you are forced to go into writing. Send him a copy of all reasonable invoices, include the other 2 quotes for the work so you can't be accused of profittering, send one letter by recorded delivery and one by recorded postage. (I say that because I had an accountant who blankly refused to take delivery of anything that looked like a demand for payment).
Assuming that there are other hidden issues have it inspected by an independent, perhaps take it for a council run MOT.
Give 28 days for him to settle the bill with you, and then small claims.
Keep record of every attempt you make to contact him. Phone call time and date, plus the emails.
Assuming that there are other hidden issues have it inspected by an independent, perhaps take it for a council run MOT.
Give 28 days for him to settle the bill with you, and then small claims.
Keep record of every attempt you make to contact him. Phone call time and date, plus the emails.
spunky-mon said:
Price was £7500, 55 plate. Was described as very well looked after example, had 9 service stamps with receipts to back this up.
Advert came with a link to 55 high definition photos.
When I asked on the phone before buying he said all his cars are given a very thorough check over with everything being checked. (don't have this in writing though)
Do, you think pistonheads can pull up old adds? as the add for this car is not there any more.
OK. So you might not like this answer.Advert came with a link to 55 high definition photos.
When I asked on the phone before buying he said all his cars are given a very thorough check over with everything being checked. (don't have this in writing though)
Do, you think pistonheads can pull up old adds? as the add for this car is not there any more.
Its a 8ish year old car. They have wear. On the wiper it's probably reasonable to have it fixed, or at least a contribution.
Are you sure the brakes are warped? Or just heavily worn? I only ask warping brakes is hard in a car. Juddering doesn't mean they are warped.
8/9 year old cars should not be viewed as faultless, and a judge would not see to that way either.
Description might be useful. Contact PH via the website feedback or the classifieds adverts for a copy...
New POD said:
It's a shame. Second hand dealer, must accept that things go wrong, and should price accordingly. No point in paying the extra if they are going to fail to sort out clear issues. Sale of goods act would suggest that the brakes should last a reasonable time, before needing attention, and the broken spring is not a reasonable failure, so once he starts ignoring your calls, you are forced to go into writing. Send him a copy of all reasonable invoices, include the other 2 quotes for the work so you can't be accused of profittering, send one letter by recorded delivery and one by recorded postage. (I say that because I had an accountant who blankly refused to take delivery of anything that looked like a demand for payment).
Assuming that there are other hidden issues have it inspected by an independent, perhaps take it for a council run MOT.
Give 28 days for him to settle the bill with you, and then small claims.
Keep record of every attempt you make to contact him. Phone call time and date, plus the emails.
Cheers POD, very helpful answer. Assuming that there are other hidden issues have it inspected by an independent, perhaps take it for a council run MOT.
Give 28 days for him to settle the bill with you, and then small claims.
Keep record of every attempt you make to contact him. Phone call time and date, plus the emails.
Vaud said:
OK. So you might not like this answer.
Its a 8ish year old car. They have wear. On the wiper it's probably reasonable to have it fixed, or at least a contribution.
Are you sure the brakes are warped? Or just heavily worn? I only ask warping brakes is hard in a car. Juddering doesn't mean they are warped.
8/9 year old cars should not be viewed as faultless, and a judge would not see to that way either.
Description might be useful. Contact PH via the website feedback or the classifieds adverts for a copy...
Don't get me wrong, I know it's not a brand new car but for only owning the car a month I wouldn't be expecting these problems. I would have thought if the car had been properly inspected (as I had been told) then these issues would have been highlighted at least and the price could have been negotiated or worse case I wouldn't have bought it. Even being told about the pads being low, discs could do with changing, etc. Its a 8ish year old car. They have wear. On the wiper it's probably reasonable to have it fixed, or at least a contribution.
Are you sure the brakes are warped? Or just heavily worn? I only ask warping brakes is hard in a car. Juddering doesn't mean they are warped.
8/9 year old cars should not be viewed as faultless, and a judge would not see to that way either.
Description might be useful. Contact PH via the website feedback or the classifieds adverts for a copy...
I will get a picture of the discs tomorrow once I drop the car at the garage, I just had a quick glance when I picked the car up as I was in a bit of a rush.
Hora - I was all set for him coming back and either saying he wasn't willing to do anything or even offering a few ££ towards the costs and I would have accepted this, but the way he has acted now has just annoyed me, plus this was before the broken spring!
He still doesn't know about the spring as he hung up before I could say anything. I will be sending an email tomorrow highlighting this issue and if he had actually inspected the car this should have been noticed.
The garage that fitted my new brakes are willing to write a report regarding the spring and how long they think it has been broken, they think at least a few months, probably longer.
To me, the broken spring is a major safety issue and if this doesn't wake him up a bit then I have no choice but to take it further!
