Car written off after non-fault accident - unfair valuation
Discussion
I was involved in a non-fault accident a little while back and instructed an accident management company. At present the valuation their engineers have placed on my vehicle is slightly lower than the retail guide price. I'm arguing that my car is worth more than the retail guide price because it has FSH (not required for cars over 6 years old at the guide price), was in very good condition all round before the accident, has been very well maintained and has a better spec than most of the similar cars for sale. It's also had a recent service, MOT with no advisories and is not yet due a cambelt change.
I've provided evidence of the history & recent maintenance to them. Finding examples of similar cars is difficult as adverts are always lacking information and examples as good as mine rarely come up for sale. There have been a few that look in similar condition from the adverts and are advertised as having FSH but they have dismissed these and just sent examples of cheaper cars which will almost certainly be inferior to mine. I've viewed 4 cars of the same model and sent them the adverts and detailed the reasons why those cars are not up to the standard mine was before the accident. I even viewed one of the examples the engineers sent me and it had unrecorded, badly repaired front end accident damage.
Has anyone used an AMC and successfully obtained a valuation higher than the guide prices say? If so, how did you do it?!
Has anyone been in a similar situation and gone down a different route? (i.e. using your own insurers, contacting the at-fault insurers directly, paying for your own inspection/valuation)
I've provided evidence of the history & recent maintenance to them. Finding examples of similar cars is difficult as adverts are always lacking information and examples as good as mine rarely come up for sale. There have been a few that look in similar condition from the adverts and are advertised as having FSH but they have dismissed these and just sent examples of cheaper cars which will almost certainly be inferior to mine. I've viewed 4 cars of the same model and sent them the adverts and detailed the reasons why those cars are not up to the standard mine was before the accident. I even viewed one of the examples the engineers sent me and it had unrecorded, badly repaired front end accident damage.
Has anyone used an AMC and successfully obtained a valuation higher than the guide prices say? If so, how did you do it?!
Has anyone been in a similar situation and gone down a different route? (i.e. using your own insurers, contacting the at-fault insurers directly, paying for your own inspection/valuation)
yes, my old car was possibly the highest specced car of its type in the country....all of which had been disclosed when obtaining my insurance policy.
After finding a couple of lesser specced cars still priced at more than their valuation and shwoing them a glases valuation of my vehicle the engineer adjusted their figures to suit, the third party insurer ( funnily enough also my insurer!) argued over the last £500 of the valuation, but ended up paying in full when they realised that I wouldnt accept it being undervalued to that extent.. after they sent cheques out as payment and I refused to cash them.
After finding a couple of lesser specced cars still priced at more than their valuation and shwoing them a glases valuation of my vehicle the engineer adjusted their figures to suit, the third party insurer ( funnily enough also my insurer!) argued over the last £500 of the valuation, but ended up paying in full when they realised that I wouldnt accept it being undervalued to that extent.. after they sent cheques out as payment and I refused to cash them.
catman said:
I'm missing something here. The AMC are acting for you, but are trying to beat you down on the valuation?
Surely, they should be trying to get the maximum possible from the at-fault Insurers?
The AMC will normally process a write off in a similar way to an insurer eg they employ an engineer to calculate the value of a car as they have to demonstrate they have acted fairly and arrived at a true reflection of the value of the car. If they don't then the other Insurer will not agree the settlement figureSurely, they should be trying to get the maximum possible from the at-fault Insurers?
OP You need to take into account that the Ombudsman (as do Insurers) tend to regard advertisements as the starting price the seller is willing to start negotiating from. So if you have adverts at £5k it does not necessarily mean the car is worth £5k as the final selling price may be nearer £4600.
Bear in mind that if your dealing with an AMC rather than your own Insurer then you don't have access to the Ombudsman
Bear in mind that if your dealing with an AMC rather than your own Insurer then you don't have access to the Ombudsman
hedgefinder said:
yes, my old car was possibly the highest specced car of its type in the country....all of which had been disclosed when obtaining my insurance policy.
After finding a couple of lesser specced cars still priced at more than their valuation and shwoing them a glases valuation of my vehicle the engineer adjusted their figures to suit, the third party insurer ( funnily enough also my insurer!) argued over the last £500 of the valuation, but ended up paying in full when they realised that I wouldnt accept it being undervalued to that extent.. after they sent cheques out as payment and I refused to cash them.
Did you get what the Glass's guide said or more than that because of the spec?After finding a couple of lesser specced cars still priced at more than their valuation and shwoing them a glases valuation of my vehicle the engineer adjusted their figures to suit, the third party insurer ( funnily enough also my insurer!) argued over the last £500 of the valuation, but ended up paying in full when they realised that I wouldnt accept it being undervalued to that extent.. after they sent cheques out as payment and I refused to cash them.
dacouch said:
OP You need to take into account that the Ombudsman (as do Insurers) tend to regard advertisements as the starting price the seller is willing to start negotiating from. So if you have adverts at £5k it does not necessarily mean the car is worth £5k as the final selling price may be nearer £4600.
Bear in mind that if your dealing with an AMC rather than your own Insurer then you don't have access to the Ombudsman
Yep I have taken that into account. Finding adverts for similar cars is of limited use without actually viewing the cars. A lot of adverts for cars of this age describe them as good condition, very good condition etc. but more often than not they're in average condition. I've also seen cars advertised as having a full service history but they actually have gaps in the history and/or are overdue a service or cambelt change.Bear in mind that if your dealing with an AMC rather than your own Insurer then you don't have access to the Ombudsman
My car has done more miles than a lot of the cars in a similar condition so it's difficult to find adverts for cars that support my case. As cars get older the numbers of good ones will dwindle and most of them will be average/below average and skew the guide prices down.
http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications...
The fact that the accident wasn't your fault doesn't effect the market value of your car.
The fact that it has been serviced in line with the manufacturers guides doesn't make it worth any more either - its maintenance required to keep it on the road.
The specification may well make a difference, but the FOS note above should detail everything you need to know.
An accident management company will only value your car at what they think they can get back from the at fault insurer - which is the same as your own insurer, and by playing the system you will not be mitigating your losses, which means the fault insurer are more likely to question the amounts, and you may lose out when it comes to the credit repair agreement you sign with them!
The fact that the accident wasn't your fault doesn't effect the market value of your car.
The fact that it has been serviced in line with the manufacturers guides doesn't make it worth any more either - its maintenance required to keep it on the road.
The specification may well make a difference, but the FOS note above should detail everything you need to know.
An accident management company will only value your car at what they think they can get back from the at fault insurer - which is the same as your own insurer, and by playing the system you will not be mitigating your losses, which means the fault insurer are more likely to question the amounts, and you may lose out when it comes to the credit repair agreement you sign with them!
TypeRTom said:
Yep I have taken that into account. Finding adverts for similar cars is of limited use without actually viewing the cars. A lot of adverts for cars of this age describe them as good condition, very good condition etc. but more often than not they're in average condition. I've also seen cars advertised as having a full service history but they actually have gaps in the history and/or are overdue a service or cambelt change.
My car has done more miles than a lot of the cars in a similar condition so it's difficult to find adverts for cars that support my case. As cars get older the numbers of good ones will dwindle and most of them will be average/below average and skew the guide prices down.
the proper glasses guide has a standard valuation and also the ption to include higher specor ptional extras which increases the valuation.My car has done more miles than a lot of the cars in a similar condition so it's difficult to find adverts for cars that support my case. As cars get older the numbers of good ones will dwindle and most of them will be average/below average and skew the guide prices down.
I ended up getting basically what a lesser spec car was advertised for, but much more inline with the glass guide cnsidering spec. if that makes sense...
Interesting, I think the book value for my at is £700, the price I feel confident I could get if I sold it tomorrow is £2000, and the value to me (considering what I have spent on it) is around £7,000.
I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
Dammit said:
Interesting, I think the book value for my at is £700, the price I feel confident I could get if I sold it tomorrow is £2000, and the value to me (considering what I have spent on it) is around £7,000.
I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
Would it not be worth getting agreed-value insurance on a car like that?I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
Dammit said:
Interesting, I think the book value for my at is £700, the price I feel confident I could get if I sold it tomorrow is £2000, and the value to me (considering what I have spent on it) is around £7,000.
They'll offer you the £700 figure. You can argue, probably prove, and end up somewhere around the £2,000 figure. The £7,000 is just an utter irrelevance.Anyone who has a car that is significantly different from the average should seriously consider agreed value policies.
This will preclude many policies that are available from comparison sights and are unlikely to be as cheap of the very cheapest.
You can then weigh up whether it is worth paying any extra.
This will preclude many policies that are available from comparison sights and are unlikely to be as cheap of the very cheapest.
You can then weigh up whether it is worth paying any extra.