Vaud said:
spunky-mon said:
Price was £7500, 55 plate. Was described as very well looked after example, had 9 service stamps with receipts to back this up.
Advert came with a link to 55 high definition photos.
When I asked on the phone before buying he said all his cars are given a very thorough check over with everything being checked. (don't have this in writing though)
Do, you think pistonheads can pull up old adds? as the add for this car is not there any more.
OK. So you might not like this answer.Advert came with a link to 55 high definition photos.
When I asked on the phone before buying he said all his cars are given a very thorough check over with everything being checked. (don't have this in writing though)
Do, you think pistonheads can pull up old adds? as the add for this car is not there any more.
Its a 8ish year old car. They have wear. On the wiper it's probably reasonable to have it fixed, or at least a contribution.
Are you sure the brakes are warped? Or just heavily worn? I only ask warping brakes is hard in a car. Juddering doesn't mean they are warped.
8/9 year old cars should not be viewed as faultless, and a judge would not see to that way either.
Description might be useful. Contact PH via the website feedback or the classifieds adverts for a copy...
Butter Face said:
Going ahead with repairs before agreeing them with him won't help you IMO.
Hope they do sort it for you.
I realise this but circumstances don't allow me to wait. I use the car everyday and don't really want to be running on a broken spring, the other half was also moaning about the children being in the car with the brakes the way they were. Hope they do sort it for you.
I should probably say, the dealer is about 90 miles away from me so I cant exactly pop round, he wouldn't be let near the car again anyway!
I have just tried phoning him but as soon I say who I am his phone must loose signal....funny that....
Have sent an email and a txt message stating the facts and giving him 24hrs to at least respond and acknowledge the problem before I take it further.
Is it worth phoning trading standards? Or should I wait before I do that?
Will see what happens, if no reply then will send him invoices for everything and give him a month, then small claims!
The response from said person:
You will receive an email this evening, but you can forget the spring, no proof it has not just happened. You have a good mechanical warranty, that's it, not Carte Blanche. Both items are consumables not mechanical. I will make you an offer, you either accept, or don't, I would not waste your time with legalities, I am emigrating in November.
Thoughts please?
You will receive an email this evening, but you can forget the spring, no proof it has not just happened. You have a good mechanical warranty, that's it, not Carte Blanche. Both items are consumables not mechanical. I will make you an offer, you either accept, or don't, I would not waste your time with legalities, I am emigrating in November.
Thoughts please?
spunky-mon said:
Now, I have had a broken spring before and noticed it straight away but I never noticed this at all so was quite shocked.
Had this on our TT last year - failed the MoT last Feb. Was totally unnoticeable as it was broken in the seat area, I guess it's likely that this was your problem. Probably more noticeable if it's in the middle!spunky-mon said:
The response from said person:
You will receive an email this evening, but you can forget the spring, no proof it has not just happened. You have a good mechanical warranty, that's it, not Carte Blanche. Both items are consumables not mechanical. I will make you an offer, you either accept, or don't, I would not waste your time with legalities, I am emigrating in November.
Thoughts please?
Brake pads are a consumable, if that is the fault.You will receive an email this evening, but you can forget the spring, no proof it has not just happened. You have a good mechanical warranty, that's it, not Carte Blanche. Both items are consumables not mechanical. I will make you an offer, you either accept, or don't, I would not waste your time with legalities, I am emigrating in November.
Thoughts please?
A wiper blade is a consumable, a wiper motor is not, but it may be fair wear and tear that a warranty excludes.
Spring is not a consumable in my view - but it is a part subject to significant wear and tear.
Small claims, etc are only worth doing if you think there is a realistic chance of recovering the money. Look at his offer and then decide, but for the likely costs (spring, etc) it's probably worth accepting his offer and moving on and treating it like a private sale. 8 months to go through SCC is possible - but then he can easily stall for a while. If he is out of the country you have 0 chance of recovery of a small amount of money.
Sadly he sounds like a shark. His thorough inspection is probably as effective as his warranty - worth the paper it is written on.
IainT said:
Had this on our TT last year - failed the MoT last Feb. Was totally unnoticeable as it was broken in the seat area, I guess it's likely that this was your problem. Probably more noticeable if it's in the middle!
Yep, highly likely he would not know about the spring, often where the spring brake its hidden away and you wont see it or notice it, sometimes they even get missed at MOT time. Brake judder might be a big lip on the front disks.
Did you check for this on test drive and did you look at the disks and feel for a lip?
Its a used car so it wont have new brakes unless agreed at point of sale.
Work out a deal for some money back, the more the merrier and move on.
but having the mileage will firm up what he's suggesting and help us give more specific advice for yur situation 
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