TypeRTom said:
I was involved in a non-fault accident a little while back and instructed an accident management company. At present the valuation their engineers have placed on my vehicle is slightly lower than the retail guide price. I'm arguing that my car is worth more than the retail guide price because it has FSH (not required for cars over 6 years old at the guide price), was in very good condition all round before the accident, has been very well maintained and has a better spec than most of the similar cars for sale. It's also had a recent service, MOT with no advisories and is not yet due a cambelt change.
I've provided evidence of the history & recent maintenance to them. Finding examples of similar cars is difficult as adverts are always lacking information and examples as good as mine rarely come up for sale. There have been a few that look in similar condition from the adverts and are advertised as having FSH but they have dismissed these and just sent examples of cheaper cars which will almost certainly be inferior to mine. I've viewed 4 cars of the same model and sent them the adverts and detailed the reasons why those cars are not up to the standard mine was before the accident. I even viewed one of the examples the engineers sent me and it had unrecorded, badly repaired front end accident damage.
Has anyone used an AMC and successfully obtained a valuation higher than the guide prices say? If so, how did you do it?!
Has anyone been in a similar situation and gone down a different route? (i.e. using your own insurers, contacting the at-fault insurers directly, paying for your own inspection/valuation)
I had a similar situation when a car of mine got stolen of the forecourt where it was being serviced. The valuation of the car was nowhere near what I thought it was worth. What I did is to get the garage to do a valuation of the car, sent this through and was settled in full. Do you have a garage that serviced the car that could do this for you? THT I've provided evidence of the history & recent maintenance to them. Finding examples of similar cars is difficult as adverts are always lacking information and examples as good as mine rarely come up for sale. There have been a few that look in similar condition from the adverts and are advertised as having FSH but they have dismissed these and just sent examples of cheaper cars which will almost certainly be inferior to mine. I've viewed 4 cars of the same model and sent them the adverts and detailed the reasons why those cars are not up to the standard mine was before the accident. I even viewed one of the examples the engineers sent me and it had unrecorded, badly repaired front end accident damage.
Has anyone used an AMC and successfully obtained a valuation higher than the guide prices say? If so, how did you do it?!
Has anyone been in a similar situation and gone down a different route? (i.e. using your own insurers, contacting the at-fault insurers directly, paying for your own inspection/valuation)
Ah it was different in the old days (well not really). But I remember a pleasant surprise when in 1992 my beautiful mint Capri was totalled by a blind idiot in a Van.
When the assessor from my insurance company checked the car over and phoned me to say it was a write off he said that although the nearside was f
ked, the offside showed it to be a particularly good example so he offered 400 more than the book price.
Bit his hand off and went and bought another even better one.
When the assessor from my insurance company checked the car over and phoned me to say it was a write off he said that although the nearside was f
ked, the offside showed it to be a particularly good example so he offered 400 more than the book price. Bit his hand off and went and bought another even better one.
Dammit said:
Interesting, I think the book value for my at is £700, the price I feel confident I could get if I sold it tomorrow is £2000, and the value to me (considering what I have spent on it) is around £7,000.
I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
Washing the car with glue and ram raiding Halfords does not count as adding value I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
dacouch said:
OP You need to take into account that the Ombudsman (as do Insurers) tend to regard advertisements as the starting price the seller is willing to start negotiating from.
Actually, they don't take adverts into consideration at all. At least they wouldn't when I was in a similar position to the OP. The Ombudsman simply stated that the valuation from my insurer was fair as it was close to the Glasses and GAP guide prices, despite it being around 60% of the actual value based on actual cars for sale at the time.Unfortunately, in the event of a total loss, there seems to be no requirement for an insurer to put you back into the position you were in prior to the accident and, as such, will end up out of pocket.
turbobloke said:
Dammit said:
Interesting, I think the book value for my at is £700, the price I feel confident I could get if I sold it tomorrow is £2000, and the value to me (considering what I have spent on it) is around £7,000.
I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
Would it not be worth getting agreed-value insurance on a car like that?I'm guessing I'd get £700 back if someone wrote it off due to no fault of mine, rather than an equivalent (highly modified) vehicle?
mrmr96 said:
Who does agreed value insurance on "modern" cars? I called my broker about it and he said it was only available on cars >25 years with his panel of insurers.
Chubb or Hiscox if you also take Home Insurance with them but you need to be pretty affluent to be able to afford it.Comprehensive driving other cars for all named drivers is a handy extra
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